CZ 858 Gremlin Trigger issue with the latest batch of CZ 858's from Wolverine.

[saltednutz]

And a quick search on this forum will show that the cz858 dont have much issue . but the csa one got lots of thread about problem like overgazed system . Bolt carrier cracking . Bolt breaking . Rifle not feeding . After market part not fitting .

The .223 ones.

Not the 7.62x39

[joe n]

exactly!

The .223 ones.

Not the 7.62x39

[Slamfyre]

The CSA bolt carriers are tabbed and will work great in a 858 , there was a guy on CGN some years back welding tabs on for people, i sent him my carriers and he did a great job . wonder if hes still on here , i forget his name?

I'm having mine tabbed at one of my local gunsmiths, http://www.bitsofpieces.com/, I saw he had a tabbed bolt in a desk and asked him to tab mine.

My gremlin appeared at around 250 rounds. It showed up infrequently, at a rate of 1 or 2 per every 100 rnds. So at 250 rnds, I cut a shim from a 9mm case. Gremlin did not appear for about 400 rnds after that. Then it appeared once again infrequently. I opted not to bend the spring up because I read somewhere that it'll reduce the likelihood of the gremlin at the expense of increasing trigger pull. I also read somewhere that tabbing is a pretty definitive fix that does not increase trigger pull.

[andrew3081]

I'll second that Dad. I don't understand how people are getting so butt hurt about such a small issue that's so easy to fix. Sure CZ should have done it themselves, shame on them for that. But once that preventative or corrective step is taken the CZ's go forever. I have one with a ton of rounds through it. Doesn't NEA have one with 10's of thousands of rounds without issue?
If you think the CSA's are of better build quality, you live in a different universe. From what I've seen they have fixed their problems now, but they had many for a time.

Easy fix that the manufacture is not willing to correct. That says a lot.
Everyone has their own opinions but the fact is that CSA rifles are made brand new while CZ rifles are made from surplus (not new) parts.

[Slamfyre]

Could the situation be analogous to M14s? CZ 858 is to CSA VZ58 as Springfield Gov't Armory M14 (semi only) is to Springfield Armory Inc. M1A.

Some people seek and value M14 GI parts over and above SAI M1A parts. Example, GI receiver is forged. SAI receiver is investment cast. Similarly, I've read of heat treatment failures in some CSA VZ58 receivers, but I haven't heard of any soft CZ858 receivers. Perhaps the military manufacturing process had better quality control procedures in place when it came to heat treating receivers...

[serg777]

I never understood all this CZ hype, like CZ is better than CSA, people lining up for the "last batch of CZ rifles", "last shipment of CZ magazines" or "wood sets while quantities last" etc.

Both CSA and CZ have their own long run issues and that's because both factories took perfectly engineered and military tested full auto sample and did some quick changes on the lap to make it legally suitable for the area or some other civil variations as per market demands. Longer barrel - and you have over-gas, remove full-auto - gremlin. With proper R&D and QA those problems should be easily addressed to begin with. At least CSA has a smoother machining and finish, better warranty; chrome lined is also a good option to choose. May be my problem is that I just fail to see a charm of gray spray paint and wood chips blended into bakelite?

[Slamfyre]

I personally do not like beaver barf and the cummins engine paint. Aesthetics were a factor that kept me away from these back in 2005/2008. In my eyes they just looked like a thinner, flimsier AK with weird angles and curves, cheap wannabe wood and a pistol grip that looked like it was designed for midgets. When I bought it, my 858 was already bubba'd up with fab defense furniture. There have been many times that I've been tempted to bubba it up even more by painting it with a riptile camo pattern. But the paint in mine, as ugly as it is, is near 100% condition and it does not seem to want to chip away or degrade with use... It is resilient. For now I'm holding my horses until it wears and tears a little more. All that said, I'm happy to kill the gremlin by my own means and would much rather deal with the ugliness of the paint than face a soft receiver that was not properly heat treated.

[serg777]

I personally do not like beaver barf and the cummins engine paint. Aesthetics were a factor that kept me away from these back in 2005/2008. In my eyes they just looked like a thinner, flimsier AK with weird angles and curves, cheap wannabe wood and a pistol grip that looked like it was designed for midgets. When I bought it, my 858 was already bubba'd up with fab defense furniture. There have been many times that I've been tempted to bubba it up even more by painting it with a riptile camo pattern. But the paint in mine, as ugly as it is, is near 100% condition and it does not seem to want to chip away or degrade with use... It is resilient. For now I'm holding my horses until it wears and tears a little more. All that said, I'm happy to kill the gremlin by my own means and would much rather deal with the ugliness of the paint than face a soft receiver that was not properly heat treated.

I've heard of soft receiver problem regarding some US-made models. Is CSA known for that as well?

[JDForBrkFst]

Easy fix that the manufacture is not willing to correct. That says a lot.
Everyone has their own opinions but the fact is that CSA rifles are made brand new while CZ rifles are made from surplus (not new) parts.

And the fact is they have a number of QA issues, most that can't be fixed by the end user. Brand loyalty as far as the manufacturer supporting their product, CSA wins hands down. But with the only issue being an easy end user fix and followed up with excellent support from Wolverine makes it the easy choice for me.

[Slamfyre]

I've heard of soft receiver problem regarding some US-made models. Is CSA known for that as well?

I can't seem to find it here in CGN, but I do recall reading a thread and seeing a picture where the receiver rail ends were mushroomed. The conclusions where a poor heat treatment. I remember that I even went to check my own rail status to see if I could spot any indication of a soft receiver in mine. The image was similar to the one found in this thread, but the rail ends where noticeable more deformed.

On the same note, while browsing CGN Red Rifles forum for the thread, it seemed to me that there were many more non-gremlin problem threads for CSA than for CZ.