T97A Final Verdict?

[blaxsun]

What was the disposition of the rifles and magazines?

80 wooden crates, each containing ten T97A's and fifty magazines for a total of 800 firearms and 4,000 magazines.

[Kveldulf]

Okay, I'm talking out of my a$$ here -- I have no knowledge of the T97 other than what I just read in the legal report -- but what it looks like to me is that Norinco (or whichever manufacturer Norinco bought these from) chose the easiest, cheapest way to try to make these guns semi only. They (probably) just manufactured side plates without a full-auto position for the selector switch and left all the "good" parts fully functional inside.

As for the magazines, they claimed to have welded in spacers but just threw them in loose.

Norinco screwed the pooch, big time.

We can't complain about the Tribunal's fairness: they agreed to consider magazines and rifles separately and refused CBSA's request to have Dr. Smith's testimony presented in camera.

[xdmer]

They never paid for anything, unless this preorder worked different than all the others.

They just take your CC info ahead of time, and charge you when they actually are shipping the gun to you. If the guns never show up, or there is some other problem, you're not charged.

That's correct in the case of my pre-order. Nothing charged ... just reserving funds on my end.

[dagtaph]

Notice that there is no mention of the rifle functionality after the "modification" with "a spring, a paper clip and a popsicle stick". I bet you it will never fire in full auto, more over the famous popsicle would have jammed the internals and the rifle would have stopped functioning all together. But the way law works, i am sure that there was the requirement to show the possibility of a "modification" to full auto, but not the requirement to show that it will "function" with those modifications. Canadaammo was in a very difficult situation. It was an uphill battle for them.

[xdmer]

They never paid for anything, unless this preorder worked different than all the others.

They just take your CC info ahead of time, and charge you when they actually are shipping the gun to you. If the guns never show up, or there is some other problem, you're not charged.

Notice that there is no mention of the rifle functionality after the "modification" with "a spring, a paper clip and a popsicle stick". I bet you it will never fire in full auto, more over the famous popsicle would have jammed the internals and the rifle would have stopped functioning all together. But the way law works, i am sure that there was the requirement to show the possibility of a "modification" to full auto, but not the requirement to show that it will "function" with those modifications. Canadaammo was in a very difficult situation. It was an uphill battle for them.

For sure, but since you can still pre-order, I wonder if there is something still happening on this front. Otherwise it's false hope.

[CanAm]

Old info guys. If you want to read the transcript I have it.

The published public ruling leaves a huge amount out.

I suggest going over the old threads, I will not go through it all again here.

One point re: the SKS. Our law, Hasselwander, et al requires a comparison be made, so it was made, with the most common semi-auto guns in the country.

Finally, this was just the CITT, not a court. No where near final.

I suggest reading the other T97 thread with recent activity for the latest info.

If you want to stop relying on the FRT, previous imports, etc and open cans of worms, we can. As it stands, importers must rely on the FRT, for good or bad, correct or not. We cannot make our own judgements prior to importation.

[CanAm]

First I've heard of this. Popsicle stick or paper clip... interesting (that's more than they divulged in the other T97 case).

FYI this does not apply to the T97. One example where the CITT member lost his way/forgot/did not care to know. It was discussed in regards to the SKS and other guns, not the T97. His ruling was incorrect on several recollections like this.

PS The way guns are reviewed is expected to change soon, which will be good for most cases, but bad for some misclassified in our favour, I suspect ( i.e. can of worms above)

Of course all this will be moot if the CPC changes/removes/rewrites etc. the prohib list.

[P12]

The question is now - if those rifles modified to the satisfaction of RCMP can they be imported again?

I'd like to know that to.

[CanAm]

you cannot modify the existing guns into compliance once built, you must make new guns. This was discussed in the recent T97 thread in our forum. As I said, either way, new guns will be coming in for sale.

[xdmer]

you cannot modify the existing guns into compliance once built, you must make new guns. This was discussed in the recent T97 thread in our forum. As I said, either way, new guns will be coming in for sale.

Very glad to hear it. I did sample the old threads and sticky, but didn't read every post and missed any reference to new guns. It`s old info yes, but it`s also been nearly a year from when the thread was closed.

Thanks!