My SMLE Mk III * - Pics

TehGunky

TehGunky

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I went into the shop thinking to get an inexpensive pump shotgun to take care of a backyard pest. Then I saw this, fell instantly in love and bought it instead. I've wanted a wartime Lee Enfield with the full military stock ever since I knew what one was. It was on consignment for $400 - that seems like a very decent price to me.

Advice, recommendations and any other helpful tips on care & feeding, maintenance and where to get accessories is welcome.

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Came with the sling, which is as rugged and ancient as the rest of the rifle. Looks absolutely gorgeous to me. The bolt is not original to the rifle - I imagine this is the likely reason for the seemingly low cost, because everything else looks pretty great.

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Could use a bayonet. Haven't shopped around for those yet, but I fear they will be dismayingly pricey.

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It's a bit dirty and there is some slight rust in a few spots. I want to clean out the grime, but I want to keep the amazing patina. Will a layer of oil do the job, or do I need to remove the rust before it eats away the whole gun?

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Wristguard markings show it was made in 1918 in the Birmingham factory, making it 96 years old. The buttstock is a little bit loose; the guy in the shop believes that all that is needed is to remove the buttplate and tighten a bolt inside. Is this accurate, or is there more involved?

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This thing has seen some action. The trapdoor is in good shape, stays firmly shut when closed. The oiler is heavy brass, and the applicator is a little rusty. Again, I want to preserve the condition, so I will just apply a layer of thick oil to the applicator... or fill the brass bottle.

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Buttstock has been repaired. I believe those are armory refurbish marks, indicating that the repair was done by the armory, but I could be mistaken.

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The underside of the stock just forward of the ring. Dinged up from use. The salesman figured they were "kill count" notches, but they look to me like marks that might have been made either during transport or while setting the rifle on a rough ledge to aim at enemy soldiers. Either way, they add to the overall character of the gun for me.

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Not a great picture, but the bore is in good shape. It's dirty and needs cleaning, like the rest of the rifle, but the rifling looks really clean, there's no obvious pitting and the lands have a solid shine.

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16 bucks worth of ammo stuffed into the magazine. She won't be cheap to shoot unless I get into reloading, and even then I'm looking at a fairly serious equipment investment.

I bought the rifle to shoot it. Other than cost, is there anything I need to know or look for before I take it to a range? Everything looks to be in good working order and I can't wait to take it to the range and blast $30 downrange with it.
 
nice rifle good score,you will have lots of fun shooting it they are great rifles .Befour you tighten the butt stock you should remove the fore end wood as the stock bolt as a square end that fits into a metal retainer at the very rear of the fore end that prevents the bolt from turning
 
woodchopper said:
sling is on backwards

and don't try to tignten the butt stock bolt without taking off the forestock you'll crack it.
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Interesting. The sling was on when I got it, and has apparently been slung backwards for many, many years - the buckle rings have made deep, dark brown marks on the ancient canvas.

I'm going to need to find some YouTube videos or something to figure out how to do a full takedown and cleaning.
 
Nice rifle.

Loves salesmen with their stories. Stock dings as kill counts, or bayonet stained blades as being blood. Even flags with holes being make by gun shots instead of moths.

Enjoy your new rifle.

Cheers.
 
TehGunky said:
Interesting. The sling was on when I got it, and has apparently been slung backwards for many, many years - the buckle rings have made deep, dark brown marks on the ancient canvas.

I'm going to need to find some YouTube videos or something to figure out how to do a full takedown and cleaning.
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Gorgeous rifle, and switching the sling takes a minute. May I suggest you take it to the range before you do a "full takedown"? It may well be a shooter as is, and taking it all apart might well screw that up. Also, you're going to find that unless you're rich, you'll be reloading, so try the "o-ring trick" before you shoot those factory rounds, and save your brass!

Search this forum for details on the o-ring thing.
 
TehGunky said:
Interesting. The sling was on when I got it, and has apparently been slung backwards for many, many years - the buckle rings have made deep, dark brown marks on the ancient canvas.

I'm going to need to find some YouTube videos or something to figure out how to do a full takedown and cleaning.
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The buckle rings go open side out instead of in. If the sling stays that way the open parts if the rings will ding the stock. No biggie.

The buttstock is held by a large by a large flat head screw, you can see the head by shining a flashlight down the trapdoor in the buttplate.

The end of the screw protrudes through the wrist of the reciever (same part stamped 1918 BSA) and is squared off at the end. That squared end fits tight into a corresponding square notch in the forestock. If you turn the bolt, the forend will split and you will have accuracy issues after.

Nice score, hope you get years of enjoyment out of her!!
 
stevebc said:
Gorgeous rifle, and switching the sling takes a minute. May I suggest you take it to the range before you do a "full takedown"? It may well be a shooter as is, and taking it all apart might well screw that up. Also, you're going to find that unless you're rich, you'll be reloading, so try the "o-ring trick" before you shoot those factory rounds, and save your brass!

Search this forum for details on the o-ring thing.
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I want to. I really, really want to. But I'm hesitant about firing it with a loose buttstock. It's my understanding that the SMLE has a hearty recoil and I don't want to damage it. I may have overstated my goals when speaking of a "full takedown" - I only mean removing the wood parts so I can clean and oil the metal.

I found out I have a friend who has the stuff for reloading .303 British. I was absolutely going to save the brass anyway - buck-sixty a shot, you bet your ass I'm saving it - so that has the potential to work out well.

That's a solid tip about the o-ring trick. Where do I get the o-rings?


Tinman204 said:
The buckle rings go open side out instead of in. If the sling stays that way the open parts if the rings will ding the stock. No biggie.

The buttstock is held by a large by a large flat head screw, you can see the head by shining a flashlight down the trapdoor in the buttplate.

The end of the screw protrudes through the wrist of the reciever (same part stamped 1918 BSA) and is squared off at the end. That squared end fits tight into a corresponding square notch in the forestock. If you turn the bolt, the forend will split and you will have accuracy issues after.

Nice score, hope you get years of enjoyment out of her!!
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Thanks, that's really helpful to know!
 
TehGunky said:
That's a solid tip about the o-ring trick. Where do I get the o-rings?
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Use cheapy hair elastics (the tiny rubber band style) from the dollar store for the o-ring trick.

Kudos to you for choosing not to fire this beauty until you get the loose buttstock sorted out. There's ways of making them fit tight again, I'll let the real experts chime in on that however. Louthepou should be along shortly to assist! :D
 
Very nice. Methinks you are the owner of a former Royal Canadian Navy-issued SMLE (or at least the buttstock from a navy rifle). The C^N is an RCN marking (there's a picture of my so-marked Colt New Service below) Other markings on the wood, or receiver/barrel - specifically C-broad arrow? More pictures please.

 
OP, the recoil of an Smle isn't too bad. I'd rate it in between a 30-30 and a 7.62x54r. It's there but it's not what I would call "stout".

As for shooting it with the loose buttstock. The buttstock of an Smle must be snug and fit the wrist socket tightly or you will find that the rifle may tend to throw bullets right and left. I have a no4 here that was terribly in accurate when I first got it. An oldtimer on this forum told me to check the butt fitment. The butt was indeed loose, a paper shim fixed her right up.

A YouTube search for a channel called "enfield accurising" should help with any questions you may have about proper fitment of lee enfield wood.
 
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I would be remiss if I didn't mention that the same store had a LE jungle carbine with matching numbers, also on consignment, for $450.

More pictures, you ask? Gladly!

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Bolt-side receiver stamps.

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Left side receiver stamps.

Looks like you're right about the Navy markings, thanks for pointing that out. The arrow stamp is right on top inside a big C. I'm betting the big asterisk on the left side is the "taken out of service" stamp. There appear to be numbers stamped into the wood on the fore-stock near the bayonet mounting points, which are sort of visible in the one photo I already posted, but they're a bit marred by the other dings and dents in that area and are difficult to make out. Looks like "79142"

I bought a box of Remington "Core-Lokt" cartridges with the rifle, for $31.99. Canadian Tire had only Winchester "Super X" cartridges for $24.99, so I bought a box of those as well. Winchester brass does not appear to be highly-regarded by reloaders. I'm going to guess that Remington is not much better for reloading - many of the cases are dented near the shoulders.

There's also a clear size difference between the two brands. I used my digital caliper to gauge the diameter of the bullets. Remingtons measure in at around .306, Winchester comes in at .308 to .309, which is the same as the Chinese surplus 7.62x54r rounds I have for my Mosin. The 7.62x39 rounds I have for my SKS fall somewhere between diameter-wise, but are much stubbier. I can drop the Remington cartridge into the muzzle and it slides in freely up to the neck. The Winchester and 7.62x54r both get snug partway in. Am I going to notice a difference between the Remington and Winchester rounds in terms of recoil and/or accuracy?
 
Again, very nice. Not many RCN-marked arms about, at least not in my neck of the woods which, admittedly, is a fair distance from salt water. Yes, the opposing arrows are the sold out of service marks. The fore-end, just about under the piling swivel would usually be marked with the serial number of the rifle, as would the bayonet boss on the nose cap, and the underside of the rear site. Too bad the bolt doesn't match, but I'd have scooped that rifle for the price you quoted without delay.

More info about the Canadian Navy and its arms can be found here on the Canadian War Museum site.

Nice bit of Canadian history you've got there.
 
Nice old rifle. Has history dripping from it. Built in 1918, been who knows where, handled by some fine young men. Treasure it.
 
Wood shrinks over time, and things get loose. The best method of fixing your loose butt stock is to find a stock bolt from a #4 Mk1 or mk2 enfield rifle. They don't have the squared end on the bolt that the your #1 rifle has.

This way, you can keep the original stock bolt for collectability reasons, and secure the butt stock with the #4 stock bolt that can be tightened, should it come loose, without removing the forestock. You would still have to remove the forestock to remove the original stock bolt.
 
Tightening the butt stock bolt was fairly easy. I watched a couple of YouTube videos that showed how to field-strip it. I don't have a flat-head screwdriver with a long enough shaft to reach the slotted end of the bolt, so I gave the square end a quarter turn with a 8mm wrench. That's all it would turn without a lot of torque, and the square edges are turned 90 degrees from where they were. It's rock-solid now, and still fits in the square groove in the forestock. When/if it comes loose again later on, I'll probably have to shim it for a solid fit. Again, for being almost 100 years old - not too shabby.

While it was apart, I took the opportunity to scrub the hidden bits with a Hoppes #9-dipped toothbrush and apply a layer of oil to all the metal surfaces. Also scrubbed the bore and polished out the grit - it shines now. I took some steel wool to the rust on the trigger guard - the bluing is already gone there and I wanted rid of the rust. The oil rag showed a lot of rusty brown from a lot of different areas after a wipedown, so I'm going to have to stay vigilant about keeping it oiled up and polished.

I'd like to find a firing pin gauge for it like I have for my Mosin-Nagant. Everything else appears to be solid and functional and ready to shoot. I imagine the pin is fine, but I also imagine a lot of people far more knowledgable than me have said that same thing and been mistaken. I've had a run of good luck with old military guns, but the other ones have been Russians stored in cosmoline after an arsenal refurb. This one has been a collectible for a number of years, and is around 20 years older and more mechanically sophisticated than my Mosin.
 
Beautiful find, and good for you! On the up-side, you have the scarce Canadian Navy stamp and the (often lost) piling swivel on the nose cap. In my eyes, the only thing keeping it from perfection are the mis-matched bolt and the stock repair. That said, I have to share my steal of the year. We were at a local gun show, my brother and I, and having a coffee at the concession stand. He happened to mention that the only rifle he'd be in the market for is a Siamese contract No.III to round out his collection of Lee Enfields. An older gentleman overheard us and mentioned that he was selling off some milsurp rifles on behalf of the widow of an old friend and that he happened to have a No.III for sale. My brother questioned him as to condition (ie: was it cut down, matching numbers, etc.) and from what the old guy said, it sounded unmolested, so my brother made arrangements to see it. I told my brother that I was looking for a nice No.III and that if it was in good shape, I'd buy it as he has a very nice FTR'd example of that rifle. To make a long story short, my brother bought the rifle and traded me for one of my Long Branch No.4's. Catch this! TWO HUNDRED DOLLARS! That's what he paid for the rifle. So with no further ado, here's what I wound up with. It's all numbers matching.


 
May I ask what BSA stand for (The logo with the three rifles)? There is a rifle here at the museum with the same marking but circled. Also, just below the rear sight, there is HV stamped on the barrel. Was-it for HEAVY?

Great to hear some nice stories like yours. Nice rifle.

Martin
 
At the risk of continuing to drag this thread OT, Dauph - BSA stands for Birmingham Small Arms. BSA had been making firearms for a long time before they got into the business of building SMLEs. The "HV" stands for High Velocity. Indicates that the rifle has been re-sighted for the Mk VII spitzer .303 ammunition.
 
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