M305 Newbie questions

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Hunter757

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Hello, I have recently acquired a M305 from Marstar, I am new to this type of rifle. I have not put any rounds through it yet because once when I racked it the bolt came off the op rod when it went forward. Does anyone know what happened to cause that?

Also I would like someone to go over the gun with me, does anyone know any M14 doctors in or around Edmonton?

I've seen that there are courses available to attend from time to time that teach you about the firearm, is there going to be anything like that soon in Edmonton (or even Calgary)?

I just want to learn a bit more before I take it out. I was (and still am) super excited about this gun but I'm feeling a little out of my depth.

Cheers all of you!
 
If you yank up and back while racking the action, you can pull the operating rod tab right out of its guiding slot in the receiver. Remedy: try to pull straight back when operating the operating rod (at times abbreviated to 'op rod'.)

There may be some neggy-nono's around soon to get you worrying about whether you new rifle is a piece of shnit bla bla bla... I wouldn't worry about them. Get some ammo and shoot the thing, honestly.

Have you been around firearms before? Are you mechanically inclined? (No offense.)
 
Just rereading; I see youve reached out to the local 'M14 type' community. Nothing like eyes on the iron to figure it out.

edit to add: if you don't find someone to have a look at the gun go shooting anyway. If your op rod tab or its track is actually a problem you would likely find out within twenty rounds. Have fun!
 
I have a few firearms, mainly bolt actions. I'm not the most mechanically inclined person I know haha, I really enjoy firearms despite that. I'm going to take it out and shoot it and see from there. Thanks!
 
Pictures would certainly help a diagnosis

When I first got mine, I racked the op rod and it came right off of the groove it sits in...(there is a little notch at the back for disassembly) Gave me a fright but no harm done.
 
Yeah it seems like I must have been putting pressure upwards, in addition to straight back and caused it to come off slightly. I have put it back together since that happened, no problem with that... I will take it shooting and see how she preforms. I m appreciating the feed back guys thank you! Does anyone know about those M14 classes that periodically pop up?
 
read up on all the M14/M305 stickies at the top of this forum.
youtube also has some very informative videos:

 
Hunter757 said:
Hello, I have recently acquired a M305 from Marstar, I am new to this type of rifle. I have not put any rounds through it yet because once when I racked it the bolt came off the op rod when it went forward. Does anyone know what happened to cause that?
Click to expand...

Who cares just shoot it, the gun has a warranty for a reason
 
Hi Ortho, we should hook up at a range, I'm new to edmonton, dont have any range membership here although I'm looking into getting one.
 
Hunter757 said:
Hello, I have recently acquired a M305 from Marstar, I am new to this type of rifle. I have not put any rounds through it yet because once when I racked it the bolt came off the op rod when it went forward. Does anyone know what happened to cause that?

Also I would like someone to go over the gun with me, does anyone know any M14 doctors in or around Edmonton?

I've seen that there are courses available to attend from time to time that teach you about the firearm, is there going to be anything like that soon in Edmonton (or even Calgary)?

I just want to learn a bit more before I take it out. I was (and still am) super excited about this gun but I'm feeling a little out of my depth.

Cheers all of you!
Click to expand...

This happened to me with my brand, new out of the box LRB. I replaced the op rod spring guide with a National Match op rod spring guide and it hasn't happened since. I would start there. That is an upgrade you should to anyway.
 
You probably want to change out the oprod spring guide to a guide from Sadlak Industries and the Oprod spring for a GI Spring also from Sadlak. You will also want to change out your gas piston to a Sadlak piston. Much better piston and it can improve accuracy. If U want to shoot 168gr SMK or 175 grain pills U will want to get a Sadlak grooved piston to reduce gas pressures on yur rifle. I made these modifications and I am getting 2 - 3 inch groups at 100 meters with elchepo Chinese Nato ammo. When I bed the rifle in a Sage EBR stock and load my own ammo using RE-15 my groups shrink to 1 MOA or better. I am very happy with my Norenco M305 as it is also one of the newest batch. The quality is impressive, my only comment that is a negative one is that there are very light machining marks on the barrel and the rear peep sights could be of better quality.
My fired brass measures 1.637-1.636 so it would appear that my head space is about where it should be. I can get more than 5 firings out of my brass with no sign of incipient case head separation. I understand that this is outstanding for a m14. I do believe that I would put my ChiCom rifle up against any rack grade GI Springfield and have a superior firearm. It do pain me to say that boys and girls but its the truth.
 
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eaglesnester said:
You probably want to change out the oprod spring guide to a guide from Sadlak Industries and the Oprod spring for a GI Spring also from Sadlak. You will also want to change out your gas piston to a Sadlak piston. Much better piston and it can improve accuracy. If U want to shoot 168gr SMK or 175 grain pills U will want to get a Sadlak grooved piston to reduce gas pressures on yur rifle. I made these modifications and I am getting 2 - 3 inch groups at 100 meters with elchepo Chinese Nato ammo. When I bed the rifle in a Sage EBR stock and load my own ammo using RE-15 my groups shrink to 1 MOA or better. I am very happy with my Norenco M305 as it is also one of the newest batch. The quality is impressive, my only comment that is a negative one is that there are very light machining marks on the barrel and the rear peep sights could be of better quality.
My fired brass measures 1.637-1.636 so it would appear that my head space is about where it should be. I can get more than 5 firings out of my brass with no sign of incipient case head separation. I understand that this is outstanding for a m14. I do believe that I would put my ChiCom rifle up against any rack grade GI Springfield and have a superior firearm. It do pain me to say that boys and girls but its the truth.
Click to expand...

Is that a rack grade GI M14 or a SAI standard? And who is Norenco anyway? What kind of pills? Suppositories? When did China join NATO? Just what insipient signs are we looking for? Case head separation and forehead separation can occur at the same time. Did you bed the rifle in a Sage chassis and load your ammo with RL-15 or is this a vision you've had?

I'm no expert on the platform but if I'm not mistaken Sadlak pistons don't fit Chinese gas cylinders.
 
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L42A1 said:
This happened to me with my brand, new out of the box LRB. I replaced the op rod spring guide with a National Match op rod spring guide and it hasn't happened since. I would start there. That is an upgrade you should to anyway.
Click to expand...

I have to pry the oprod out of the track of my rack grade GI M1A.
 
Before you start throwing money at it, your op rod guide may be loose and canted, which is why the op rod disengages from the receiver so easily. Just dimple and locktite it as per the stickies in the battle rifle forum. Not necessary to do before you shoot it but it may make it more enjoyable.
 
Seafury said:
Is that a rack grade GI M14 or a SAI standard? And who is Norenco anyway? What kind of pills? Suppositories? When did China join NATO? Just what insipient signs are we looking for? Case head separation and forehead separation can occur at the same time. Did you bed the rifle in a Sage chassis and load your ammo with RL-15 or is this a vision you've had?

I'm no expert on the platform but if I'm not mistaken Sadlak pistons don't fit Chinese gas cylinders.
Click to expand...
To answer your questions, ChiCom 7.62X51 Ammo is NATO caliber China may or may not be in NATO what difference does it make? They do produce ammo for the M305. It is available when in stock from Canada Ammo for $449 for 1000 rounds including shipping. I just went through 1000 rounds and I want to buy more. The signs of incipient case head separation occur on the web just above the case head. You will sometimes see a bright ring around the brass. You can not depend on this sign to tell you if the case head is going to separate during firing. If it does you could be in very deep Kimchee my son. You must take a bent paper clip that you stick inside the shell casing and feel the case wall near the case head. You will feel a slight irregularity in the smoothness of the case wall at the web. I use a RCBS case master gage to detect this problem. If I detect incipient case head separation I toss the brass.
Sadlak pistons do just fine in a ChiCom Norenco M305 at least they do in mine as I have both the grooved and the non grooved piston. I do believe that all Norenco rifles are no more than rack grade. As for reloading I have been reloading for about 10 years now and I have tried IMR4064 ,IMR4831 and RE15. I seem to get tighter groups with RE-15 at 42.5 grains loading. The 168gr match king Sierra pills (bullets) seem to shoot the best out of my Norenco. I have also tried Burger 168 grain hunter bullets but they do not seem to do as well in my particular rifle. The M305 is very very load, powder, and bullet sensitive if you want accuracy. Normally a Rack Grade Springfield will shoot somewhere in the neighborhood of 2 to 8 inches or so which is all U can expect from a battle rifle. I got lucky with mine as it shoots into 2-3 inches at 100 meters with ChiCom ammo in the Sage EBR chassis. Oh and the last thing, U can purchase a Norenco Chinese made M305 from Marstars Canada for $599. Yes they have gone up considerably in price but also so has the quality when U compare them with the earlier offerings from Norenco. Norenco is a company in China that bought all the machine tools from Springfield armory when the US stopped issuing the M305 and went to the M16. The Norenco receivers are all drop forged, The US made M305 has a cast receivers.
The US Marine Corps and the US Army have found that the ranges encountered in Afghanistan and Iraq are just too far for the 5.56 round to be effective. The Sage EBR Enhanced Battle Rifle is issued to at least one man in a rifle company in the US Army as the designated marksman, The US Marine Corps does the same thing only they call their designated marksman, the designated sniper. The Sage EBR with the shorty 18 inch barrel is issued to the US Navy Seal teams.
The M305 is not a rifle for a beginner. There are many pitfalls and safety issues that can get you seriously injured or killed if U do not know what U are doing with an M305. My advise to anyone contemplating buying this weapon is to read everything U can on it.
 
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? ? ? ? ?
I'd have to disagree with most of the contents of a couple lengthy posts in this thread.
some of us know and try to be helpful...... some of us should maybe sit back and learn
 
eaglesnester said:
To answer your questions, ChiCom 7.62X51 Ammo is NATO caliber China may or may not be in NATO what difference does it make? They do produce ammo for the M305. It is available when in stock from Canada Ammo for $449 for 1000 rounds including shipping. I just went through 1000 rounds and I want to buy more. The signs of incipient case head separation occur on the web just above the case head. You will sometimes see a bright ring around the brass. You can not depend on this sign to tell you if the case head is going to separate during firing. If it does you could be in very deep Kimchee my son. You must take a bent paper clip that you stick inside the shell casing and feel the case wall near the case head. You will feel a slight irregularity in the smoothness of the case wall at the web. I use a RCBS case master gage to detect this problem. If I detect incipient case head separation I toss the brass.
Sadlak pistons do just fine in a ChiCom Norenco M305 at least they do in mine as I have both the grooved and the non grooved piston. I do believe that all Norenco rifles are no more than rack grade. As for reloading I have been reloading for about 10 years now and I have tried IMR4064 ,IMR4831 and RE15. I seem to get tighter groups with RE-15 at 42.5 grains loading. The 168gr match king Sierra pills (bullets) seem to shoot the best out of my Norenco. I have also tried Burger 168 grain hunter bullets but they do not seem to do as well in my particular rifle. The M305 is very very load, powder, and bullet sensitive if you want accuracy. Normally a Rack Grade Springfield will shoot somewhere in the neighborhood of 2 to 8 inches or so which is all U can expect from a battle rifle. I got lucky with mine as it shoots into 2-3 inches at 100 meters with ChiCom ammo in the Sage EBR chassis. Oh and the last thing, U can purchase a Norenco Chinese made M305 from Marstars Canada for $599. Yes they have gone up considerably in price but also so has the quality when U compare them with the earlier offerings from Norenco. Norenco is a company in China that bought all the machine tools from Springfield armory when the US stopped issuing the M305 and went to the M16. The Norenco receivers are all drop forged, The US made M305 has a cast receivers.
The US Marine Corps and the US Army have found that the ranges encountered in Afghanistan and Iraq are just too far for the 5.56 round to be effective. The Sage EBR Enhanced Battle Rifle is issued to at least one man in a rifle company in the US Army as the designated marksman, The US Marine Corps does the same thing only they call their designated marksman, the designated sniper. The Sage EBR with the shorty 18 inch barrel is issued to the US Navy Seal teams.
The M305 is not a rifle for a beginner. There are many pitfalls and safety issues that can get you seriously injured or killed if U do not know what U are doing with an M305. My advise to anyone contemplating buying this weapon is to read everything U can on it.
Click to expand...
Norinco is a marketing organization in main land China and did not buy the machinery when Springfield Armory closed, that was Taiwan which used it to make the type 57 i.e an M14 clone.
 
eaglesnester said:
To answer your questions, ChiCom 7.62X51 Ammo is NATO caliber China may or may not be in NATO what difference does it make? They do produce ammo for the M305. It is available when in stock from Canada Ammo for $449 for 1000 rounds including shipping. I just went through 1000 rounds and I want to buy more. The signs of incipient case head separation occur on the web just above the case head. You will sometimes see a bright ring around the brass. You can not depend on this sign to tell you if the case head is going to separate during firing. If it does you could be in very deep Kimchee my son. You must take a bent paper clip that you stick inside the shell casing and feel the case wall near the case head. You will feel a slight irregularity in the smoothness of the case wall at the web. I use a RCBS case master gage to detect this problem. If I detect incipient case head separation I toss the brass.
Sadlak pistons do just fine in a ChiCom Norenco M305 at least they do in mine as I have both the grooved and the non grooved piston. I do believe that all Norenco rifles are no more than rack grade. As for reloading I have been reloading for about 10 years now and I have tried IMR4064 ,IMR4831 and RE15. I seem to get tighter groups with RE-15 at 42.5 grains loading. The 168gr match king Sierra pills (bullets) seem to shoot the best out of my Norenco. I have also tried Burger 168 grain hunter bullets but they do not seem to do as well in my particular rifle. The M305 is very very load, powder, and bullet sensitive if you want accuracy. Normally a Rack Grade Springfield will shoot somewhere in the neighborhood of 2 to 8 inches or so which is all U can expect from a battle rifle. I got lucky with mine as it shoots into 2-3 inches at 100 meters with ChiCom ammo in the Sage EBR chassis. Oh and the last thing, U can purchase a Norenco Chinese made M305 from Marstars Canada for $599. Yes they have gone up considerably in price but also so has the quality when U compare them with the earlier offerings from Norenco. Norenco is a company in China that bought all the machine tools from Springfield armory when the US stopped issuing the M305 and went to the M16. The Norenco receivers are all drop forged, The US made M305 has a cast receivers.
The US Marine Corps and the US Army have found that the ranges encountered in Afghanistan and Iraq are just too far for the 5.56 round to be effective. The Sage EBR Enhanced Battle Rifle is issued to at least one man in a rifle company in the US Army as the designated marksman, The US Marine Corps does the same thing only they call their designated marksman, the designated sniper. The Sage EBR with the shorty 18 inch barrel is issued to the US Navy Seal teams.
The M305 is not a rifle for a beginner. There are many pitfalls and safety issues that can get you seriously injured or killed if U do not know what U are doing with an M305. My advise to anyone contemplating buying this weapon is to read everything U can on it.
Click to expand...

Always best if you know what you are doing and what you are talking about. Thanks for the information. What about the Winchester M305?
 
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