reduced recoil cartridges

Mr. Friendly

Mr. Friendly

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I'm wondering if anyone here has experience with them and can speak up about how much lighter they are?

I've put a couple posts in the past about my friend and his recoil sensitivity due to health issues.

I decided I'll buy him a rifle, I can afford it and he can't. I have a spare Elite 3200 scope lying around, so we're good on optics as well.

I know he likes the Weatherby Vanguard, but they are a bit confusing. Reliable, for instance lists it as 'Series 2', but there's no reference to a Vanguard Series 2 on Weatherby's website. it's interesting that he likes that rifle, because it was the only rifle with a synthetic stock that he actually liked.

thanks guys. :)
 
I can't speak to reduced recoil cartridges but as someone who struggled with a "flinch" I can say that the Vanguard s2 is very friendly to shoot. Even with full power 30/06 loads. Best of luck

AR
 
What cartridges is the Weatherby offered in? If you reload all cartridges are "reduced recoil," if you don't then you are limited to some of the smaller bore cartridges or those that are offered as factory reduced loads... I would check the major ammo manufacturer websites for what they offer in reduced loads... likely the short action cartridges (7mm-08, .308 etc...) and the common cartridges (.30/06, .300 WM etc...)

If you or a friend are a reloader, then sky is the limit.
 
I sell the whole line of Hornady Custom-Lite ammo, so have tried it in the calibers that I personally own - so for me that's the 243, 7.08 and 30.06 (It's also available in 270, 308, 7 mm RM, and 300 WM but have no first hand experience).

Starting with the 243, it's more the charge than the bullet that is vastly different - it's still loaded with an 87 grain bullet which is "in the ball park" for a typical 243 deer bullet which would go from say an 80 grain mono to about 100 grain cup/core. The recoil, which isn't bad anyway with the 243 and a normal load is easily the same or less than my 223.

In the 7.08 you get a 120 grain bullet (typical 140 in a full load) - with this it takes my 7.08 "easily" down to what I normally experience with my 243 - again, the 7.08 is not a "kicker" but the Custom Lite turns it into something even the most recoil sensitive could handle.

The most notable difference for me was with the 30.06 load - I typically shot 180 grain bullets. The Custom Lite comes loaded with a 125 grain SST (same with the 308). This took my 30.06 down to 243 levels. I could not say that the 30.06 kicked any harder than the 7.08 (both shooting the reduced loads), it really tamed the .06 that much.

Mind you, a 125 grain bullet is "light" for the .06 (or the 308) if you planned on using either for larger game and if you check out the ballistics, the reduced 7.08 actually packs better energy out at 300 yards then the 30.06 or 308 (reduced loads of course).

But all of them, above the 243, are still "enough" to take out a deer at 300 yards (with the 243 still making the 1000 pounds often cited, at about the 225 yards). For larger game (Moose) I would personally call them "100 yard rounds".

Can't give you any first or second hand on the two magnum offering (7RM/300WM) - both are still packing bambi killing power out past 500 yards and moose killing power @ 300 yards
 
Muzzle break, limbsaver, heavy weight rifle(if weight is not an issue). These will reduce recoil better than under loading a cartridge. Is this for hunting, target, long range?
 
All the Vanguards on Weatherby's site are S2 models; they no longer make the original version. The S2 guns are equipped with much nicer triggers, very shootable right out of the box.

Sorry, can't help you with reduced-recoil versions of cartridges. I will say that the Weatherby-style Monte Carlo stock on the Vanguard guns, along with their fairly hefty weight, makes any cartridge seem reduced in recoil when compared to the same ammo shot out of a lighter-weight, straighter-stocked gun.
 
Mr. Friendly said:
I'm wondering if anyone here has experience with them and can speak up about how much lighter they are?

I've put a couple posts in the past about my friend and his recoil sensitivity due to health issues.

I decided I'll buy him a rifle, I can afford it and he can't. I have a spare Elite 3200 scope lying around, so we're good on optics as well.

I know he likes the Weatherby Vanguard, but they are a bit confusing. Reliable, for instance lists it as 'Series 2', but there's no reference to a Vanguard Series 2 on Weatherby's website. it's interesting that he likes that rifle, because it was the only rifle with a synthetic stock that he actually liked.

thanks guys. :)
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I know that I echo the others but the Weatherby Vanguard would be my unanimous choice for several reasons, first being top quality, any that I have had were superbly accurate and the fact that by being slightly heavier recoil is dampened naturally without needing to hang a brake on the muzzle.
Before buying why not see if you can arrange to have your friend handle one or two ?
 
Agree with all the Vanguard II comments - I own four of them.

I will point out that the comments about them handling recoil better (paraphrasing here) is true, but not because of some engineering feat, it's simply because a VGII is "heavy" compared to just about everything else on the market.

The bare rifle tips the scales at 7lbs 12oz.

My Sporter (wood) with a 3-9X40 13oz scope, plus mounts, with a full mag/1 down the spout comes in at about 9 1/2 pounds. My Synthetic has a slightly heavier 3-9X42 "15 oz" scope, so "loaded" it's just on 9lbs 11oz.

That weight does eat up some of the recoil - so while not super easy to carry if you are going "miles" or "uphill for hours", a heavier rifle will always be easier on the shoulder than the same caliber in one of the ultra lights. So if recoil is a "major factor", forget the 5.5 pound Kimbers...
 
The main reason I reload is to shoot reduced ammo. My 444 was a fine range rifle but a whole lot more fun with lead bullets at 1500fps. There is an advantage to reduced recoil ammo as a shooter can shoot a lot to maybe work up to full recoil ammo. I have health issues, best of luck for your friend. Nice of you to help him with a rifle!
 
The Vanguard offers excellent value for the price, and it is fairly heavy, which helps with recoil. If you want less recoil, simply go with a cartridge that produces less recoil, for example, a 308win, instead of a 30-06, and use a lighter bullet say a 150gr instead of a 180gr .
 
When my son was starting out, I could have started him with a 243 or a 30-06. If I started with the 243 I would have been buying the 30-06 in a few years. I decided to start with the 30-06 using reduced recoil loads. Worked fantastically. He is still using the same gun purchased 10 years ago. I think that's pretty good reasoning to use rr cartridges.
As for the weatherby, it is by far the best bang for the buck, especially right now. $500 at wss.
 
stubblejumper said:
The Vanguard offers excellent value for the price, and it is fairly heavy, which helps with recoil. If you want less recoil, simply go with a cartridge that produces less recoil, for example, a 308win, instead of a 30-06, and use a lighter bullet say a 150gr instead of a 180gr .
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I agree with this philosophy....... Why load down when you can usually get the same results with a normal load in appropriate cartridge?

The only time I load down is if I want to use a medium game rifle for small game along the way....
 
Remington's managed recoil 308 loads worked quite well for the son of one of the guys in camp.

He took a beauty 10 pointer on his first hunt. Good bullet placement & the job was "done in one".

Good accuracy from his 7600 too.
 
Superbrad said:
I agree with this philosophy....... Why load down when you can usually get the same results with a normal load in appropriate cartridge?

The only time I load down is if I want to use a medium game rifle for small game along the way....
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I own a few boxes of the Hornady reduced .308 for teaching new shooters. The .308 is the lightest centerfire in my safe and I found some shooters didn't transition well from the .22 to factory .308 loads. The reduced loads fill this niche nicely. Shot a deer and coyote as well with them for sh*ts and giggles. Inside a hundred yards they did the job quite well.
 
I am just starting to play with reduced recoil loads using Trail Boss powder. This stuff is great for practice and getting to know your rifle. I have a .30-06 that I'm not comfortable shooting too much, especially from a sitting or prone position. With the loads I made for it, using Trail Boss and 175 gr. slugs (because they've been sitting on a shelf for 4 years) it has the recoil of an 8-pound .223. Total game-changer.
To those who scoff and say "Why load down when you can just get a .243, etc..." I would say I do it because it allows me to put a lot of rounds through a rifle I normally can't shoot enough.
So for your friend, yes, it's a definite option. I would suggest practicing with reduced loads and hunting with "real" but not extra-hot and heavy ammo. The one or two shots you squeeze off in the field are not the ones that bother you. If you're wondering about recipes using Trail Boss, feel free to PM me.
 
yidava25 said:
I am just starting to play with reduced recoil loads using Trail Boss powder. This stuff is great for practice and getting to know your rifle. I have a .30-06 that I'm not comfortable shooting too much, especially from a sitting or prone position. With the loads I made for it, using Trail Boss and 175 gr. slugs (because they've been sitting on a shelf for 4 years) it has the recoil of an 8-pound .223. Total game-changer.

I load trailboss in my 30-06 as well. 14gr with a 165 gets me 1500fps area


If you're wondering about recipes using Trail Boss, feel free to PM me.

It is pretty easy to get a recipe. Fill a primed case to where the base of the bullet sits. Measure that and that is the max. Multiply that number by .7 to get the min charge. Word of caution DO NOT COMPRESS THIS POWDER
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Added some things
 
If the point of the exercise is to recoil harden your pal to the point that he can tolerate a reasonable amount of recoil, I'd choose a .30/06, start him with 125 gr bullets loaded to 2600 fps, then slowly increase bullet weight and velocity as his tolerance allows. If his condition permanently bars him from enduring recoil, a reasonably heavy, 8 pound rifle in .243, or 6mm Remington, or a quarter bore like a .250 Savage, or .257 Roberts is probably prudent, and his condition will probably prevent him from enduring the rigors of hunting game that requires more gun.
 
A couple years back my buddy wished for a rifle for his young son.
He figured the 7mm-08 was the way to go.
I know he shoots a .308win and I mentioned that it would be a good idea
to keep the same ammo for both rifles.
He was concerned about recoil and I knew Junior was going to put some meat
on his bones soon 'nuff.
So I found a decent deal on a .308 and we proceeded to load light load ammo.
Took his first deer with it.
I would suggest the .308win as it has proven itself to be a good companion.
 
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