Can you buy decent clay scores?

C

CLydesdale1812

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What I mean by this is: what is the ratio of skill to equipment? If I were to buy a $15,000 Beretta trap with adjustable stock, and load it with custom top of the line trap ammo; how far will that get a novice? I just want to know where my dollar is better spent, on a great gun or on ammo for practice.
 
I am a casual & mediocre clay shooter using a Browning 725 Sporting 12ga. I don't think with my limited skills that a Perrazi or a Kolar costing many times more than my current gun would make much difference in scores.
One would have to fire many more rounds than I do to notice an advantage to owning a premium gun.
 
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No, you can't buy scores in a gun shop. Find someone knowledgeable that can help you find a gun that fits and $2500 gun for a novice will be just as effective as 15K. Put $100 into training videos and the rest into rounds/birds.
 
Book an intro lesson at the Trap Shooting Academy at Hamilton Gun Club. They are fantastic, friendly people with a passion for trap shooting. After one lesson you'll know what you need to do to get better.
 
Londonshooter said:
No, you can't buy scores in a gun shop. Find someone knowledgeable that can help you find a gun that fits and $2500 gun for a novice will be just as effective as 15K. Put $100 into training videos and the rest into rounds/birds.
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Totally agree with Londonshooter, after 40 plus years of "experience" shooting the various clay target games.

What you can" buy", is the expertise of someone to help you with gun fit. You can also" buy" a few lessons from an instructor /coach in the clay target game of your choice.

I would think that the ratio you are looking for is approx 90 % to 95 % skill and 5% to 10 % equipment in any of our clay target games.
A shooter will not break many targets on a Sporting Clays course with that hypothetical $ 15,000 Beretta if he or she has no skill.
 
Think you can buy an 18 hole score of 70 in golf ???  The best clubs and balls in the world won't allow you to do that if you don't have the skill and practice relentlessly.

The clay games are maybe 85% "between your ears" ( skill, ability, concentration, technique et al) , 10% equipment and 5% everything else.
Learn good technique, acquire a decent & appropriate gun and get it to fit and balance properly, & become a student of the game. From that point on, lots and lots
of focussed practice ... not just burning ammo. Lessons and a decent coach can certainly help shorten the learning curve. Not every great shooter is a good teacher/coach and not every decent coach is necessarily a great shooter ! The advice offered by many squadmates, although well-intentioned, is neither necessarily constructive, productive ... or even correct.

Good guns in the $ 2500 - 3500 range can often be far better than the average shooter's ability. Many can handle the average Chevy, but few are able to get maximum performance out of a pricey Ferrari or Lamborghini. $ 15,000 or $ 20,000 spent on a high performance shotgun may not help you shoot any better ... you may even do worse if it doesn't fit as well as the old used $ 400 auto-loader you are currently using.

Some shooters will never accomplish 100 straights, regardless of the cost of their equipment and unlimited practice with the finest of ammunition.

Given good hand-eye coordination, nominal physical attributes, the ability to learn & concentrate, a decent gun that fits, and good coaching to teach proper technique etc.,
....with practice, the average guy/girl can however to learn to shoot very well.

A good gun and lots of practice with plenty of even decent quality ammo can get you a long way. Proper technique, good coaching and the ability to focus will get you even further. After 10,000 or so shells learning the game, maybe then you will be ready for that dream gun ... maybe not. Your level of dedication in between may determine
what level of skill you develop and how your performance improves ... not how much your gun & shells cost !
 
The best shooters in the world will still score well using a 600$ gun. When your talking equipment to skill I'd say if your not shooting 80% with a 600$ gun it's not the gun. If you can't break 85-90% even though your practicing 5 days a week, a gun upgrade will help you.

You need to remember just like hockey and golf buying the best stock will help but a pro will still kick my ass all day long using kids equipment. As proven by my grandfather, told him I needed a new set of clubs to compete against him. He told me "tell you what I'll play the full 18 using my 7 and putter if you are within 2 stokes of me I'll buy you new clubs and some lessons with the club pro. If you don't then you owe me a steak dinner." Needless to say it was the best 20$ steak dinner I've ever had lol" as for the score card I shot 98 (hell broke 100) he shot an 85.... now I'm an adult and have bought the best of the best and yet still shoot 95-105.

Happy shooting!!! It may not improve the score but there is something satisfying useing the best of the best no matter the score in the end. However if your on a budget, ammo, lessons and a mid range properly sized shotgun and you will be on your way.
 
I have shot clean scores at skeet using several guns, including skeet guns, sporting clays guns, SxS and O/U field guns, and semi auto and pump action field guns. I typically use either the cheapest target loads that I can purchase by the flat, or the same hulls reloaded. The most important thing concerning the gun being used is that it fits me. I could afford a Krieghoff, but I doubt that my scores would improve over shooting my 725 sporting clays guns. Spend your money on a decent quality shotgun that fits you, and on shooting as much as your time allows.
 
Use sound judgement and research, then buy the tool that's right for the job, money shouldn't factor in. Within reason of course.

Closely examine how many shells you are going to fire. Couple boxes a month? Flat a week? Splitting a skid with a shooting partner?

For me, it takes a long time to get really in the groove with a new shotgun. I made the mistake of buying the wrong tool and spent three years coming to the conclusion that my gun simply wasn't going to last if I kept shooting it as much as I was. So, at 10k my Franchi Instinct L got taken out of service and will still be my go to upland gun as it fits me perfectly.

Enter a season of relearning new patterns and swings. You want to be that guy at the range that has been shooting the same gun for 30 years and its like an extension of his body right? Me too.

Now, I shoot a Browning 725 Sporting (high grade), and I am 100% confident that I will be shooting that firearm for decades before I wear it out. Is it worth the extra cost to buy a K gun or DT with the hopes it will last my entire shooting career? I don't think so. Too many variables.

I have shot almost all of the expensive guns, and I don't see a reason to own one, other than 1) guaranteed longevity and 2) bragging rights.

Also, most of the 'competition' guns are not pretty enough for me. I like it when guys stare at my gun on the rack. Lol.

IMO of course.
C
 
When I look back to when I began shooting clay targets there are two mistakes I made.

The first was not getting proper instruction sooner. The second was not buying the very best target gun available and getting it properly fitted even if it meant taking a loan to pay for it.

My scores would have been better if I'd had the fundamentals taught to me instead of doing it myself by trial and error and not switched guns as much.

However, the first mistake was much more serious than the second. The consolation prize is that I've owned and shot most of the available competition guns and have a clear idea of what I like in a gun and why.
 
Sometimes the old and proven guns still work and are economical to boot. Bought my trap gun used for less than a thousand, (a Browning BT-99), shot it every week at the trap club for three years. Bought an old Posner-Warren progressive reloader to cut the cost of shells, and won the 2009 Pacific Handicap Championship beating out over 200 other shooters with their Perrazi's and such. Buy a BT-99 and learn to shoot it instead of buying the most expensive shotgun out there. P.S. Also use a field grade Citori over and under for doubles and have won several tournaments with 97 + scores. The more you shoot, the better each gun seems to get!
 
Im not Great at trap --Best I have got is 21/25

I did not shoot trap for about 5 years then tried it one day with my 870 IC rifle sight sbore (just what I had that day)
first round was 12/25 (app 50%)
2nd round was 16/25 which I thought was great --wrong gun / no practice --> Just having some Fun blasting some clays
You have to be fast with a 20 inch ic or you just cant touch them

I wish I was good enough to shoot 25 straight once a month
No I dont shoot reg but if I could get 25 at reg intervals I would go weekly
 
In my experience of shooting trap for the past 5 years... You can't buy your scores. I started with a hand me down Remington 870 and literally the first time I ever shot trap I got 24/25. Shot that gun for a few years, bought a beretta Semi auto for $1800 and guess what! My scores didn't really improve. I just felt a little more comfortable behind the gun and shot more. Now I shoot a Browning XT O/U and still shoot 25's here and there. My best with that gun is 146 Straight.

Honestly... You can buy practice rounds and clays. Go out, shoot lots and have a really good shooter watch you and give you some coaching. On the other hand, I've seen a rich guy bring a $20k Krieghoff to the club and shoot 8/25 at the 16 yard line. He has slowly improved by shooting more and getting some coaching but still can't break 20.
 
Not unless you can bribe the trap scorer into changing your scores?! The most expensive gun won't buy you targets, it will buy you quality, durability and probably alot of lipstick depending how much embellishment is done to the finish. If you are going to be an avid trapshooter and you are the type who likes to try to always continually improve or best your own scores I would spend my $ on

1: A proven quality firearm that will last you years of shooting
2: Having the firearm you purchased made to fit you either at the factory end or by a competent gun fitter/smith.
3: Lots, and I do mean LOTS of practice. Today's game of competitive trap is exactly that, competitive. The change in target requirements today compared with 30 years ago has doubled and that combined with todays fully adjustable guns has produced some tough competition.
4: Ammo? If you can afford the best without it being noticeable in your wallet then by all means shoot the best. If you are like me I practice with what is most affordable and buy premium ammo for at important shoots.
Now get out there and enjoy yourself!
 
The spank nails it. Especially #3. You can buy ammo and practice time. That's what gets you the scores. I have been told that an expensive gun and expensive ammo "might" get you from 98 to 99 but all you have to do is lift your head and that's the end of that.
 
Good thread - I have been wondering about the dollar value (and with that quality) of the guns versus fit and practice. I shoot trap rarely at my Club, only because I have my children on weekends and they usually have soccer or swimming lessons etc. I do get out about 5 or 6 times per year, though, and each time I go I take two shotguns out of three that fit me well. Two of those are 20g - one with 16" barrels. The other is a 12g Breda $400 auto-loader that just seems to fit me and swings well (though I haven't met anyone else that shares that sentiment towards that shotgun). I shoot equal scores with these three guns - usually in the high 20's, but a perfect score still eludes me.

I'm okay with my minimal investment to fun ratio because I know when I have the time to dedicate towards regular trap shooting, a quality 12g will be getting fit for me and I'll at least start with a gun that will endeavour through my learning curve with thousands of rounds.
 
Nothing will help you more than a competent instructor or coach. Someone who will leave you with some homework in the field. Giving you a practice regimen that is tailored to your needs. Practicing the same bad habits over and over won't make you shoot any better. Good instruction is one way to make sure your scores will improve. By the way, score is not important. If you get good foundations score improvements will take care of itself.
 
jacpor said:
Nothing will help you more than a competent instructor or coach. Someone who will leave you with some homework in the field. Giving you a practice regimen that is tailored to your needs. Practicing the same bad habits over and over won't make you shoot any better. Good instruction is one way to make sure your scores will improve. By the way, score is not important. If you get good foundations score improvements will take care of itself.
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Absolutely 110%!!
 
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