Rookie mistake of the YEAR!! Nightforce mounted on PGW Coyote with -25 rail

[njlondon]

[Edit: If you wish a good laugh at my expense then read the posts until you get to post 17]


I've mounted many scopes.

Putting a NightForce 12 x 42 on a CGN acquired PGW Coyote.

Strangely I am short of up elevation at 100 yards.

I had the same scope on a Coyote Folder without this problem.

I put in a +10 Burris insert on the rear which helped but I am still short.

I will put in a -10 insert on the front which should solve the problem, but I cannot understand
why I am short on Up in the first place.

Must be something dumb I am doing. Any help would be appreciated.

 

[RangerPark]

I'm not sure I understand your problem. This particular scope only has 40 MOA of elevation adjustment, that's 20 up and 20 down from center, with a 25 MOA rail you won't be able to zero it at 100 yards. The rings might help, but looks like you would need the XTR rings that have 40 MOA inserts. This is a scope that should be zeroed much further.

 

[Mystic Precision]

How much UP is available in your current set up?

Jerry

 

[njlondon]

How much UP is available in your current set up?

Jerry

With the +10 Burris inserts on the rear I am still more than a foot short at 100.

Rangerpark says I need XTR rings that have 40 MOA inserts. Is this the answer?

 

[RangerPark]

With the +10 Burris inserts on the rear I am still more than a foot short at 100.

Rangerpark says I need XTR rings that have 40 MOA inserts. Is this the answer?

My actual answer is to zero much further out, like at 300 or 600 yards.

 

[njlondon]

My actual answer is to zero much further out, like at 300 or 600 yards.

Not an option in Ontario.

My range is max 300.

I want to be 2.1 inches high at 100 which gives me a 9" drop at 300.

 

[RangerPark]

The XTR rings will work, but you'll only be counteracting the 25 MOA in the rail to bring your setup back to 0 MOA. Using a 0 MOA rail would also work.

 

[njlondon]

The XTR rings will work, but you'll only be counteracting the 25 MOA in the rail to bring your setup back to 0 MOA. Using a 0 MOA rail would also work.

I will just grab a 0 moa rail and replace the existing one. What puzzled me is the previous PGW folder I sold worked fine. Perhaps the
previous owner changed out the factory rail to a 0 moa.

Thanks guys. Resolved.

 

[Cameron SS]

With the +10 Burris inserts on the rear I am still more than a foot short at 100.

Rangerpark says I need XTR rings that have 40 MOA inserts. Is this the answer?

Your scope has 40 moa top to bottom. assuming your rifle shoots relatively middle, a 20 MOA offset is the biggest you should be using to zero at 100 m.

If you are using a 25 MOA rail, right away you will be at least 5 MOA short on elevation, assuming your set up groups in the middle of the adjustment range. If you are a foot short, meaning 12 MOA at 100m, once you subtract the -5 deficit from the rail compared to available elevation in the scope, sounds like you would be zeroing at around 7 MOA from the centre of the scope.

So here are two things to try.

1) Rotate your elevation drum all the way to the bottom, and then rotate all the way to the top counting the number of clicks. Confirm that you actually have 40 MOA of travel inside the scope. In reality you should have much more than this, depending on how the scope is built

2) Remove the offset rings and rails, and zero the rifle with a standard set up. Then count the number of clicks down to the bottom. I would expect you to be 13 MOA from bottoming out the scope (20 from centre - 7)

If I am right, and you are 13 MOA from the bottom of your elevation, then you can create a -12 MOA offset and still be able to zero at 100, but that doesn't leave you much latitude for POI shifts based on different loads and environmentals.

If your max range is 300 meters, why bother with the offsets? Your scope with standard mount should easily make that shot.

 

[Mystic Precision]

With the +10 Burris inserts on the rear I am still more than a foot short at 100.

Rangerpark says I need XTR rings that have 40 MOA inserts. Is this the answer?

Sorry, but do not understand "a foot short".... When you aim at the center of the target, does the bullet hit the center of the target?

If yes, how much addn elevation can you turn in your scope? that is the number we need to help you figure out what to do now.

If the scope is currently at FULL DOWN and you are hitting high by a foot, that is a different problem.

Please discuss using MOA, or inches, in relation to the center of the target you are aiming at.

Thanks

Jerry

 

[cody c]

Why use a -25MOA rail for shooting a max 300yards?

Otherwise just turn your scope around 180 degrees, you'll have a much larger field of view....

 

[LeftFootOfDoom]

I use the burris signature zee with inserts
This is gonna sound simplistic and not meant as an insult, but did you put the inserts in correctly?

for the rear, you should have the +10portion on the bottom and then the matching -10 portion on the top of the scope.
for the front, you would have the +10 portion on the top and then the matching -10 portion on the bottom of the scope.

 

[njlondon]

Sorry, but do not understand "a foot short".... When you aim at the center of the target, does the bullet hit the center of the target?

If yes, how much addn elevation can you turn in your scope? that is the number we need to help you figure out what to do now.

If the scope is currently at FULL DOWN and you are hitting high by a foot, that is a different problem.

Please discuss using MOA, or inches, in relation to the center of the target you are aiming at.

Thanks

Jerry

I am at full UP.
POI is about a foot (12 moa) low at 100 yards.

 

[njlondon]

I use the burris signature zee with inserts
This is gonna sound simplistic and not meant as an insult, but did you put the inserts in correctly?

for the rear, you should have the +10portion on the bottom and then the matching -10 portion on the top of the scope.
for the front, you would have the +10 portion on the top and then the matching -10 portion on the bottom of the scope.

Not insulted, that was the first thing I double checked. I know I want the rear of the scope to go up. They are correctly installed.

 

[njlondon]

In any event I will put in the -10 inserts in the front of the scope. If that doesn't work I will replace the -25 picatinny rail with a 0 rail.

 

[BigUglyMan]

I am at full UP.
POI is about a foot (12 moa) low at 100 yards.

Again, not to insult you, but are you sure that you are maxed out "UP" and not accidentally "DOWN"?

If you are, you have to buy the beer.

 

[njlondon]

Again, not to insult you,
but are you sure that you are maxed out "UP" and not accidentally "DOWN"?

If you are, you have to buy the beer.

Well, JHC. I own 4 high-end precision rifles, 3 NF scopes, 1 S&B, 2 excellent Sightrons, and a variety of hunting and shooting rifles.

And I'll be damned if you haven't nailed the rookie mistake of the year!

Where do I send the beer?

 

[Mystic Precision]

I am at full UP.
POI is about a foot (12 moa) low at 100 yards.

WOWZA... this is really bizarre. Common problem with canted rail is the POI is very high and the scope is at full down.

Yes, you will need to lower the front of your scope and/or raise the rear of your scope.

The Burris XTR signature rings will allow alot more scope shim then the rings you have now... if needed.

Again, the inserts are used with PLUS and MINUS on each set of rings.... not PLUS/PLUS... MINUS/MINUS.

Jerry

 

[njlondon]

Jerry, read the post above yours and have a good laugh at my expense.
Norm.

 

[Ganderite]

I usually don't turn the knob the wrong way unless I am in the middle of a match ....