First shotgun for deer - forests - dense underbrush - advice please

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linux99

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Hi

New to hunting deer so please forgive me if this is an ignorant question - it comes from lack of knowledge not irresponsibility.

I want to start hunting for deer next year. My plan is to buy a shotgun, spend a year essentially target shooting and plinking to become competent in shooting it (i.e. able to hit a deer!) and get a permit for next years (2018/19) hunting season. I know very little about shotguns and don't believe in shooting unless you have a definite kill, so want to practice.

I have to use a shotgun because of local by-laws. No rifles permitted at all. 100% definite, none, not happening. A rifle may be the better option - but it's not one I have.

The area I want to shoot is relatively overgrown, lots of brush and undergrowth. I have seen plenty of deer there so I was thinking something manoeuvrable and short barrelled would be best.

What do you think of this http://www.cabelas.ca/product/47109 - Maverick HS-12 Thunder Ranch Over & Under Shotgun.

Gauge Chamber Barrel Length Overall Length Choke Weight
12 3" 18-1/2" 36-1/2" Cylinder Bore 6-1/4 lbs.

Pro's:
Mechanically simple - break barrel so nothing to go wrong.
2 shots - so you have a follow on if you are unlucky with the first.
Short and light - so easy to use.
Nice clear sights - good for slugs
Rail for scope if I want one
Cheap - If I hate the sport after trying it for a season or two no huge loss

Con's:
Tactical look - makes you look like a douche to a lot of people
Short and Light - huge "boom" and probably a bad recoil
Fixed open choke - so really only good for it's stated purpose deer at under 75 yards.

I'd love thoughts and opinions please. Thanks!
 
You've obviously done your research.

That said, personally, my advice would be to buy an 870 with removable chokes or a dedicated slug barrel. Not that a 3rd shot will make the difference or that deer will be any more dead with one - more so that if you enjoy the experience and start expanding what you want to do with your shotgun, you can do that easily with an 870 without having to purchase another firearm specific to whatever that new task happens to be.

I'm sad to say better advice is probably to get a bow though if you really want to spend time deer hunting. I'm in Southern Ontario and I can hunt with a shotgun for a week but with a crossbow for 3 months. Sad but true.
 
First off, is the area you are thinking of hunting "Shotgun only" or "Shot only"?.

I would prefer a longer barrel on a hunting shotgun (22-24") with a removable choke. I'm sure the Mossberg would be fine, but I've also read there's some position sensitive safety on it which would be a detractor for me.

There's usually plenty of Deer/Turkey type SG's in the EE that might save you a few bucks, and better suit as a hunting shotgun. The break open type action does simplify things, but the versatility of a pump is tough to beat.


Just my 2c
 
One thing about double guns and slugs is point of impact. Often times they aren't close with lower grade mass produced guns. No offense

A pump with a slug barrel maybe more consistent and with practice quite fast. Smooth bore or rifled slug barrels are available and their weight helps with recoil
Other barrel options offer more versatility for waterfowl and small game

Double guns are nice and shorter overall

I'd suggest finding a skeet club and asking around to handle some guns. More than likely ppl will be more than willing to let you feel as swing and maybe even try various guns.
Gun shops can be a good source to try as well. Some are better than others.
With Shotgunning even with slugs fit is very important. If it doesn't fit you you won't shoot good and recoil can seem harsh

I'm glad to see you're willing to spend a year practicing.
Slugs can get expensive. I'd suggest a shopping spree at lee. Get a lee load all 2 a melting pot and a slug mold. Find some cheap scrap lead and fire the slugs in to a sand filled box. Reuse the fired slugs.
I still use factory slugs for hunting but for practice I use my own cast slugs. I go thru about a 1000 a year to keep my muscle memory up

Best of luck
 
If its not a shot only situation why not a dedicated slug gun like a savage 220? Not as versatile as the 870 or the like but an option and the same $$ no less.

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Head down to the local shop and try out a few and see how they handle.
An 870 or 500 can be found cheaply and 80% of the shotgun deer hunters I know use one of the two.
You can start with a smooth bore and rifled slugs, or rifled bore and sabots... which is my preference.
12ga, or 20 ga... various barrel lengths... add rails for optics or run iron sights.
A lot of possible options.
 
I'd buy something reliable and proven. For me that would be an Remington 870 or Mossberg 500. If you get a rifled barrel, consider a cantilever model for a low power (1-4x) scope or red dot.
 
Really, that Thunder Ranch is a fun tactical gun. It'll kill a deer, but there are better tools for the job. In my opion you'd better served with a Remington 870. If you like cabelas see: http://www.cabelas.ca/product/4665

I'm guessing the Remington's ergonomics will be way better suited to shooting accurately beyond 25m. I can almost guarantee you you will be far more accurate with the 870 with less work. It is slightly longer and heavier and that will make the recoil easier to manage and get you more enjoyable practice time. At just over 40" it will be very handy. And its cheaper.

We hunt in the thick bush as well. Farthest we've ever shot a deer is 40m. So - Each year me and my buddies 'qualify' for our hunt with a really simple test - we shoot 3 rounds, offhand, at a 1/2 deer target at a range of 30m. All three in a row have to be in the kill zone. Basically a fist sized group is required. Pretty easy, and confidence building, fun stuff. Of course we zero in at 100m as well, but the offhand shooting is what you'll probably be dealing with in the bush, and if you can get decent offhand (with a little time pressure thrown in - Say each shot in less than 3 seconds from a low ready position) you'll make the rested shots really easy. Happy hunting!

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Pro's:
Mechanically simple - break barrel so nothing to go wrong. >> yes & no - it's usually harder to have a cheaper or odd over-under repaired though
2 shots - so you have a follow on if you are unlucky with the first. >> yes
Short and light - so easy to use. >> easy to carry but not necessarily hit stuff with
Nice clear sights - good for slugs >> maybe - you might spend more on shells to find a brand the gun likes
Rail for scope if I want one >> stick with open sights in thick bush
Cheap - If I hate the sport after trying it for a season or two no huge loss >> might also be harder to sell if you want to upgrade later

Con's:
Tactical look - makes you look like a douche to a lot of people >> only a problem if you let it be
Short and Light - huge "boom" and probably a bad recoil >> this will probably lead to poor habits and a dislike for the gun - also consider muzzle blast in lower light when in choked woods >> 2nd shot no good if you're disoriented
Fixed open choke - so really only good for it's stated purpose deer at under 75 yards. >> maybe / maybe not but you won't be able to do anything about it

I'd love thoughts and opinions please. Thanks!

buy what will make you happy but nobody that recommended a pump gave you bad advice
 
I have found the ergos on the HS-12 to be as good if not better than most of the 870 and 590's i've tried. There is also a model with interchangeable chokes. The 18" barrel is a great length in the bush, and the OU will be considerably shorter and more maneuverable than an 18" pump gun. Bonus is that you can load slug in one barrel and buck or bird shot in another, flip the barrel selector and change your load instantly and almost silently. Try that with any pump.
 
Punching paper is fun, but a moving target such as a rabbit on the run will help with acquiring a moving target into your sights AND improve your field dressing skills.
 
first shotgun for deer only..rifled barrel. any pump or semi .i prefer a bolt as i have a scoped savage.i know guys use buckshot and a lot of guys who think they missed with buckshot usually have a dead deer they canot find.slugs for deer are a much better option as theres usually a larger blood trail.. over under for deer
is done but impact points can vary greatly. i used an 18 inch overunder with slugs first year .got rid of that in short order and moved to a dedicated slug gun with scope.scope makes a huge difference in low light.also in heavy bush it tends to get dark very fast where the scope would aford you better shooting light.plinking with slugs with an over under gets boring very fast with the limited ranges. just my 2 cents.
 
I'd go with a 26" barrel pump or semi /1100 with either screw in chokes or a fixed modified.The modified shoots Foster slugs just fine and buckshot as well as birdshot.As for a Mossberg 500 .......no aluminum receiver /steel action pins that work loose and bind the action.Neat video of them purposely dropped and the impact makes the pins shift. An O+U or side by each upland or duck gun is also fool proof.I have never lost a deer with buckshot or had them run off after being hit.......they just folded up and dropped.Harold
 
The signage and by-laws I have seen just says "Shotgun only" - it doesn't specify a projectile type.

Thanks all for the really helpful set of answers. Very kind of you all to chip in and very informative.

I'll take the drive out to Cabela's on the weekend and wave a couple of guns about to see how they feel. I have to say though that my thinking is now more along the lines of the Remington 870 - the comments about inconsistent shot placement for slugs with an over/under have me concerned, and with the mail in rebate that is a hellova good price.

Is the shot placement issue because of parallax or just the two barrels being slightly misaligned during the manufacturing process?

I don't think a dedicated slug gun is right for me. I would like the opportunity to shoot shot if I choose to.
 
linux99 said:
Is the shot placement issue because of parallax or just the two barrels being slightly misaligned during the manufacturing process?
Click to expand...

Parallax is something totally different. There is a great sticky in the optics sub-forum that explains it pretty well. (about halfway down this post: https://www.canadiangunnutz.com/for...-information?p=4690943&viewfull=1#post4690943 )

The barrels are purposefully set to converge during the manufacturing process (often at 40 yds or so). It is one of the factors that can set a good O/U apart from cheaper options. The idea is that pulling the trigger will have barrels hit the exact same PoI at some point beyond the muzzle though where that is exactly will be different by brand and specific gun (obviously some just don't ever have the same PoI). Nothing beats shooting lots to get a feel for how a particular O/U performs.

I think you will be very happy if you do go the 870 route. I've still got mine (first shotgun I ever bought) and have never considered selling it even though I don't use it much these days. Just too much insurance in knowing it will always be there for whatever I need.
 
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