ATRS Modern Sporter build

yohann160 said:
ACR sucks a$$.
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All the training Ive taken with it says otherwise.

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Pardon my French but I got rid of mine years ago. Don't want a 8lbs/$3000 shrubmaster that does nothing a 6lbs/$800 shrubmaster AR can't do. Were it a viable platform, it would be more popular. The only appeal North of the border is the NR tag.
 
Lmao. Oh that's rich.

Upon completing a nondescript amount of use with an ACR and hearing of a NR AR15 receiver set, the first thing you do is dump the ACR for the NR AR15. That isn't flattering for the ACR but I can see why you still choose to defend it. I left your .gif in the quote below for you to reference it.

DILLIGAF said:
All the training Ive taken with it says otherwise.

lfL0UvH.gif
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Since you mention it. You have made the point I was ultimately alluding to.

Economics 101: Your wants are unlimited and your means are limited. Therefore, a rational consumer will have to choose the best product to satisfy his wants.

You chose correctly.

DILLIGAF said:
Thats because I cant afford to keep it. Same reason I sold my Cadex to buy my MG34 . I also left the picture for you to reference. Before you judge someone maybee take a minute to think about the situation they are in.
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yohann160 said:
Since you mention it. You have made the point I was ultimately alluding to.

Economics 101: Your wants are unlimited and your means are limited. Therefore, a rational consumer will have to choose the best product to satisfy his wants.

You chose correctly.
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In your opinion he made the right choice, but not necessarily in others. I personally believe that while the ACR is a more expensive option that it is the better of the two rifles that doesn't mean it is as economical.

The ACR is in an essence a gun that will only be truly appreciated by someone who has the means to take it to its full extent. Otherwise you are just left with as you suggest a boat anchor of a rifle that can't do anything different then and $800 AR. if you're not going to make use of its many interesting features such as the quick-change barrel and caliber system, quick-change stock system or the quick-change lower (stanag vs AR mags), or the quick-change handguard, then you're probably right with going with an AR style rifle.

but for someone like myself who appreciates the ability to completely alter both the physical appearance and attributes that the rifle has without any tools is revolutionary.

One can take it from a 9.5" .300BLK PDW with PDW stock to a 14.5" 7.62x39 rifle with a enhanced folding stock, running AK mags and back to a 18.5" 6.5 grendal with a DMR stock and extended forend, then make it a 12.5" hard hitting .50 beowulf all in a matter of minutes. Caveat being you need enough funds to allow the platform to relize its full potential.

If you would rather have a dedicated rifle for each task, the ACR is not your best choice.
 
yohann160 said:
Lmao. Oh that's rich.

Upon completing a nondescript amount of use with an ACR and hearing of a NR AR15 receiver set, the first thing you do is dump the ACR for the NR AR15. That isn't flattering for the ACR but I can see why you still choose to defend it. I left your .gif in the quote below for you to reference it.
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Probably because the NR AR build will be significantly lighter, since he wants a non restricted rifle he can also do 3-gun with the weight savings probably makes it worth it to him. That doesn't make one better than the other, it makes one more suitable for a specific persons needs.

Anyone who builds a MV-s with quality parts and a good barrel that is capable of decent accuracy is not going to be spending $800 like a regular old AR like you compare the ACR to. The costs will be around $2000 even for a semi econo build.

You don't like the ACR? Well you're one of the few, most people simply think it's too expensive which is code for I really want one but I'm too poor to afford one, or my wife won't let me.
I've owned almost every non restricted 223 we can own and the ACR is still in my collection after my Swiss Arms, HK's, and Tavor have all be sold off. I don't think there is a better rifle available to us but due to the weight of it with a NR length barrel it isn't the most ideal rifle for certain shooting disciplines. That doesn't make it a bad rifle, it just makes it not the best at everything, there is always a trade-off, and that's why some of us choose to own multiple 223 semi auto rifles.
You mentioned price and weight as the things you didn't like, well compare the price and weight to most other NR rifles on the market, hmmmm... very similar.
 
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onetwentyish said:
In your opinion he made the right choice, but not necessarily in others. I personally believe that while the ACR is a more expensive option that it is the better of the two rifles that doesn't mean it is as economical.

The ACR is in an essence a gun that will only be truly appreciated by someone who has the means to take it to its full extent. Otherwise you are just left with as you suggest a boat anchor of a rifle that can't do anything different then and $800 AR. if you're not going to make use of its many interesting features such as the quick-change barrel and caliber system, quick-change stock system or the quick-change lower (stanag vs AR mags), or the quick-change handguard, then you're probably right with going with an AR style rifle.

but for someone like myself who appreciates the ability to completely alter both the physical appearance and attributes that the rifle has without any tools is revolutionary.

One can take it from a 9.5" .300BLK PDW with PDW stock to a 14.5" 7.62x39 rifle with a enhanced folding stock, running AK mags and back to a 18.5" 6.5 grendal with a DMR stock and extended forend, then make it a 12.5" hard hitting .50 beowulf all in a matter of minutes. Caveat being you need enough funds to allow the platform to relize its full potential.

If you would rather have a dedicated rifle for each task, the ACR is not your best choice.
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Those attributes are interesting prospects but I don't feel they stand up to scrutiny.

As far as quick caliber/barrel change, the appeal is lost when taking into account POI shift after changing said barrel; you still need to confirm zero. Swapping pre-assembled and zeroed uppers on an AR with various calibers and barrel lengths is more practical. Return to zero with an ACR after pulling the barrel is dubious at best.

I have the parts required for 6.5 Grendel build for MV-S, multiple uppers will follow.
 
cr5 said:
Probably because the NR AR build will be significantly lighter, since he wants a non restricted rifle he can also do 3-gun with the weight savings probably makes it worth it to him. That doesn't make one better than the other, it makes one more suitable for a specific persons needs.

Anyone who builds a MV-s with quality parts and a good barrel that is capable of decent accuracy is not going to be spending $800 like a regular old AR like you compare the ACR to. The costs will be around $2000 even for a semi econo build.

You don't like the ACR? Well you're one of the few, most people simply think it's too expensive which is code for I really want one but I'm too poor to afford one, or my wife won't let me.
I've owned almost every non restricted 223 we can own and the ACR is still in my collection after my Swiss Arms, HK's, and Tavor have all be sold off. I don't think there is a better rifle available to us but due to the weight of it with a NR length barrel it isn't the most ideal rifle for certain shooting disciplines. That doesn't make it a bad rifle, it just makes it not the best at everything, there is always a trade-off, and that's why some of us choose to own multiple 223 semi auto rifles.
You mentioned price and weight as the things you didn't like, well compare the price and weight to most other NR rifles on the market, hmmmm... very similar.
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Considering the AR and ACR have identical capabilities, yes the superior option is the one that is cheaper and lighter. The ACR is more expensive because nobody wants one therefore it isn't mass produced to drive down cost.

If the ACR had something worthwhile to offer, it would have greater success. Not just a cult following on the ACR forum and a few dozen Canadians who occasionally shoot their custom NR ACRs outside of a range.
 
yohann160 said:
Those attributes are interesting prospects but I don't feel they stand up to scrutiny.

As far as quick caliber/barrel change, the appeal is lost when taking into account POI shift after changing said barrel; you still need to confirm zero. Swapping pre-assembled and zeroed uppers on an AR with various calibers and barrel lengths is more practical. Return to zero with an ACR after pulling the barrel is dubious at best.

I have the parts required for 6.5 Grendel build for MV-S, multiple uppers will follow.
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What's wrong with having to confirm zero? Are you swapping calibers in the middle of a firefight? Do you make a habit of taking your guns apart and removing barrels or scopes on your hunting rifle the day before the big hunting trip?
No, because that would be stupid and in all practical worlds you would always take your rifle out a few days before the big trip or match and make sure everything is ready to go and zero'd properly.
I've also removed the barrel from my ACR more times than I can count and if you replace it with the same barrel the zero was never off by more than a click or two. When swapping from my 223 to my 300BLK barrel I knew how many clicks were needed to get me pretty close to zero and only a shot or two was needed to confirm things.
Sure a complete upper with optics is a better way to go if you can afford another $1000-$1500 to rig up. Consider that an upper is $400 ish, a quality barrel is $300+, and even if you pick a caliber you can use your 223 bolt in you still need another optic which is going to run $400-$2000 depending on your choice. So for someone saying the ACR is too expensive you don't seem to care how much it costs to have a NR AR with multiple uppers that does exactly the same thing as the ACR.
 
cr5 said:
Are you swapping calibers in the middle of a firefight? .
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I never thought of adding this to my training. Hey Still Alive you want to add a barrel swap under fire drill for our next training session.

Seriously tho! if I had deep pockets I would of kept my ACR with a 10.5 Barrel. But since im attracted to new shinny things I had to go for the MV-s
 
I wanted to buy an acr. I watched some reviews. After seeing that doing a barrel swap or simply taking the barrel off and back on shifter point of impact so much that you had to re-sight in the rifle i backed out. I held one after that and really liked it though. I think I’d want a light barrel though not the dmr version. It’s too bulky and heavy. Now with the new offerings coming out I can’t see why somebody would choose an acr over the new non restricted eh-r options. Acr is still a nice gun tho no doubt about it
 
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