What is your preference for a short to medium range thumper? I had a bolt action styer in 450 marlin and liked the round in a bolt but wasnt crazy about the gun. Ive got a few grand in the budget for a new toy and was toying with the ideal of rechambering my 450BM scout to something a little stouter. Any other short action big bores i should consider?
450 marlin vs 350 rem mag
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I am a big fan of the .350 Rem Mag, and have had a dozen of them over the years... I have two at the moment, both Ruger M77 MKII's, one walnut/blued, one synthetic/stainless. I would go with a .45/70 over the .450 Marlin... but currently have a .405 Win and .458 Win, both in Ruger No.1-H's. Don't be afraid of the .350 RM for loading supplies, they are out there and with a bit of searching you will be stocked up in short order. I load my blues .350 with Hornady 200 RN's and the stainless .350 with 250 grain Partitions... my .405 is feeding on 300 grain SP's.
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My understanding was the 450 marlin and 458x2 where identical except for a belt change on the marlin to prevent it being chambered in the wrong gun. I already have marlin brass and dies, but on the same hand I have a hundred or so 458 mag brass that could be cut down.
Yes Marlin made their own belt (wider than normal magnums) and the case is a 0.100" longer than 2".
450 Marlin dies work fine for loading 458x2.
- Location
- Haliburton County, Central Ontario
I have owned both, but now rely on my 1895 ABL in 45-70 as the ballistics are close enough and the ammo is ubiquitous. If you reload, it's even more available. Just sayin'. 
How about a 358Win?
What do you define as short to med range?
I have a 350RM and with careful loadwork push 225 gr Partitions pretty fast with a 200yd zero it drops about 24" at 400yds still doing over 2000 fps and 2100 ft lbs of energy.
I'm not trying to convince you that the 350 is amazing but rather show that you might get what you want from a 358Win.
A 358Win pushing a 225gr Partition at 2500fps and 200yd zero drops 11" at 300yds still doing 1970fps and has 1940ft lbs energy.
The advantage of the 358 is easier to find brass/ammo, shorter case lets you seat the bullets out further, longer neck holds bullets better, and burns less powder making less recoil.
The Bolt Face of your 450 Bushmaster is the same as the 358Win which will fit and feed perfectly through the same mags as the 308Win et al. Assuming you mean Ruger Scout. The 358Win is happy with a 20"bbl and doesn't lose much at 18", the 350RM does best around 22" with the muzzle blast turning a lot of heads at the range.
For me my 350RM was meant to be a 1 and done rifle and I only have 1 complaint; my Ruger 77mkII Stainless is heavy. I put some big miles on in a day in my mountains and the Ruger feels heavy at the end of it. The kids are usually toting my 7-08 which weighs 1-1/2lbs less.
Have fun with your build,
Willy
What do you define as short to med range?
I have a 350RM and with careful loadwork push 225 gr Partitions pretty fast with a 200yd zero it drops about 24" at 400yds still doing over 2000 fps and 2100 ft lbs of energy.
I'm not trying to convince you that the 350 is amazing but rather show that you might get what you want from a 358Win.
A 358Win pushing a 225gr Partition at 2500fps and 200yd zero drops 11" at 300yds still doing 1970fps and has 1940ft lbs energy.
The advantage of the 358 is easier to find brass/ammo, shorter case lets you seat the bullets out further, longer neck holds bullets better, and burns less powder making less recoil.
The Bolt Face of your 450 Bushmaster is the same as the 358Win which will fit and feed perfectly through the same mags as the 308Win et al. Assuming you mean Ruger Scout. The 358Win is happy with a 20"bbl and doesn't lose much at 18", the 350RM does best around 22" with the muzzle blast turning a lot of heads at the range.
For me my 350RM was meant to be a 1 and done rifle and I only have 1 complaint; my Ruger 77mkII Stainless is heavy. I put some big miles on in a day in my mountains and the Ruger feels heavy at the end of it. The kids are usually toting my 7-08 which weighs 1-1/2lbs less.
Have fun with your build,
Willy
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I looked at the 358 bit dont think its enough for what I want. 350rm is looking like what I want a thumper with decent range. This is is gonna be my do everyrhing gun if its a little more work to get the cartridge i want thats fine, if prefer to error on the side of overpowered. I shot my 450 marlin bolt well past 600 yard bit I was running a 14 power viper on it and needed alot of dial.
. RJI have a 450 marlin and 45-70 . Both are in 1895 marlins and I prefer the 450 simply because the rounds cycle smoother.
I understand that the 450 ammo isn't readily available so it isn't for everyone but I roll my own .
Sorry no experience with the 350 but the 450 kills critters dead.
I understand that the 450 ammo isn't readily available so it isn't for everyone but I roll my own .
Sorry no experience with the 350 but the 450 kills critters dead.
Although a 450 Marlin would be interesting in a model 7. The 350RM already is and it is a cannon. If you can find a Remington Custom Shop model 7KS that is the one to buy. I have a 20" 22" and 24" 350s and love them all. 22" Classic is the one I use the most.
I see, so you're looking at 400+yds? The perception of Medium Range has changed with GunWerks, Best of the West etc pushing the limits. Used to be factory ammo ballistics were given with "short range" as 100yd zero and "long range" with 200yd zero.
I'm hung up on 400yds because that's where I hit a full 1/2sec time of flight and 12" wind drift with the 225gr Partition. 1/2sec and 12" drift is my personal line in the sand for shooting game YMMV.
So far the 225gr NPT is the best trade-off for velocity and down range performance I have found. Lighter faster mono bullets still give up BC which equates to more wind drift. Heavier bullets give up velocity which means less expansion. Still waiting for a higher BC 358 bullet to come around....likely be waiting a long time.
If you do go 350RM pm me and I'll share some loading tips with you. I've pushed a lot of $$$ down the tube to get where I am velocity wise without sacrificing safety. Unfortunately I've sold as much of my brass as I could spare to help a fellow 350RM shooter but I can point you to some of my sources.
What is the exact rifle you intend to use? Long actions open up a bunch of possibilities if you want a WildCat ie 35-375Ruger or Factory...the 358 Norma Mag is a step-up from the 350RM and easier to deal with in several ways.
Short-actions- you really want all the mag length you can get...not sure about Belted Mag cartridges in a Ruger Scout Magazine(single stack??)
My favorite Short Action WildCat idea is the 35-7SAUM 8% more powder than the 350RM and more room in the mag to seat bullets out.
Common Short Action WildCat is 35WSM same case length as the 350RM but 10% more powder.
My new dream is a lighter and more powerful 358....35-280AI on a Kimber Montana...8% more powder than the 350RM and less bullet in the case. Sometimes I do pack in after Moose(none in the freezer yet so-far)
This is where I chase Moose, been right up to the foot of the far Mountain...just wasn't my day to pop Bullwinkle though
This is where I usually chase Mule Deer...Lots of up and down
Best wishes whatever you choose,
Willy
My new dream is a lighter and more powerful 358....35-280AI on a Kimber Montana...8% more powder than the 350RM and less bullet in the case. Sometimes I do pack in after Moose(none in the freezer yet so-far
JUST use a 338-06 AI jmo RJ
JUST use a 338-06 AI jmo RJ
A local friend and CGN member built a .35 WSM and has high regard for the cartridge.
The latest Hornady ("X") manual lists Ramshot Xterminator and Tac powders for the .358 Win with 200 grain bullets @ 2700 fps. Tac is also a good powder in the .350 RM, coupled with the Nosler 225 Accubond, you can really reach out with the cartridge. Changing up the powder and bullet is a much less expensive route than rebarrelling or rechambering.
Im thinking about doing this to my 450bm ruger scout, so 350 rm is the longest I can go, I also plan on keeping the barrel on the shorter side so this will effect cartridge and powder selection. On a side note where is that second picture taken it looks very familiar?
Takujualuk
CGN Regular
- Location
- Whitehorse, Yukon
I own both. The 450 with 400 grain bullets is a 200 yard hammer. The 350 Rem Mag is actually a good all round cartridge to 300 yards with the right bullets, sort of like an upscaled .308.
