Prohibited ar15

I presume most here agree the only solution is to outvote the gun grabbing Party. Most of my life my circle of friends and acquaintances were just co-workers or gun folk. I thought of myself as average or a little bit above. Over the last 6 or 7 years in retirement my circle of acquaintances veered off into the non gun populace. It has become apparent that there is a vast ocean of well meaning, of good character, working and retired people out there who are politically as stupid as the universe is large. There is little or no getting through to them as far as guns go.

My point is no amount of fact or reason regarding guns or protesting will sway them. I believe they can be swayed to vote against Trudeau on other issues. IMO, the most effective strategy is to win the election by putting resources into a broad front of the many other particular issues that stand a chance of waking them up.
 
Are we there yet?

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aakoksal said:
Jason maybe correct in his argument, doesn't make him right to call other's ideas stupid though...

I have more than a handful of ARs, handguns etc and worried about this ban talk for sure, and I also see there is a problem with how society is reacting to firearm ownership. I don't think to push full steam forward and doing nothing else is going to fix that, just like it never fixed it so far... We should be talking about things calming rest of the society that doesn't understand firearm ownership, not spreading the gap furhter...
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Bingo!

We have to do things differently and do some different things to close the gap otherwise we're going to lose another layer of our gun privileges. Unless we break out this cycle will repeat until they are all effectively gone.
 
guninhand said:
I presume most here agree the only solution is to outvote the gun grabbing Party. Most of my life my circle of friends and acquaintances were just co-workers or gun folk. I thought of myself as average or a little bit above. Over the last 6 or 7 years in retirement my circle of acquaintances veered off into the non gun populace. It has become apparent that there is a vast ocean of well meaning, of good character, working and retired people out there who are politically as stupid as the universe is large. There is little or no getting through to them as far as guns go.

My point is no amount of fact or reason regarding guns or protesting will sway them. I believe they can be swayed to vote against Trudeau on other issues. IMO, the most effective strategy is to win the election by putting resources into a broad front of the many other particular issues that stand a chance of waking them up.
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I don't agree that the ONLY way is to outvote the GG party; I think that the only way is to out smart them.

There's zero chance of getting all 2 million licensed gun owners plus X unlicensed ones to vote against the Libs on the single issue of guns. Those of us with real passion for our guns are not comfortable putting the entire future of gun ownership into 2 minutes at the ballot box.
 
DaveMachine said:
As far as communication and outreach is concerned, reaching out to the CCFR might not be a bad idea as they have experience in that area. No sense if duplicating efforts.
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DaveMachine said:
As far as communication and outreach is concerned, reaching out to the CCFR might not be a bad idea as they have experience in that area. No sense if duplicating efforts.
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Communication and outreach are two totally different, but complementary elements.

CCFR is only "communicating" with those of us in the gun community, that is "inreach" and until they are on speed dial with the heavy hitters in media (like Cukier has been for years) and called upon to clarify the gun owners perspective time and again on public media outlets they will remain an inreach pipeline. Sorry.

"Outreach" is coordinating members of the gun community to engage us in efforts to better society, help less fortunates and address the root causes of all crime. Our credibility as doers instead of whiners could then give us a platform to push politicians to real solution that do not involve us giving up anything to do with our guns. No Compromise by stealth, not by brute force or rights that we don't have.
 
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My450 said:
I'm newer to the whole shooting sports thing.

Being a data based guy I did a little fact checking ( a full 15 minutes on my coffee break for all the politico spouting rhetoric to the contrary) and came up with the following:

7,100,000 non-restricted firearms in the last year of registration (2011) growing at anywhere from 5-9.5% per voting cycle.
Near 800,000 restricted and growing more rapidly in the same time frame
This was a 1 in 4 households legally owning firearms

2017 data shows 34.7/100 people owning firearms with enhanced licensing and more difficult to purchase conditions which by my rather simple math seems to show almost 5,000,000 (to well over 13,000,000 total) more firearms in circulation (based on sales figures)

"Although violent crime is generally decreasing, the rate of firearm-related violent crime is decreasing at a faster pace than violent crime that does not involve firearms. There were about 1,800 fewer victims of firearm-related violent crime in 2012 than there were in 2009, resulting in a 27% decrease in the rate of firearm-related violent crime (Chart 1).2 Since 2009, the rate of violent offences involving other weapons has decreased 9%, while the rate of offences involving the use of physical force, threat, or no weapon has decreased 14%." From Statscan itself. So ownership is rising rapidly yet firearms violence is decreasing at a faster rate

What's my point?

With legally and responsibly owned firearms both on the rise and a near 35% of population I don't get why we as group are not voting as a block to help keep Ottawa closer to the facts and chasing far more dangerous and deadly segments of the population
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If you take the number of gun owners that there are - pick any number - then discount it by the number of voters who actually vote then further discount that by the number of gun owners who will vote on a gun issue as the only issue determining their vote and further discount that by the percentage that will vote the "way we want them to" on a gun issue and you might get 15% of gun owners on board.

These voters are also spread all over the country at random but concentrated in rural ridings which count little to the party and you start to see that we are not the unstoppable political force that we like to dream about.
 
bigplinker said:
Just an idea as far as setting up a go fund me, but maybe we could set one up for when the first time someone gets lynched by the law over the seemingly random changes to frts the rcmp keep coming up with, so that we can get the dream legal team behind the popo's first scape goat? Just an idea though, and I'm hoping it's not me:)
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Read post #95 to see why a win by an individual is not necessarily a win for us collectively.
 
The only way that we are going to be able to stop this liberal government is a class action lawsuit . they will ban or prohibit all our guns eventually . they have to be accountable not only to compensate all law abiding gun owners who purchased perfectly legal firearms , they have to compensate 100% for the firearms but also for the thousand of dollars that these owners have paid for safes , gunlocks , reloading equipment and accessories , if you own a gun that you cannot shoot or transport it is the same as confiscated .
I would think that the courts would have to agree , has their been any other case in history where they can ban or seize any item without compensation.?????????
 
spoon said:
The only way that we are going to be able to stop this liberal government is a class action lawsuit . they will ban or prohibit all our guns eventually . they have to be accountable not only to compensate all law abiding gun owners who purchased perfectly legal firearms , they have to compensate 100% for the firearms but also for the thousand of dollars that these owners have paid for safes , gunlocks , reloading equipment and accessories , if you own a gun that you cannot shoot or transport it is the same as confiscated .
I would think that the courts would have to agree , has their been any other case in history where they can ban or seize any item without compensation.?????????
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Ask the 12(x) folks.
 
guninhand said:
I presume most here agree the only solution is to outvote the gun grabbing Party. Most of my life my circle of friends and acquaintances were just co-workers or gun folk. I thought of myself as average or a little bit above. Over the last 6 or 7 years in retirement my circle of acquaintances veered off into the non gun populace. It has become apparent that there is a vast ocean of well meaning, of good character, working and retired people out there who are politically as stupid as the universe is large. There is little or no getting through to them as far as guns go.

My point is no amount of fact or reason regarding guns or protesting will sway them. I believe they can be swayed to vote against Trudeau on other issues. IMO, the most effective strategy is to win the election by putting resources into a broad front of the many other particular issues that stand a chance of waking them up.
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I'm not of the opinion that I'll vote for a party I don't agree with on principal, simply because they will help me keep my guns.
I'm tired of the politics in this country, neh the world, being the choice of lesser evils. It's fecking depressing. For the people, by the people, used to be meaning of democracy. Now we have whichever party in power plowing their agendas through the legal gears as fast as they can, with little to no foresight, before the next party comes along 3 or 7 years later and does the exact same thing. All we end up with is an ever increasing layer cake of bureaucratic excrement, all funded by the chumps in this world, ie. the Tax Payer.
You'd think something like the internet would help revolutionize the world and the way it's run.
Instead, all it's breeding is complacency, and the overwhelming sense of powerlessness. Almost all of the information that has ever been is available at our fingertips, but instead we spend our time patting/stabbing each other on/in the back, and laughing at cat videos.
Fecking cat videos.
Where's Canada's Charlton Heston when you need him. That's what we need, to help the cause.
A gun loving Canadian Hero.
Anyone know any of those?
 
I wonder if Wolverine will refund my $50 WK180C deposit if it's banned before they ship it? ;)

But in all seriousness, reading this thread has actually made me sad for a couple reasons. One, seeing how divided this community is. Everyone here is trying to reach a common goal but nobody agrees how to get there it seems. Two, that there seems to be some misguided hope in a Conservative government. I know there are some Conservatives that are using firearms to gain some appeal with voters, but being pro-gun seems like political suicide for any politician. Can you really see any serious PM candidate saying on national television before an election that they are pro gun? With the number of gun violence that's happened in Toronto this summer? NO WAY. To me, it's a doomed cause. The Conservatives wont save us. The only thing saving our guns are the sheer quantity of them out there (logistical nightmare taking them from people) and also the Americans. Their gun culture is just too thick and too close to us for us to out-write ban firearms without some change being implemented in the USA first (or at least the border states).
 
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