On a serious note ..... I'd be surprised if any magnums, esp. med to large bore magnums are selling very well at all. The used market seems to be very well stocked in these items from the short mags right on through to the belted.
Whats with the 375H&H haters?
- Thread starter Dosing
- Start date
On a serious note ..... I'd be surprised if any magnums, esp. med to large bore magnums are selling very well at all. The used market seems to be very well stocked in these items from the short mags right on through to the belted.
375 Ruger may have a recent following, but to call the 375 H&H 'obsolete' is generous to say the least.
Cheers
Jay
sharp shooter
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- Essex county (Ontario)
Why are any of you people even acknowledging Gatehouses comments.
And Gatehouse, why do you care so much about the 375 Ruger and putting down the H&H? Did you design it or something?
And Gatehouse, why do you care so much about the 375 Ruger and putting down the H&H? Did you design it or something?
- Location
- West Quebec
375H&H killing game Dead since August 1912
https://thebiggamehuntingblog.com/i...atile-big-game-hunting-cartridge-of-all-time/
Rob
- Location
- Somewhere on the Hudson Bay Coast
I doubt it. .375 Ruger chambered rifles can be acquired cheaply, so folks who would not ordinarily have chosen a .375 rifle are now trying it. No one who uses a .375 H&H would switch to the Ruger, which essentially does the same thing, anymore than they would switch to a .308 if they were shooting a .30/06. Less is not more. There is not enough ballistic difference between the .375 Ruger and the .375 H&H to gain any practical advantage from one over the other in the field with normal weight for caliber bullets.
I can think of a couple of disadvantages the Ruger has though. The larger diameter .375 Ruger cartridge reduces magazine capacity relative to the .375 H&H. Another is that when long bullets are loaded, the powder capacity of the short-fat Ruger cartridge is negatively impacted more so than the longer cartridge, unless chambered in a magnum length action where the bullet can be seated long. When I was playing with the .375 Ruger Alaskan, I was unable to get velocities with 380s that I got from a .375 H&H with the same length barrel.
The .375 Ruger is a good cartridge, particularly when loaded with 260 gr Accubonds. It is available in affordable rifles. It fills the same ballistic niche as other large case .375s. But it has made nothing obsolete.
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I suspect that in most cases, the medium and big bore rifles end up on the sale thread due to an impulse purchase followed by the inability to handle the recoil.
Some shooters are very utilitarian and pragmatic, buying a 375 for a one-time African hunt, then selling it if they know it may never be used again.
Some shooters are very utilitarian and pragmatic, buying a 375 for a one-time African hunt, then selling it if they know it may never be used again.
Agreed, I've often heard the following advice, something like: "300/338 Win Mag is the best hunting cartridge but just go and buy a 270 Win/308 Win!".
Even a 338 Win Mag takes a bit of training to shoot as well as a low-recoil 270 Win and most hunters limit their training to 1 box of ammo a year!
I suspect that real underlying issues are: recoil and ammo costs both of which are simply too much for the average big magnum owner.
Alex
I had a Sako AV Deluxe in 375 H&H and it was a very nice gun but it didn’t fit the idea I had for a caliber like that, mainly something with a good set of irons that I could quickly take a scope on and off. If I buy another, it would be for the romance and history of the cartridge and I’d use it primarily with iron sites.
Patrick
Patrick
Bigfoot 870
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- Nova Scotia
The only .375 hate I've heard, is from .375 Ruger owners, crapping on the .375 H&H.
If I was young, healthy, and could afford it, I would buy an H&H and go out to the NW to hunt a big moose or a brown bear.
Now, I simply dream, and try not to kick myself too hard, for not doing it when I could have.........
If I was young, healthy, and could afford it, I would buy an H&H and go out to the NW to hunt a big moose or a brown bear.
Now, I simply dream, and try not to kick myself too hard, for not doing it when I could have.........
Johnn Peterson
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Chemainus B.C.
Well stated.
Make no mistake about it, the H&H is an obsolete cartridge. This doesn't mean that it is useless, or anyone "hates" it- just that it is obsolete. People still drive obsolete vehicles all the time.
Everything about the H&H case design is obsolete. Nobody is making long tapered cases anymore, and haven't done so in half a century or more. The only company that seems to be introducing new belted cartridges is Weatherby, and their new cartridges have flopped.
Belts and tapers are gone the way of the rotary phone. You can still make a call on a rotary phone, but it's clearly obsolete.
Everything about the H&H case design is obsolete. Nobody is making long tapered cases anymore, and haven't done so in half a century or more. The only company that seems to be introducing new belted cartridges is Weatherby, and their new cartridges have flopped.
Belts and tapers are gone the way of the rotary phone. You can still make a call on a rotary phone, but it's clearly obsolete.
.308 seems to be more popular these days, especially with new rifle sales. Most people aren't handloaders, and factory 308 and 3006 performance is quite close, so shooting a moose with a 308 and 3006 yields the same results. Plus people who are interested in precision shooting or dynamic shooting that want a 30 caliber are all choosing 308. There isn't much incentive to go 3006 anymore.
For the tiny percentage of people that want to use 380 gr bullets in a 375, a longer action may be desirable. I haven't tried heavier than 350 gr, which was at least on par or higher with an H&H. Really, if a person wants to use heavier bullets than 300 on a regular basis, a 416 is the real solution. Fortunately, Ruger thought of that, too.
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It wasn't just the Ruger that made the H&H obsolete, it was modern cartridge design.
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Anything over 30 cal is always going to have less sales than the 30's and under. And because the larger guns are more expensive to shoot, more recoil etc, when you need to sell something to fund another gun, people tend to keep their trusty 308 or 7RM and sell their 375 H&H or 45/70. 45/70 lever guns are definitely are one of those items that seem like a great idea but rarely get more than a few boxes of ammo through them.
unstableryan
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Beautiful Okanagan Valley
My 45/70 is going to eventually wear out. Then I will buy another one and try again. I agree there's only so many 480gr at 1700 rounds you can shoot in one sitting, but 405's at 1100 are fun all day.
Personally, I think the post suggesting that it has to do with people buying the 375 H&H as part of a dream, in some cases, has merit. A person buys a rifle because they dream of going to Africa on a dangerrous gane hunt, ot to Alaska or Russia on a brown bear, and maybe moose, hunt and want a rifl that will handle it well. Over time, they realize that they may never get to fulfill that dream, for whatever reasons, and have found that they really didn't need the rifle any more, and it goes up for sale.
For others, the cost of the ammo, as compared to their 30-06/300 or whatever their main hunting rifle is, and the recoil is such, that they do not shoot, or want to shoot, that rifle anymore, and it goes up for sale.
For others, the desire for something new drives the sale of their 375 H&H for the newer Ruger, or whatever (i.e Weatherby). No, I do not think that it is because the H&H is obsolete, it is just less desirable than the new rifle/cartridge, to that person. Others like the history, romance, nostalgia of a rifle/cartridge and base their choice on that. All fine! It is why we have a freedom of choice.
And no one should have to justify to another why he chooses one particluar rifle or cartridge over another, to any other person. It is their choice, to do whatthey want to do with their money, regardless of what someone else thinks.
For me, when I was having shoulder issues and recoil was a factor in the pleasure of shooting, I chose to build a 376 Steyr. A shorter cartridge that fits in a regular long action rifle, with less case capacity, similar performance, and could be built on the lh Ruger rifle I had as a donor rifle. The rifle is a pussycat to shoot of the bench, with the 260 gr AccuBond at 2632 fps out of a 21" barrel, and prints 1/2" groups. It has performed well on elk and bison to date. Hope to use it in Africa someday, but if not, it will definitely see more service here in north america.
For others, the cost of the ammo, as compared to their 30-06/300 or whatever their main hunting rifle is, and the recoil is such, that they do not shoot, or want to shoot, that rifle anymore, and it goes up for sale.
For others, the desire for something new drives the sale of their 375 H&H for the newer Ruger, or whatever (i.e Weatherby). No, I do not think that it is because the H&H is obsolete, it is just less desirable than the new rifle/cartridge, to that person. Others like the history, romance, nostalgia of a rifle/cartridge and base their choice on that. All fine! It is why we have a freedom of choice.
And no one should have to justify to another why he chooses one particluar rifle or cartridge over another, to any other person. It is their choice, to do whatthey want to do with their money, regardless of what someone else thinks.
For me, when I was having shoulder issues and recoil was a factor in the pleasure of shooting, I chose to build a 376 Steyr. A shorter cartridge that fits in a regular long action rifle, with less case capacity, similar performance, and could be built on the lh Ruger rifle I had as a donor rifle. The rifle is a pussycat to shoot of the bench, with the 260 gr AccuBond at 2632 fps out of a 21" barrel, and prints 1/2" groups. It has performed well on elk and bison to date. Hope to use it in Africa someday, but if not, it will definitely see more service here in north america.
375 Ruger 101gr H2O case capacity
Cartridge : .375 Ruger
Bullet : .375, 350, Woodleigh RN WeldCore 46B
Useable Case Capaci: 84.696 grain H2O = 5.499 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 3.340 inch = 84.84 mm
375 H&H 95gr H2O case capacity
Cartridge : .375 H.& H. Mag.
Bullet : .375, 350, Woodleigh RN WeldCore 46B
Useable Case Capaci: 78.252 grain H2O = 5.081 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 3.600 inch = 91.44 mm
