STAG 10 Build Accuracy 1.5-2 MOA

J

JNA

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Hello Team,

I completed a STAG 10 build and after taking it to the range a couple of times, I have not been that impressed with the results.

I have the following build:

STAG 10 upper and lower with Stag bolt.

McGowen 1 in 11 twist barrel 20"

SLR handguard and adjustable gas block at 0.875.

Geissele national match trigger set at 2-2.5lbs.

Geissele scope mount, charging handle and Bushnell HDMR2 scope.

Armaspec .308 buffer tube spring

Currently with Federal 168 and 175 Gold Medal Match my best groups are averaging around 1.5 MOA with 5 shot groups.

With Hornady superformance and match it goes up to about 2MOA.

I am not the best nor worst shooter, but can get below .5 MOA with factory match ammo on my TRG-22, but just can't seem to get below 1.5 MOA for some reason.

I have also let the rifle cool and have taken breaks between the 5 shot groups so don't think its an overheating issue.

I haven't yet started handloading for the rifle, but am at the point where I think it might be time to put it on the chopping block.

The rifle was built by a reputable gunsmith and I have checked both the mount and the screws and I am properly torqued.

Any advice is well received.
 
Might be worth you while to try some different ammo, some barrels can be picky. You could also try turning the gas off and shooting a few groups to see if it changes.

If you do find it is the ammo, handloads may be your best bet.
 
I'd also be disappointed. Make sense to try more ammo but 2 different GMM ammo should do better.
Or remove the muzzle device? Do you feel comfortable/stable behind it?

For a little comparison I'm breaking in a home build Stag .308. Less than 200 rounds, all surplus ball ammo. Still need tuning to run smooth and reliably. Light-weight hunting rig: MRA pencil barrel, 1-6 scope.
This morning I shot 10 rounds of Austrian surplus in 1.5" at 100yds. Prone with cheap front rest and imperfect shooting position-technique.
 
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Feel pretty comfortable behind the rifle. However I do have a standard Magpul style rear stock, but I use a rear stock and a Harris bipod up front.

I may be overgassing the rifle as previously we had some issues with not enough gas to cycle the rifle.

Might pick up a box or two of not match ammo and see what the group's are like.
 
How much semi auto precision shooting experience do you have? I ask because I had similar accuracy issues when I built a similar level Stag 10. Lots more going on with a semi and they can accentuate your shooting fundamental weaknesses. For me the solution was to build a more solid shooting position, load the bipod, and bring the rifle in with more force in the pocket. And follow through is very important as mentioned. Group size has gone from 1.5-2MOA down to just under MOA. I can shoot sub 0.5M0A with my precision 6,5CM rifle for reference.
 
What are you using for sights?
Have you tried any other ammo?
I haven't found a rifle yet that shoots Hornady Superformance well. My 6.5CM semi won't even cycle it reliably, it's too hot for the action unless I dial the gas block way back.
Semi auto rifles are not as easy to shoot well as a bolt action. It takes time, some real concentration, and lots of practice to do things right and consistently every time.
 
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Epoxy7 said:
The golden rule is if it doesn’t like 168-175 smk then try 167 etc Lapua match. You might be just below the accuracy node. Loading the 168 and 175 smk to 43.4 to 44 grains of varget should do the trick. If not then see the golden rule. If none of that works then likely you have a bad barrel or something was damaged ie crown, chamber etc.

Last but not least I’d follow through. Extremely important with semi auto.
Click to expand...

Not sure what you mean by follow through.
 
GUNNZ said:
How much semi auto precision shooting experience do you have? I ask because I had similar accuracy issues when I built a similar level Stag 10. Lots more going on with a semi and they can accentuate your shooting fundamental weaknesses. For me the solution was to build a more solid shooting position, load the bipod, and bring the rifle in with more force in the pocket. And follow through is very important as mentioned. Group size has gone from 1.5-2MOA down to just under MOA. I can shoot sub 0.5M0A with my precision 6,5CM rifle for reference.
Click to expand...

No previous experience shooting precision semi auto.

And will look into shooting fundamentals for semi-auto
 
cr5 said:
What are you using for sights?
Have you tried any other ammo?
I haven't found a rifle yet that shoots Hornady Superformance well. My 6.5CM semi won't even cycle it reliably, it's too hot for the action unless I dial the gas block way back.
Semi auto rifles are not as easy to shoot well as a bolt action. It takes time, some real concentration, and lots of practice to do things right and consistently every time.
Click to expand...

Sight is HDMR2 3.5-21X SCOPE

ammo tried: federal gold medal match 168 and 175.
Hornady 168 match and Hornady 168 superformance
Norma 168 grain.

All factory ammunition
 
JNA said:
Not sure what you mean by follow through.
Click to expand...

Trying to watch your bullet hit the target, you should be in a stable shooting position, looking through the scope at the target through the shot, a lot of people (I'm not saying you're doing it) have a tendency to look up over the scope as soon as they pull the trigger.


JNA said:
No previous experience shooting precision semi auto.

And will look into shooting fundamentals for semi-auto
Click to expand...

It's not that much different, you just have to deal with the extra recoil impulses generated by the bolt and buffer travelling back, hitting the back of the buffer tube, then slamming home again. The bullet should be long gone while all this is happening but it can force you to change/reset your position between shots.


JNA said:
Sight is HDMR2 3.5-21X SCOPE

ammo tried: federal gold medal match 168 and 175.
Hornady 168 match and Hornady 168 superformance
Norma 168 grain.

All factory ammunition
Click to expand...

Try some 155gr match ammo or even just try some different 168 range stuff.
1.5-2 moa consistently isn't really terrible, my Modern Hunter in 6.5 Creedmoor is only consistently shooting around 1 moa (sometimes more, sometimes less) with a Proof CF wrapped barrel and handloads. My Krieger barreled M14 is around the same.

Keep in mind that some guys like to post that their rifle shoots sub moa when in reality they only actually shot one lucky sub moa group out of a whole day of shooting then claim that their rifle is easy sub moa. I consider the claim to shoot sub moa to mean that it does it every group, every day.
I see very few posts with guys actually showing pics of their groups, definitely never any sub 1 moa 10 round groups. When someone claims that their rifle shoots sub 1 moa I don't believe it unless they show a picture of their targets that don't have 200 holes in them with 5 close ones circled. Even if they did I'd be skeptical as I have owned a lot of expensive semi auto rifles with quality barrels and very very few of them would shoot as well as a lot of the guys on this site claim their factory barreled rifle will shoot.
 
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I have seen alot of people in the last year or two pour a ton of $ into BCL 102 and Stag 10. Not sure why, but all the ones I have seen are less than impressive with factory ammo and or handloads.

Why? I dont know. Just something I have seen many times recently.
 
Longboat said:
I have seen alot of people in the last year or two pour a ton of $ into BCL 102 and Stag 10. Not sure why, but all the ones I have seen are less than impressive with factory ammo and or handloads.

Why? I dont know. Just something I have seen many times recently.
Click to expand...

Money doesn't make good shooters...most people do it for fun, a few weekends a year in the good weather and not to mention most only run "mid grade" factory ammo. Many stick to factory triggers and think a $500 scope is $$$/high end.

What do you expect from the average Canadian hobbyist shooter using a $2000 semi auto rifle...?
 
Follow through is a huge thing shooting a semi. I have good days and bad days shooting my stag 10. If I'm not focused my stag 10 is a 1.5 moa rifle or worse. If I'm on the ball focused and in a good mood it's a .6-.7 moa rifle sometimes less if I'm really on my a game. Like epoxy7 said the lock time is different than a bolt action and you need to really be looking for it to notice it. The time between trigger break and ignition is almost 2x that of a bolt action. A lot can happen in that split second to mess up a group. Your heart could beat or you start to exhale that's all it takes with a semi auto.

A good solid rest and rear bag make a world of difference. I bipod you dont need to preload is a huge help too. Going from a Harris to a remple will shrink your groups substantially. You still need follow through though. The rifle needs to recoil too so a sled isnt the best way to do accuracy testing either.

The best thing you can do is find a comfortable repeatable position and just practice. There is no replacement for trigger time

A good rear stock that doesnt hop in the bag will help too. A luth ar MBA 3 or magpul prs. Something with a long flat spot on the bottom. A saber tube is going to catch the bag and make the rifle hop on recoil. You need it to slide. This is also magnified with a bipod you need to pre load. They hop.

Wind. Watch the wind. Watch for it to change. A 10 mph cross wind that gusts to 15 or 20 is going to open up your group too. Even at 100.
 
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