Question for Hunt and camp boss's - hunting drama
- Thread starter GuiltySpark
- Start date
Rented our current residence out while still working and living in town. Did this for about four years. Almost zero trouble, the odd broken thing. Rented to hunters, fishermen and just plain holiday types. I will repeat a couple things that have already been said. Money is upfront, no exceptions. The only time I got stiffed was when I broke this rule. Take a damage deposit and make a person responsible, as you are not around. That person has to deal with the BS, not you, and do not back off, keep the money if they leave a mess. Pay someone to clean up and give them the money. Why should you lose time and effort? Any trouble tell them to hit the road, lot of responsible hunting types out there no reason to deal the irresponsible ones.
From what you have described you have just had bad luck through poor selection of tenants, which is quite common when renting out any sort property. Myself and 2 partners purchased land which had an old cabin. We constructed a new two story building. We purchased more land that held two more cabins that we rented out to non hunters. By this time we had a lot of time and money invested with 3 cabins and 600 acres owned and another 1000 under lease. We ran the main camp for 20 years without to much difficulty. The rental cabins we had no issues with as we rented to chosen family members.
You must have a written rental agreement and the money up front plus a damage deposit. No exceptions. When renting to a group of hunters there will be one or two fellas that will be your contacts. These fellas will sign on the groups behalf and be totally responsible for the groups actions and damages. Who they choose to be in there hunt group is there business as they are responsible regardless. There must be crystal clear written rules that must be adhered to. You will have to operate a little different than I because you will not be present during the hunt weeks. I was there so I could keep a close eye on things. You also need to be fully insured, not only for fire and theft but liability in case one of these hunters slips and falls on the way to the outhouse and then tries to sue you. Remember you have loaded guns, alcohol, and potential red necks not of your choosing using your property. You need signed documentation and insurance, and tell your insurance company your renting, as they don't like surprises. We had one fella get badly cut with a chain saw and another break his foot on the way to outhouse. Neither resulted in a law suit but we as owners were glad we had insurance.
In the last years I was running the show I charged $300. per man. Which gave you a place to sleep, hunt, good food, and your share of general costs such as gas and propane for cooking and the generator. We had a camp cook/manager that purchased and prepared all the meals and generally took care of the camp interior. He was paid $500 per week which was cheap. Actually the price of $300 per week per man was cheap, as I was not trying to make money just cover costs.
I had capacity to sleep 12 hunters plus the cook. With your capacity of 16 you would need at least a basic minimum rental fee based on 12 men then so much per man up to 16. That way you will won't get some fella paying you say $1000 bucks per week for your cabin then bringing another 15 guys up and charging them $500 a head. I think you eluded to already experiencing this.
Your really running a mini rental business here. And although your trying to be a nice guy and that is most commendable in this day and age you have to play it smart, cover you a$$ well, and be very particular who you rent to, with firm rules in place. If this all sounds a little overwhelming and not for you, well maybe it isn't. But you can take a break and not rent it out at all until you think it all over and check things out at your own pace. Hope this helps some.
You must have a written rental agreement and the money up front plus a damage deposit. No exceptions. When renting to a group of hunters there will be one or two fellas that will be your contacts. These fellas will sign on the groups behalf and be totally responsible for the groups actions and damages. Who they choose to be in there hunt group is there business as they are responsible regardless. There must be crystal clear written rules that must be adhered to. You will have to operate a little different than I because you will not be present during the hunt weeks. I was there so I could keep a close eye on things. You also need to be fully insured, not only for fire and theft but liability in case one of these hunters slips and falls on the way to the outhouse and then tries to sue you. Remember you have loaded guns, alcohol, and potential red necks not of your choosing using your property. You need signed documentation and insurance, and tell your insurance company your renting, as they don't like surprises. We had one fella get badly cut with a chain saw and another break his foot on the way to outhouse. Neither resulted in a law suit but we as owners were glad we had insurance.
In the last years I was running the show I charged $300. per man. Which gave you a place to sleep, hunt, good food, and your share of general costs such as gas and propane for cooking and the generator. We had a camp cook/manager that purchased and prepared all the meals and generally took care of the camp interior. He was paid $500 per week which was cheap. Actually the price of $300 per week per man was cheap, as I was not trying to make money just cover costs.
I had capacity to sleep 12 hunters plus the cook. With your capacity of 16 you would need at least a basic minimum rental fee based on 12 men then so much per man up to 16. That way you will won't get some fella paying you say $1000 bucks per week for your cabin then bringing another 15 guys up and charging them $500 a head. I think you eluded to already experiencing this.
Your really running a mini rental business here. And although your trying to be a nice guy and that is most commendable in this day and age you have to play it smart, cover you a$$ well, and be very particular who you rent to, with firm rules in place. If this all sounds a little overwhelming and not for you, well maybe it isn't. But you can take a break and not rent it out at all until you think it all over and check things out at your own pace. Hope this helps some.
Somebody needs to steer the boat.You are in a rental situation and not running a hunting camp.These are two completely different things.Have one of the hunters be your go to guy and deal with him only. Money up front. Arrival and departure pre determined. You and him meet at the end of their stay and disguss camp condition and the likely hood of hunting the following year.Keep it simple but strick. Running a hunt camp takes a lot of effort and talent. Not everybody is good at it
- Location
- Blaster land, Okanagan BC
^^^Good advice
I know this is a bit different than renting a suite or apartment but the most important thing you can do is screen your prospective renters as much as possible and set your rules and regs down in a rental contract. Taking deposits and getting payment in full before handing over keys is also an important step.
blasted_saber
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- A blue part of Ontario
We invite any prospective hunters for a work weekend in the summer to see if they fit in and if to get an idea of their work ethic and how they handle guns.
They pay a hunt deposit before hand and the rest on arrival at the camp for the hunt. No if ands or buts. We make sure they are well aware of the camp rules and how we operate our hunts long before the hunt so that there is no confusion.
Off topic suggestion: I would require anyone hunting at your place to have insurance specifically covering hunting and firearms incidents such as an OFAH membership.
They pay a hunt deposit before hand and the rest on arrival at the camp for the hunt. No if ands or buts. We make sure they are well aware of the camp rules and how we operate our hunts long before the hunt so that there is no confusion.
Off topic suggestion: I would require anyone hunting at your place to have insurance specifically covering hunting and firearms incidents such as an OFAH membership.
This is good advice. Make one person the manager -- they are responsible for the problems and answer to you. Bickering and money are the work of the manager.
If this property is in Ontario I might be interested. Want to pm some details?
Trimmer 905
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
BINGO!! That's the mistake the OP is making and why he's being jerked around. He's trying to do business with friends and relatives (bad,bad idea) and needs to run his cabin rental as an "arms length" commercial enterprise. Rent the property----collect the money,pure and simple. Let someone else who has the "camp boss" job (there's usually one in every camp) have the headaches.
Sad, but not surprising to hear. When you see what people do to hotel/motel property, this is not unusual. There are people who would cheat their own grandmothers without hesitation, and, not surprisingly, often are the ones with money.
This is pretty much spot on, and why I run a hunt camp, and not a business.....
I seek to find like minded individuals that don’t mind sharing the work...... and when you have enough guys there really isn’t much.....
Keep the wood box full, do the dishes, sweep the floors......
But, unlike op, I am a participating hunter in the camp.....
As camp “boss”, I make sure we are all safe and coordinate efforts etc....
If it’s just a rental for the OP, then rules and boundaries need set and agreements need signed......
It that’s not building a camp of guys..... that’s just a profit seeking venture
Well i am in NB. So East for you. I never heard of such a thing in my life either till online.
I thought it was a Ontario, Quebec thing to be honest.
Never heard of hunting parties..shared tags any of that stuff. There were always groups of french guys from the North shore that all camped together here so i guess that would be a group...
They do more drinking then hunting though.
No locals i know do it. I hunt alone as do most here. Maybe with a friend once in a odd while.
I don't understand the idea of a hunting party myself. Holds no appeal to me whatsoever.
To each thier own i guess. Doesen't sound enjoyable to me whatsoever.
I prefer to enjoy the woods by myself. Not with half the neighborhood.
Hey OP,
Be the camp boss. It 's OK..
I'm in s similar situation. The way I see it is: I own the land, I own the blinds, I own the food plots, I own the cabins, and I pay the taxes, consequently I make the rules... Period!
That said, I NEED and enjoy the help for sure. There are food plots to tend, firewood to chop,etc... sweat equity is as good or better than cash in the bank. (Note that I never had any peeps pay for materials).
At the end of the day, your peeps are getting to hunt your land (for either cash or work in-lieu). A transaction that more than favors them, given the costs of buying and maintaining land and dealing with peeps. You should have no problem getting peeps that are willing to abide by your rules. Otherwise, cut them loose.
(maybe the wine talking...)
Cheers,
Be the camp boss. It 's OK..
I'm in s similar situation. The way I see it is: I own the land, I own the blinds, I own the food plots, I own the cabins, and I pay the taxes, consequently I make the rules... Period!
That said, I NEED and enjoy the help for sure. There are food plots to tend, firewood to chop,etc... sweat equity is as good or better than cash in the bank. (Note that I never had any peeps pay for materials).
At the end of the day, your peeps are getting to hunt your land (for either cash or work in-lieu). A transaction that more than favors them, given the costs of buying and maintaining land and dealing with peeps. You should have no problem getting peeps that are willing to abide by your rules. Otherwise, cut them loose.
(maybe the wine talking...)
Cheers,
- Location
- Saskatchewan
Yes, hunt camp groups are mainly an ON and QC thing. A fine tradition, but not all positive. It is sad that people sometimes behave in the way described previously. But bad behaviour knows no geographic boundaries. This stuff happens all over Canada. And the behaviour is worth discussing. I only get upset when I read on forms such as these when someone proposes an ethical or behaviour limit to hunting that is in addition to the legal regulations, and they get the inevitable push back.
If we think hunting is an important part of our lives, we should accept that the ONLY way it will continue to be supported by the non-hunting public is if it passes the "sniff test" - If an activity or behaviour does not meet the standards any reasonable person would agree with, it is doomed. We need to put peer pressure on ourselves as hunters, and clean this type of behaviour up.
Well stated Long.
I pesonally have no interest in a group hunt at all.
If one enjoys it then that is thier business though.....and yes you are right. Infighting and drama is no good.
I guess maybe anyone having these problems needs to put thier foot down.
If the party does not listen then maybe they should get the boot.
