A statement that needs to be made.

People who cry for more gun control often cite Australia and the UK as examples. Well yeah, they're islands so it's much MUCH easier to police the borders...and yet illegal firearms still seep into their countries. When living next door to one of the world's largest firearms producers with the world's longest undefended border, the dynamic of illegally imported firearms changes greatly. If anyone thinks further gun control measures in Canada, up to and including a complete ban, will make a lick of difference, then they truly are deluded ignoramuses that are perfectly happy to handover all rights and privileges to their government overlords.
 
Ladies and gentlemen let's not fight here and now, me might have a slightly different opinions on things but let's face it we should have a right to defend ourselves in life threatening situations, especially ladies,my friends daughter was stubbed to death. Thanks god mass murders doesn't happen often but murders happen almost daily. So what is a solution in this case? Yes we all want to live in a world with no bad people around just as some wanted to build a communism! Did they fail ? Yes !
Humans are who they are, we need a strong law's and punishment for crimes and leave good people alone!
 
extrasauce said:
People who cry for more gun control often cite Australia and the UK as examples. Well yeah, they're islands so it's much MUCH easier to police the borders...and yet illegal firearms still seep into their countries. When living next door to one of the world's largest firearms producers with the world's longest undefended border, the dynamic of illegally imported firearms changes greatly. If anyone thinks further gun control measures in Canada, up to and including a complete ban, will make a lick of difference, then they truly are deluded ignoramuses that are perfectly happy to handover all rights and privileges to their government overlords.
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When people cite UK and Australia they are also very unaware of how many fully automatics and hand grenades that got smuggled in to the countries.
 
IRUNGUNS said:
This statement will not sit well with some people, but it needs to be said.

The world has lived through some devastating atrocities. I’m sure I speak for everyone when I say our hearts go out to the families and people that were affected by these heinous crimes.

You will never be able to stop the premeditated evil that some people are capable of. This unhinged individual was very calculated in his attack, it took time and considerable planning to execute. This individual had no remorse for his actions and no regard for life including his own.

It is not the firearms, storage laws or the magazine capacity restrictions that will stop atrocities like this.

As harsh as it is, people like that are broken, they need to be put down, plain and simple.

The world can be a cruel place and unfortunately some people are unable to cope and conform to societies rules.

You will never be able to stop the alcoholic who gets behind the wheel, no different then you can stop people who commit these atrocities when they have no regard for human life.

As much as I wish I had the answer that would fix the problem, I don’t. Although, I can state with great certainty that more firearm legislation will not stop these types of crimes.

The ultimate problem is people.
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here here, wonderfully articulated !
 
Violence is misdirected anger. Misdirected into planning and scheming then action

Typically mentally ill people aren't angry or violent.
 
I'm surprised that nobody has brought up the juicy fact that CBC just brought to light whilst grinding their axes looking at legal firearms owners.

The individual whom committed that heinous crime out east was not a licenced firearms owner yet managed to get his hands on one. based on a statement they gave in their article about how this guy was searching for someone with a flashlight in one hand and a gun in another, I can only speculate this was an issued RCMP service pistol based on how he went above and beyond to replicate an RCMP officer. Again this is speculation only and we wont know until they reveal their findings.
 
55recce said:
Strict gun laws seem to have stopped shootings in the UK (e.g. no repeats of Hungerford or Dunblane), Australia and NZ.

Not any mass shooter events in those countries since they cracked down. Need to be careful with facts otherwise they can turn around and bite you.....
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Go check out the stats on knife crime over there. Oh yeah ... and acid attacks. Real trendy across the pond. The logic is one-dimensional.
 
extrasauce said:
People who cry for more gun control often cite Australia and the UK as examples. Well yeah, they're islands so it's much MUCH easier to police the borders...and yet illegal firearms still seep into their countries. When living next door to one of the world's largest firearms producers with the world's longest undefended border, the dynamic of illegally imported firearms changes greatly. If anyone thinks further gun control measures in Canada, up to and including a complete ban, will make a lick of difference, then they truly are deluded ignoramuses that are perfectly happy to handover all rights and privileges to their government overlords.
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Strict gun laws have not stopped shootings in Australia.

People who cite this usually don't have the complete epidemiological picture.

https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=2122854

In short, when you look at data trends and compare them to countries with similar demographics and crucially, similar spending on health and social services, mental health services, etc, there is no evidence the bans did anything meaningful.

Epidemiology is hard, and cherry picking data (or claiming significant effect without long-term data trends) is too easy to do.

Australia has had at least two mass shootings with illegal firearms since their ban.
 
AfroCowboy said:
Violence is misdirected anger. Misdirected into planning and scheming then action

Typically mentally ill people aren't angry or violent.
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Mental illness is an incredibly broad spectrum and people tend to get overly sensitive about its tie to crime. Not all poor mental health is equal. It could easily be argued that APD (antisocial personality disorder), shared by the vast majority of criminals currently incarcerated, are in poor mental health. I suppose that needs a working definition, but for now it will suffice to say that it's a matter of being unable to regulate one's thoughts, emotions, and behaviour appropriately and align them with reality.

That said, there is evidence that most people involved in these situations were in poor mental health. That doesn't mean people with mental health issues are all dangerous, it simply means that in order to do something insane like this, you are by definition not in good mental health.
Plenty of mental ill people are extremely violent and angry (I say this as someone with a psychology degree and a wife who has spent an awful lot of time working in various care facilities). Spend a handful of hours in a dementia ward or a care home for the severely autistic and see if there are any disproportionate displays of anger. It doesn't mean they're necessarily organized, or competent, or murderous, but it should be obvious that people in poor mental health who cannot regulate their decision making nor perceive reality correctly are not fit for the greater responsibilities in life.
 
Fewer people have died from mass shootings in Australia since 1996 than killed in Nova Scotia a few days ago.

Also, your paper is written by someone who isn't a disinterested researcher:

Dr. Samara McPhedran holds a PhD in Psychology and is Chair of the International Coalition
for Women in Shooting and Hunting (WiSH),
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Rohann said:
Strict gun laws have not stopped shootings in Australia.

People who cite this usually don't have the complete epidemiological picture.

https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=2122854

In short, when you look at data trends and compare them to countries with similar demographics and crucially, similar spending on health and social services, mental health services, etc, there is no evidence the bans did anything meaningful.

Epidemiology is hard, and cherry picking data (or claiming significant effect without long-term data trends) is too easy to do.

Australia has had at least two mass shootings with illegal firearms since their ban.
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Australian gun laws wouldn't have prevented what happened in Nova Scotia. But it likely would've stopped Sandy Hook, Las Vegas, San Bernardino, and Orlando.

We can discuss policy pros and cons all day. We can discuss whether it is right to disarm or to control the population's access to specific firearms. We can discuss whether banning particular guns is effective or not. But at the end of the day, a semiautomatic rifle is really good at putting a lot of lead on target.

Koenig Tiger said:
Australian gun laws wouldn't have prevented what happened in Nova Scotia. So what's your point?
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FyreFighter said:
Australian gun laws wouldn't have prevented what happened in Nova Scotia. But it likely would've stopped Sandy Hook, Las Vegas, San Bernardino, and Orlando.

We can discuss policy pros and cons all day. We can discuss whether it is right to disarm or to control the population's access to specific firearms. We can discuss whether banning particular guns is effective or not. But at the end of the day, a semiautomatic rifle is really good at putting a lot of lead on target.
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Your stance is confusing. You want more gun control? You like Australias model? Do you own a semi automatic?
 
FyreFighter said:
Fewer people have died from mass shootings in Australia since 1996 than killed in Nova Scotia a few days ago.
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That's incorrect. There hasn't bean a single shooting as deadly, but what do laws have to do with that, considering the NS shooter was unlicensed? Also the NS shooting was a spree, since it lasted 12 hours and spanned hundreds of km, and the high body count is largely attributable to the failure to notify the public.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_massacres_in_Australia

Also, your paper is written by someone who isn't a disinterested researcher:
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There isn't a researcher on the planet who is disinterested. Any pharmaceutical, nutritional, etc study you will come across will have researchers with preconceived biases. What matters is the quality of the research; a-priori dismissal on the basis of supposed bias is ad-hominem.
We have an "inverse hypothesis" to test the "guns = crime" claim, which is the number of first-time buyers skyrocketing in Australia with no subsequent increase in firearms homicide. Furthermore, considering the fact that gun bans are proposed to be imposed on an existing system, the burden of proof is overwhelmingly on that angle that the specific proposed ban will have a significant effect to justify the loss of liberty and tax dollars.
 
I don't want more control. I had - and foolishly sold - my AR15 builds. Semiautos are really a hell of a lot of fun.

That said, there is no purpose defined in law for a black rifle: you can't hunt with it and you have no right to self-defense. Given the damage it can do if it falls into the wrong hands, a society that is at best ambivalent towards firearms ownership doesn't really have much of a problem with a ban.

I don't accept that argument, but I also see that it is a matter of when not if. The SAFE ACT in NYS has tigen the liberals a template for what constitutes an assault rifle: semi automatic+detachable mag+ (pistol grip OR thumbhole stock OR bayonet lug OR threaded barrel OR flash hider OR forward grip OR collapsible stock). One sentence eliminates everything from 10/22 to Tavor to M1 Carbines to AR15s to Modern Hunters, etc.

Canadians are not in favor of guns. You can argue natural or God-given law all you like. You can argue Molon Labe all you like. The overwhelming majority of gun owners - who have kids, professional lives/careers, or who can't afford to take on the govt will all line up to toss their Tavors in the smelter when the OIC drops.

laker415 said:
Your stance is confusing. You want more gun control? You like Australias model? Do you own a semi automatic?
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