Building from scratch or buy a full rifle

BlazerOne

BlazerOne

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Hi!

I'm looking at either building a new rifle or buying a full rifle, mainly for precision shooting, then, someday, long range.
Looking to build a .338 LM. So far, I've mostly found REM 700 footprints.

I love MDT chassis, but I don't know where to look in order to get an action and barrel at an affordable price.
Websites I get from Google are selling, as an example, actions at 1700$ and up, and barrels at 1000$ and up.

Thus, the prices adds up pretty quickly, which then send me back to buy a complete build, like a Savage 110 Elite Precision.

Giving the fact that I'm not a pro shooter, what are your thoughts?

If you have good places where to buy barreled actions, please share.

Thanks!
 
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Performance is directly related to the barrel and ammo. If you want the best, most consistent performance then you 'build' the rifle.

does it need to cost alot? no, in fact, there are a variety of directions that really don't cost more then some 'nicer' factory rifles.

Key decisions include overall budget (have a number!), type of features you want, realistic performance that will make you happy. And the most important - timing. If you need this 'yesterday', grab something off the shelf.

I hope you plan to reload? Really hard to get the most out of a rifle using factory ammo... and it ends up being a very expensive direction if you actually will shoot regularly.

If I can help, please send a pm or email... you can look on my facebook page for a number of projects customers have built that shoot really well for modest budgets.

Jerry
 
BlazerOne said:
Hi!

I'm looking at either building a new rifle or buying a full rifle, mainly for precision shooting, then, someday, long range.
Looking to build a .338 LM. So far, I've mostly found REM 700 footprints.

I love MDT chassis, but I don't know where to look in order to get an action and barrel at an affordable price.
Websites I get from Google are selling, as an example, actions at 1700$ and up, and barrels at 1000$ and up.

Thus, the prices adds up pretty quickly, which then send me back to buy a complete build, like a Savage 110 Elite Precision.

Giving the fact that I'm not a pro shooter, what are your thoughts?

If you have good places where to buy barreled actions, please share.

Thanks!
Click to expand...

Build it. Have the stock fit to your body, the action and trigger tuned to your specs.
 
The Savage 110 EP is a game changer of a deal. There's nothing on the market that comes close. There's a huge price jump to go to anything equal, and it escalates from there if you want something better. I say this as a 110 EP owner (see my thread on my own experience).
 
It really depends on what you want and what you are looking for.

The advantage of a custom built rifle is that you get it built to exactly your specs - if you know what you want and you have a rifle builder that can deliver, it's like a finely tailored suit. There's a plethora of options available today, and you can really get a rifle dialed in to fit you exactly as you want it to, with the features you desire. A quality gunsmith can also cut a chamber that's optimal for the type of ammo you plan on shooting - whether it's factory or handloads. This is an important aspect for precision (more on that below). How a rifle interfaces with the shooter is really important, there's lots of people that are shooting rifles that aren't optimize to fit them. You will be able to apply the fundamentals more consistently and ultimately shoot better with a rifle that's optimally setup for you.

However, in order to best take advantage of that finely tailored suit, it's good to know what your preferences are and what you want out of a rifle. It took myself a few iterations of rifles to finally get my precision rifles really dialed in the way I like it, and that involved exploring with different components along with having my own skills as a rifleman progress. A good gunsmith can guide you through the process if it's your first time spec'ing a rifle, and build a rifle that checks the boxes you seek.

Custom rifle components are getting better and more affordable, we really are entering a renaissance period for more budget oriented precision rifles. Action makers like Defiance, Zermatt/Bighorn, Kelbly's, etc. are all making excellent and more budget oriented options. You have chassis options like the KRG Bravo, which are very affordable but has the ability to be upgraded to your liking with all the KRG accessories available for it - you can really dress it up or down based on your needs and budget.

Factory rifles are getting better and with more options, but you definitely get what you pay for. I'm not the biggest fan of Savage rifles, they have notoriously bad build quality and QA/QC, so bad that some precision rifle trainers don't allow Savages in their classes because they've had to spend so much class time fixing them. Some Savages work great out of the factory, there will be plenty of success stories told here, but it's a roll of the dice. Tikka is probably the best value in factory precision rifles, a good balance of price verse performance. Though I'm not sure if they make a .338LM option (.338LM is another worthy discussion which I will get into below).

If precision is your top goal, the quality of the barrel blank and the chamber type and quality of the chamber job should be of utmost priority. As a top gunsmith down in the US says "putting a budget barrel blank on a precision rifle is like putting 7 cylinders in a V8". I personally prefer brands with good pedigrees like Krieger, Bartlein, Rockhill, Brux, Hawkhill, Benchmark. Just as important is the chamber job, you can have the best barrel blank in the world, but a mediocre gunsmith can butcher that chamber in seconds. Bigger mass produced manufacturers as well as cheaper/lesser quality gunsmiths can have a tendency to run reamers until they are beyond worn out, which can also induce issues if you get a barrel that had a chamber cut with a worn out reamer.

As far as cartridge choice, I would really question whether you need a .338LM. .338LM is a great round, but the price of everything goes up once you get into a rifle that has a .338LM bolt face. Actions are generally more expensive, and the ammo and reloading components definitely are more then SA (short action) cartridges. Recoil can be punishing, and will induce bad habits if your fundamentals and discipline in applying them isn't 100%. A lot of people getting into the sport think they need a .338LM, but don't like the cost and recoil that shortly follows. There seems to be a flood of .338LM rifles for sale with "low round counts". Also, you really don't need a .338LM unless you are consistently shooting really far, like 2,000+ yards. Besides being cheaper and more fun to short, short action cartridges have the ability to reach out really far - I've taken 6.5 creedmoor out beyond a mile on a few occasions and very successfully, with the farthest successful shot at 2,200 yards. These short action cartridges are no slouches, and I would argue a much better fit for someone getting into the sport then a .338LM.

The saying "you get what you pay for" is as true in precision rifles as it is in every other facet of life, but there's also the law of diminishing return - the higher in quality you go, the more money you have to spend to squeeze that extra bit of performance. It's up to you as a consumer to determine what the balance is going to be between performance and budget.
 
As far as .338 Lapua is concerned; with a brake its like having a grenade go off next to you. I absolutely hated the the guy next to me by the end of the match!
 
If you want something accurate out of the box, just get a CADEX. You won't regret it. Your wallet might cry a little. lol

IMHO you go down a steep rabbit hole if you go custom and don't spend tens of hours researching, practicing, tinkering/adjusting, and reloading to find the perfect weight/grain for your gun. However I'm sure some of the boys here will say that's 3/4 of the fun.

.338LM gets real expensive, real quick. personally, I would pick another caliber..

just my 0.02
 
Literally just went through this.
The .585 bolt face isn’t offered in any budget custom actions except the Cadex R7. It’s still $1400.
Stocks can go either way. You can spend $400 or $1400
There’s a few really good barrels in stock in Canada in the $550 range. I wasn’t able to find any prefits so gunsmith is another minimum of $400 plus the time and effort to have it done.
Add up the trigger, brake and magazine, and you could easily drop another $500-$800.
I’m a fan of the strike nuke chassis on the Cadex Shepherd, so it was a no brainer for me. It even comes with a $100 drag bag.
If the unisig Barrel they use now isn’t up to my expectations, for another $950, I’ll have a bartlein or a Krieger spun up for it and still be around the cost of a full custom.
Some of the savage offerings look like a good value as well.
There’s a near new .338 shepherd on the EE though for $2700 tax free. It’ll be awfully hard to beat that either way you look at it.
 
When you "build" you control everything, but may have to wait. You can pick your caliber and barrel length, action, stock, mag etc. However for the "inexperienced" that might be too much to decide?
While 338 is a good cartridge, I would look deeper into what you want to do? and expect? Reloading as opposed to buying ammo etc.
Off the shelf, the "top" candidate for me would be a PGW Timberwolf.
In other calibers like 300 PRC or 300WM, the Ruger RPR comes to mind
Tikka makes an excellent rifle as well.
Good luck
 
First of all: thank you very much for such complete and quick replies!

That's what I like about this forum: straight answers, no judgment, experience sharing, etc. Wow! :)

A little bit of background. I currently own a Savage 10tr chambered in .308 and I love it. I took a basic training for long range shooting and that's what confirmed to me that I wanted do dive further into this.

I do reload and I agree with you that if you want precision, that's almost mandatory (yes there is excellent ammo on the market, but I get better groups with my own built).
Costs are also dropping, which would bring the price of the .338 at a more affordable range (but still very pricy).

Reason why I am thinking of the .338 is that indeed, my goal is ultimately to shoot extreme long distance. In the meantime, I concentrate on precision, in order to be a better shooter.
I read that .308 would be enough to hit a target "easily" at a 1000 yards. I choose the 308 for availability where I live, over the 6.5 Creedmoor, which I must admit seems like an excellent choice for precision (as well as long distance < 2000 yards). Looking strickly at the BC, it seems like and awesome load to shoot. But again, the price is making me re-thinking, as it wouldn't be a good move, if I end off shooting only a few times a year.

About the custom build: I easily get in the likes of 6000$, which for now, simply isn't possible for me. At this price, I include the scope and some gunsmith time.
Cadex was mentioned and I must say that I fell in love with their products, just by the look of them, and I have read nothing but excellent review.
They seems a bit pricy tho, which brought me to the idea of custom build. To get a Cadex Patriot in .338, all basic accessories included (e.g. bipod and scope), I'm more aroung 8000$.

All of this brings me back to the main question: is it the right time for me to buy something is this price range, considering that I'm not experienced? Sad thing is that in Qc, you can't try the rifle before you buy, unless you know someone who has one, or meet someone at the gun range who has one, and that person is kind enough to let you try his own.

I'll continue reading on the subject in the meantime (and saving ;-) ).

Keep sharing your experiences gentlemen! :)
 
If "extreme" long range is your goal, take a look at the Ruger RPR in 300PRC?, one of the network shows did an demo and buddy was "ringing steel" at 2100m.

Here's the video;
 
Haaaa, the Ruger Precision ... I love the look of this gun soooo much!

Prices have gone up a bit lately tho.

Local gunsmith wasn't a big fan of it, apparently due to the action.
I can't judge, as I've never seen one myself.

Good reviews tho. And great video, thanks for sharing :)
 
"I thought my rifle chambered .338 Lapua Mag; turns out it chambers ten dollar bills! Who knew?"

HAHAHAHAHA :) that just put a smile on my face! yeah, I haven't seen match grade ammo below 8$/round + tx ... Quick math would puts me at 1.97$/round if I reload them (with Hornady BTHP 250gr)...

I'm down to 1.23$ for a 300 Win mag. I'll continue to check the different caliber in order to find the one for which pricevs preformance would fit my wallet... Sad, but realistic ;-)
 
Given the addn info you have provided, my suggestion is simply to load up a better bullet into your current 308 and enjoy shooting out to 1 mile.

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As a very happy byproduct of where I live, I can shoot very far ALOT through the year and have been enjoying LR and ELR shooting for a couple of decades now. If you are competing, you build the best set up to suit the rules and tasks. If you are just having fun, have fun... put the resources into the cost of going shooting and being able to do it more then a few times a year.

Even with all this real estate (terrain goes WAAAYYYYYYY beyond 2000yds), I shoot inside a mile way more then beyond. Everyone seems so afraid of drift. Trust me, EVERYTHING drifts.

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Here we are shooting out to 1450yds. It was a strong quartering wind out of the 8 oclock.. this became more full value beyond 1000yds as you entered the next valley/opening. My friend was shooting his 408 Cheytac.... I was shooting a 22 Creedmoor. Our drops weren't too far different and my drift was not a whole lot more. I definitely had to move around more BUT maybe 1/2 mil more... that is a couple of lines in my scope reticle. Big deal.

Cost difference? 10 to 1.... I shoot a mag... my buddy takes ONE shot. We both put lots of hits on the same target.

If you WANT a boomer, go for it. Enjoy it while we still can. If you think you NEED a boomer to reach out, NOPE!!! Absolutely NOPE.

In fact, the best cartridge options for accuracy, cost of running, ease of shooting and freaking accurate, look at the F class world. All the competitive rifles will shoot Sub 5" at 1000yds... and these bullets will easily reach 1 mile.

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I was doing a scope tracking test with my FTR (308Win) rifle. Target was pretty darn small at 1 mile. putting hits on that target was straightforward. Yes, I am using a Savage action.

It will be far harder to approach this level of accuracy with a larger boomer... on several levels. Maybe a new barrel is all you need to take you to the next level and you now have the resources to go out and enjoy it.

Jerry
 

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I shoot rimfire mostly right now because “long range” is easy to find and it’s cheap. If I were shooting Center fire, 1K rounds a yr and the rifle and optic would sink my budget. I can shoot many thousands of rounds a yr through my wannabe precision rimfire without budget constraints. For me, trigger volume trumps cool factor right now.

Don’t build a custom for your precision rifle. You don’t know enough to choose what you want yet. Buy a brand name in 6 or 6.5CM, hopefully used. It’s like a starter girlfriend, just to learn the ropes. You may find you prefer something different, but if it’s custom then you lose big $$ selling.
 
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Rimfire ELR shooting... more giggles per buck then you can imagine

400yds is NOT all that far anymore for a 22LR.... but you want to talk about peddling fast to keep up with the winds.

As I said, I spend very little time shooting beyond 1 mile now.....

Jerry
 

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I just finished assembling a rifle from parts I've been collecting. 700 long action, magnum bolt, HS stock, Remington 5R take-off barrel in .300WM. Threaded the barrel and installed a brake this afternoon, mounted a Weaver KT-15 scope for testing. Will make up some ammunition tomorrow, probably use some 154gr Scenars I have on hand. This is just a project for the sake of doing a project. Hopefully it will shoot well enough to be interesting. But a magnum cartridge wouldn't be my first choice for a serious rifle, if I were investing serious coin in it.
 
emerson said:
I shoot rimfire mostly right now because “long range” is easy to find and it’s cheap. If I were shooting Center fire, 1K rounds a yr and the rifle and optic would sink my budget. I can shoot many thousands of rounds a yr through my wannabe precision rimfire without budget constraints. For me, trigger volume trumps cool factor right now.

Don’t build a custom for your precision rifle. You don’t know enough to choose what you want yet. Buy a brand name in 6 or 6.5CM, hopefully used. It’s like a starter girlfriend, just to learn the ropes. You may find you prefer something different, but if it’s custom then you lose big $$ selling.
Click to expand...

For every seller that took a total bath on a custom precision build with custom action and the best of everything theres a lucky buyer who got it for half price or less. ;)

Or less fun but very real, there could be shrewd buyer who took it apart and sold the parts and made money at salvage prices. Money put into gunsmithing is just gone. That usually includes money that got poured into factory actions.
 
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