Hey I got a question on revolvers...

phatman

phatman

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Why does the cylinder on revolvers open to the left side of the firearm and not the right?

It would seem to me that it would be much easier to load cartridges from the right side for a right handed person...

or is this some kind of conspiracy by the leftys?
 
For a right handed person doing a fast reload the correct way to load is to use the left hand fingers wrapped around from below to the right side to push the cylinder out then hold the cylinder in the left hand with the fingers still through the frame. Tip the gun up and hit the ejector rod with the right hand and then reload the cartridges with the right hand either singly or with a speed loader of some sort. The left hand holding the gun well over to the side with the cylinder up high and facing back to facilitate an easy angle to load. From there the right hand re-grasps the grip and with the two hands the cylinder is snapped home. This sounds like a lot of hand changing but it puts the right hand to work doing the most demanding job for accuracy.

I know at the range when time is free we typically hold it in our right hand and fumble the cartridges in with the left hand but that's not the fast way. In fact I'm terribly guilty on this count. I'll have to make it a point to practice the right way since I use my revolver in speed shooting matches and due to having to hit 5 targets with 6 bullets I am forced to reload quickly on the timer all too often.

In fact even if you stick to holding the gun with the right and reloading with the left hand it's still the best side to hinge out. The ejector is more easily accessable to the left hand as well as reloading with the left.

So no, it's just fine as it is thankyouverymuch..... :D
 
BCRider said:
For a right handed person doing a fast reload the correct way to load is to use the left hand fingers wrapped around from below to the right side to push the cylinder out then hold the cylinder in the left hand with the fingers still through the frame. Tip the gun up and hit the ejector rod with the right hand and then reload the cartridges with the right hand either singly or with a speed loader of some sort. The left hand holding the gun well over to the side with the cylinder up high and facing back to facilitate an easy angle to load. From there the right hand re-grasps the grip and with the two hands the cylinder is snapped home. This sounds like a lot of hand changing but it puts the right hand to work doing the most demanding job for accuracy.

I know at the range when time is free we typically hold it in our right hand and fumble the cartridges in with the left hand but that's not the fast way. In fact I'm terribly guilty on this count. I'll have to make it a point to practice the right way since I use my revolver in speed shooting matches and due to having to hit 5 targets with 6 bullets I am forced to reload quickly on the timer all too often.

In fact even if you stick to holding the gun with the right and reloading with the left hand it's still the best side to hinge out. The ejector is more easily accessable to the left hand as well as reloading with the left.

So no, it's just fine as it is thankyouverymuch..... :D
Click to expand...

OK I'm in a profession where ergonomics is King. Having to go through as many steps as you just described is a killer. I have thought about this for quite some time and I have hesitated to comment for fear of some structural reason for this arraignment but I couldn't find any.

So this is what I did. I pretended to be left handed and held the gun in my left hand. I actuated the cylinder release button (which happens to be correctly placed for a right handed person) and opened the cylinder.

Then I pushed on the cylinder with my thumb and reached around the bottom of the trigger guard with my fingers, actuating the ejector with my index finger.

With my hand still positioned this way I could hold the gun and reload with my free hand. Once the gun is reloaded, the cylinder is now re-engaged to the frame - all done without any hand switching and the barrel pointing safely downrange.

I know it sounds silly - but try it and see if it isn't faster.

After all the single actions load from the right - imagine if the loading gate was on the left...
 
Single actions are actually designed for left handed people, Sam Colt was a southpaw. Double action revolvers are not, and there are various ways to reload them. As suggested, watch a video of Jerry Miculek and see how he does it. It's way faster to do then describe. Personally, it's;
open cylinder latch and tilt revolver to the left with my right hand, slide the right hand forward to reach the extractor rod and extract, meanwhile.........left hand has reached for speedloader and is in position to drop it into place on cylinder, quick twist of the speedloader knob (keeping the muzzle downwards, gravity is not your friend during this procedure) and close the cylinder with left hand while sliding right hand back into firing position. It sounds slow, I know, but it actually is pretty quick. Not as quick as a mag change on a 1911 (for me, watch Jerry again), but I don't have to chase brass either. There are also options for doing it one handed, should you find yourself disabled for whatever reason. FWIW - dan
 
I'm not a revolver fan but operating it from the "lefty" point of view described above has issues. Ensuring the cylinder remains open exposing all chambers is paramount in using a speed loader. The "lefty" setup described may be faster from an offhand upright position but I doubt it will work in less favorable positions such as supine, prone, rollover/urban prone to name a few.


Here's where I jump on the soapbox and tell everyone. "Here is yet another reason why revolvers are inferior to autos."

TDC
 
TDC, inferior? Perhaps, especially if we were able to use unrestricted magazines in semis. But a revolver is more fun in a whole other way....:D

phatman said:
....So this is what I did. I pretended to be left handed and held the gun in my left hand. I actuated the cylinder release button (which happens to be correctly placed for a right handed person) and opened the cylinder.

Then I pushed on the cylinder with my thumb and reached around the bottom of the trigger guard with my fingers, actuating the ejector with my index finger.

With my hand still positioned this way I could hold the gun and reload with my free hand. Once the gun is reloaded, the cylinder is now re-engaged to the frame - all done without any hand switching and the barrel pointing safely downrange......
Click to expand...

OK, I'm assuming that the thumb you used is the right hand thumb as there's no way in heck that I can reach the cylinder on my Model 19 with my "strong" hand's thumb.

So without letting go of my strong (left for this mirror case) hand on the grips I released the cylinder catch with a forward jab of my right hand so the thumb did a "reach over" to get started. Instead of my thumb, which was on the wrong side now, I used my right hand fingers to roll the cylinder open and my left forefinger to catch it. The thumb of my right hand then moved over and through the opening from the right to hook the gun for positive support. My index finger than seemed to fall naturally onto the ejector. So far so good and yes it is easier to do it in a single smooth action. I also tried your thumb as well but that led to troubles as noted next.

But that's when the trouble starts. A full stroke of the ejector caused the star to actually touch my forefinger which was still held in the grip. Obviously with this occuring there's no way I could eject any brass without those casings fouling on my forefinger and jamming. So it is imperative with a left hand hold with the cylinder opening towards the forefinger that the grips be released to allow ejection. There goes the option for a continuous strong handhold on the grips.

Passing by that aspect for the moment I did find that I could close the cylinder until the pin was resting on the shield but not engaged. From that point it was easy to roll the cylinder with my trigger finger and mimic putting in rounds with my right hand. But now you're asking the less dextrous hand to do the most demanding job. Not a good thing in a hurry. However if you're a speedloader user your forefinger again gets in the way and it's impossible to load. Add to this that the cylinder when held high to see so you can load is trying to close on you and it's a double whammy. And again you're asking the less dextrous hand to do the most demanding task of guiding the noses of the bullets into the cylinder

After playing with this lefty method it got feeling pretty comfy and quick. But it still involves the same actions as the right hand shuffle I described above but mirror imaged for the most part. The difference being that the thumb has to stick through the frame instead of the fingers. But it's the same number of steps and operations and shifts. I also found that the hand around the base of the thumb gets scraped up due to the way I had to reach through to support the cylinder. Points to the other way where three fingers do the same job and don't get scraped.

However there's still no way to load with a speed loader if you don't let go with the left hand. Meanwhile if you're being lazy with a right hand hold and just hold the grips in your strong hand it's very easy and natural to move the thumb out of place to allow for the left hand doing all the unloading and loading without being forced to release your grip. So the open inwards format has more options while the open outwards forces a single format release of the strong hand style.

So all in all I do agree that they should roll open to the inside of the shooter. Although having had a chance to play with this as a leftie I'm more open to the thought. But better? Nope, to load southpaw with an outward rolling cylinder it takes as many shifts and support exchanges one way or the other. Just the angles and fingers through the frame are different. And you lose the option of the slightly slower strong hand support and load since the cylinder must open towards the thumb to allow that option.

_________________________
Edited following further testing......
 
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I'm left handed and shoot revolvers, when I can for a newb! Revolvers are definitely designed for right handers! If the cylinder swung out to the right it would be much easier for me to reload, and quicker. S/A's though seem designed for lefty's except for the ejector rod on the left side. No need for you righty's to test it out, trust the newb on this one!
 
TDC said:
I'm not a revolver fan but operating it from the "lefty" point of view described above has issues. Ensuring the cylinder remains open exposing all chambers is paramount in using a speed loader. The "lefty" setup described may be faster from an offhand upright position but I doubt it will work in less favorable positions such as supine, prone, rollover/urban prone to name a few.


Here's where I jump on the soapbox and tell everyone. "Here is yet another reason why revolvers are inferior to autos."

TDC
Click to expand...

Well you can't play 'Dirty Harry' with a semi auto - please see

http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php?t=395287

FWIW I've had a 92FS and a Colt Govt Model and enjoyed shooting them both...
 
BCRider said:
OK, I'm assuming that the thumb you used is the right hand thumb as there's no way in heck that I can reach the cylinder on my Model 19 with my "strong" hand's thumb
Click to expand...

OK at this point my R hand is completely encircling the gun from below, with my R thumb on the L side of the cylinder, and my fingers on the left side.

BCRider said:
So without letting go of my strong (left for this mirror case) hand on the grips I released the cylinder catch with a forward jab of my right hand so the thumb did a "reach over" to get started. Instead of my thumb, which was on the wrong side now, I used my right hand fingers to roll the cylinder open and my left forefinger to catch it. The thumb of my right hand then moved over and through the opening from the right to hook the gun for positive support. My index finger than seemed to fall naturally onto the ejector. So far so good and yes it is easier to do it in a single smooth action. I also tried your thumb as well but that led to troubles as noted next.
Click to expand...

At this point your trigger finger is out of the way, and your L hand is stabilizing the gun (L thumb is still pushing on the cylinder release button which is on the R side of the gun)

BCRider said:
But that's when the trouble starts. A full stroke of the ejector caused the star to actually touch my forefinger which was still held in the grip. Obviously with this occurring there's no way I could eject any brass without those casings fouling on my forefinger and jamming. So it is imperative with a left hand hold with the cylinder opening towards the forefinger that the grips be released to allow ejection. There goes the option for a continuous strong handhold on the grips. .
Click to expand...

Your L hand is now off the gun as your R hand is supporting it. The R finger is actuating the ejector as the L hand reaches for the speed loader.

BCRider said:
Passing by that aspect for the moment I did find that I could close the cylinder until the pin was resting on the shield but not engaged. From that point it was easy to roll the cylinder with my trigger finger and mimic putting in rounds with my right hand. But now you're asking the less dexterous hand to do the most demanding job. Not a good thing in a hurry. However if you're a speedloader user your forefinger again gets in the way and it's impossible to load. Add to this that the cylinder when held high to see so you can load is trying to close on you and it's a double whammy. And again you're asking the less dexterous hand to do the most demanding task of guiding the noses of the bullets into the cylinder
Click to expand...

Don’t forget that we’re playing leftys here and your dominate hand WOULD be the L hand

BCRider said:
After playing with this lefty method it got feeling pretty comfy and quick. But it still involves the same actions as the right hand shuffle I described above but mirror imaged for the most part. The difference being that the thumb has to stick through the frame instead of the fingers. But it's the same number of steps and operations and shifts. I also found that the hand around the base of the thumb gets scraped up due to the way I had to reach through to support the cylinder. Points to the other way where three fingers do the same job and don't get scraped.

However there's still no way to load with a speed loader if you don't let go with the left hand. Meanwhile if you're being lazy with a right hand hold and just hold the grips in your strong hand it's very easy and natural to move the thumb out of place to allow for the left hand doing all the unloading and loading without being forced to release your grip. So the open inwards format has more options while the open outwards forces a single format release of the strong hand style.

So all in all I do agree that they should roll open to the inside of the shooter. Although having had a chance to play with this as a leftie I'm more open to the thought. But better? Nope, to load southpaw with an outward rolling cylinder it takes as many shifts and support exchanges one way or the other. Just the angles and fingers through the frame are different. And you lose the option of the slightly slower strong hand support and load since the cylinder must open towards the thumb to allow that option.
Click to expand...

Well I’m happy that a number of you guys thought enough of my suggestion to actually work it out.

FWIW I was taught (as a righty) to push the cylinder release button with my R thumb, grasp the cylinder from beneath with my L thumb on the L side of the cylinder and my L fingers pushing from the R side.

At this point rotate the gun slightly so that you can actuate the ejector rod with you L thumb while pointing the barrel up (so the cases fall down)

At the same time reach for the speed loader, load the cylinder, discard the speed loader, grasp the grip with your R hand and rotate the cylinder back into the gun.

This is a great way of doing it, however the guns barrel is NOT pointed down range at all times, in fact it is swinging wildly during this operation, possibly making your range mates nervous.

Again my 2 cents…
 
Phatman, granted the muzzle is flopping around a little but it's not hard to keep it pointing generally the right way or at least not towards anyone to either side. It's mostly just elevating and lowering while still pointing generally forward.

For you lefties after playing around with it today it's really not that bad as long as you can ditch the idea of holding on to the grips the whole time. Assuming you grip the gun with your right thumb crossed over the web of the left hand your thumb is there to move forward to activate the release and then shift ahead and through the frame while your fingers curl under the trigger gaurde to grab the cylinder. The gun is then fully supported to allow the left hand to load either singly or with a speed loader.
 
Found a couple of lefty revolver reload videos.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTT8qZkuWjI

I tried this thumb over the top strap as he uses but it sure seemed like it was a bit precarious. If you were in a match with sweaty hands and used a bit too vigorus a stab at the ejector and I can see the gun ending up in the dirt at your feet. Thumb thru the window may be a hair slower but it's a LOT more secure.

I think this is the same guy showing a closer up side view of his loading. He's using moon clips but it would be the same with speedloaders of course.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7YXtmQjSWEo&feature=related
 
If you take a close look at the Jerry Miculek, you will see that when he reloads he is holding the gun with his left hand and has his left fingers though, supporting/aligning the cylinder.

His right hand loads the cylinder from a speedloader.

His left hand (thumb) is then closing the cylinder as he grabs the grip with his right hand.


It wouldn't be any faster if the cylinder swung out the right side because you would have to tilt the gun to the left to SEE the cylinder as you chamber the speedloader otherwise the frame/hammer would be partially blocking your view.
 
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