Replacing Factory bullet in cartridge

T

tinbird

CGN frequent flyer
Rating - 100%
6   0   0
Hi guys, I have a 30-40 Krag 1895 winchester and am not fond of the 180 grain power point winchester bullet (expands to easily thus penetration is 'iffy' at best even on deer). I'm thinking that I could probably pull the factory 180 grain bullet and replace with a better one (i.e. interbond or partition).
Have any of you done this? I can see the dangers of using a Higher weight and the increased pressures, but with a same weight bullet, there shouldn't be any pressure concerns.
I want to use this for hunting deer in the brush.
Is there something I'm not aware of that would indicate that I shouldn't do this?

tinbird
 
I did similar with 7.62x39, replaced the FMJ's with Hornady Softpoints. I also used fresh powder though. With no proper crimping, just clear nail polish around the neck, and hope for the best, they printed and grouped at least equally with the surplus. I've got real brass and dies on the way, but if I had to do it again, it worked decently. I also checked and made sure that the rounds weren't getting pushed back in the case from the recoil or semi auto feeding.
 
When it was easier to find boxer primed military ammo I often made "Mexican Match" by pulling the FMJ, recalculating the powder charge for a different bullet weight, and seating a match bullet. Purchasing factory ammo and switching to a preferred bullet isn't difficult if you are set up to handload, but it is not advisable without a means of gently pulling the factory bullet, neck sizing the brass, and seating the new bullet somewhere near concentrically. It would be best to change bullets of the same weight and construction, for example avoid swapping a lead core bullet with a mono-metal bullet of equal weight.
 
tinbird said:
Hi guys, I have a 30-40 Krag 1895 winchester and am not fond of the 180 grain power point winchester bullet (expands to easily thus penetration is 'iffy' at best even on deer). I'm thinking that I could probably pull the factory 180 grain bullet and replace with a better one (i.e. interbond or partition).
Have any of you done this? I can see the dangers of using a Higher weight and the increased pressures, but with a same weight bullet, there shouldn't be any pressure concerns.
I want to use this for hunting deer in the brush.
Is there something I'm not aware of that would indicate that I shouldn't do this?

tinbird
Click to expand...

The guys that have done his have given good advice.

My question is, have you had any failures attributable to the bullet? Or are your deer those ones that are all over the internet, that have armour plating and kevlar skins, and can't be killed with anything that takes less than 2 snow scoops of powder to injure?


I mean, really, 30-40 Krag, ain't exactly a screamer, and all the deer I've shot with Power Points or other cheap standard class bullets, died just fine, thank you. But if you don't hit them where you need to, they do tend to run away and (maybe) die elsewhere.

You been reading too many magazine articles? As far as 'brush' goes, if yer shooting through it, yer gonna have problems hitting what's on the other side of it. There was a very interesting post on this, in the Hunting Forum, posted earlier this year. Made it look like a really poor idea.

If it makes you feel better, by all means, but I have my personal doubts that it's time or money well spent. It's your money though. Fill yer boots! :D

Cheers
Trev
 
Given adequate placement, ordinary SP bullets like the Power Point will work fine at modest .30-40 Krag velocities. Some premium bullets actually may not do as well because they are designed to expand at higher velocities.

If you really want something different from factory offerings, just develop a load from the ground up.
 
Did I get this right? He wants a better bullet in his 30 US than the Win, 180 grain Power Point, even for deer?
Surely, I must have missed something!
 
No, you didn't miss anything. He believes that the standard bullet for the lower velocity 30-40 is inadequate for deer. However, he also hasn't replied to trevj question about experience with the bullet.
As you guess, I would also agree that standard bullets are more than adequate for these cartridges when hunting deer.
 
Tinbird, honestly, people kill moose and bears and other things with normal Power Points in "vanilla" cartridges like the 308 win all day long. Your Krag will do just fine with these bullets on deer (or elk or moose) as long as you shoot them right. Seriously.
 
I rate the Power Point ahead of the Silver Tip, but I don't begrudge the guy from asking the question or from having an opinion regardless of his level of experience. Few North American hunters gain enough experience over a life time to say bullet A is absolutely better than bullet B and under what conditions it is better, the same, or worse. But if they experience a single failure with bullet A, that bullet is forever tainted, and often so is the cartridge in which the bullet was loaded and even rifle that fired it. Expectations come into the equation as well. If the hunter is of the opinion that a bullet that grenades inside the chest cavity, resulting in an almost instant kill, is poor performance compared to the bullet that retains all of it's original weight and goes howling off into the far blue yonder leaving a large exit wound which again does the game no good, then nothing short of an African solid will satisfy him.
 
I appreciate all the supportive responses.
Interesting how a simple reloading question can raise the hackles of the critics, btw due to illness and computer issues, I wasn't able to reply immediately.
I have the equipment and background of basic reloading and have done so for a few years. I was inquiring, out of concerns for safety as I was trying to indicate in my post, about swapping bullets, sorry to have confused you guys.

Tinbird
 
RECONSTRUCTION was my word for what I had to do.
As a police marksman, dealing with numerous lots off WW 150 grain bullets. One lot would yield a 2' group on day and 4' the next. With 5 different lots, one box of 20 from each lot, I pulled every bullet and weighed the powder. One box had a 2.1 grain variation, and over the 5 boxes the variance was 3.5 grains. You could do that good with a Lee dipper. The cases were neck sized only, and "reconstructed" using Hornady 168 grain HP Match bullets. All of the team rifles would now group under 2" and 200 yards.
Why was it called reconstruction? The "Mnteiuos" policy did not allow handloading.
 
You know how the loading manuals suggest that when changing one component in a load, you start over, and work back up again?
Swapping bullets could be in this category.
.30-40 isn't a hot cartridge, but the rifle you are using isn't the strongest, either.
FWIW, years go, the NRA did pressure tests with rebulleted .30-06 ball ammunition. They pulled the 150gr fmj bullets, and replaced them with a wide variety of commercial 150gr bullets. In EVERY case, pressures were higher. None were dangerously higher, but all the rebulletted ammunition registered higher pressures than the original ball load.
 
yes, you can safely pull the bullets and use different bullets.

I agree with others that deer and moose out to 200 yards are easy to kill with that rifle/ammo without any need for a bullet change, if you put the bullet in the boiler room. The 30/40 is just fine, in my opinion, for deer and moose within 100 yards.

If you are a reloader, pull the bullets and dump the powder of 10 rounds and weigh. Divide by 10 to calculate the average powder charge to re-load with.

Neck size the cases to make tight and more uniform neck tension. Personally, I would remove the decapper pin, so neck tension would be maximum.

When you choose your new bullet, chamber it to make sure your bullet does not touch the rifling. Make sure it still fits the magazine. the OAL of the factory ammo should work. If you don't neck size, there is a danger of a loose bullet that could get pushed back in the case when chambering.

Many of us here have pulled military bullets and re-loaded with soft points to make our own cheap hunting ammo. Works just fine.
 
while waiting for reloading componates for my new laminate t3 7mag i bought a couple of boxes of cheap 175 grn power points. they grouped in 3/4 inch triangles. i used them on two spring bears. i wouldn't say the recovered bullets looked great but two 6ft bears died rather quick. both shot at under 100 yrds. i would use power points on deer especially in a slower cartridge any day.
 
B said:
Anyone using premium bullets for deer has more money than brains IMO...
Click to expand...

Whoa, there! :D Glad you said "IMO". ;). If a guy wants to use a premium bullet for whatever he shoots, there should be no problem with that. What if I am deer hunting where I might run into a legal moose? Or even better, a legal 7 foot Black Bear. I'm a gonna be packing a handload with a premium bullet up the spout, and if it is merely a deer that gets shot, so be it. The little extra cost of the premium is far outweighed by the reliability of it. Regards, Eagleye.
 
Eagleye said:
Whoa, there! :D Glad you said "IMO". ;). If a guy wants to use a premium bullet for whatever he shoots, there should be no problem with that. What if I am deer hunting where I might run into a legal moose? Or even better, a legal 7 foot Black Bear. I'm a gonna be packing a handload with a premium bullet up the spout, and if it is merely a deer that gets shot, so be it. The little extra cost of the premium is far outweighed by the reliability of it. Regards, Eagleye.
Click to expand...


Eagle you have been hunting for quite a few years, what was around for Premium bullets way back when? FS
 
Eagleye said:
Whoa, there! :D Glad you said "IMO". ;). If a guy wants to use a premium bullet for whatever he shoots, there should be no problem with that. What if I am deer hunting where I might run into a legal moose? Or even better, a legal 7 foot Black Bear. I'm a gonna be packing a handload with a premium bullet up the spout, and if it is merely a deer that gets shot, so be it. The little extra cost of the premium is far outweighed by the reliability of it. Regards, Eagleye.
Click to expand...

Using premium bullets to add versatility is different than using because of some unfounded need for more performace:). If I was hunting something that bites I would outfit myself accordingly.
 
Fassteel said:
Eagle you have been hunting for quite a few years, what was around for Premium bullets way back when? FS
Click to expand...

FS; When I started reloading, there were 2 bullets that were available to the reloader that could have been classified as "premium" First, the venerable Nosler Partition. [At that time they were the ones made of with bronze tubing jackets, and had a machined groove around them right ver the partition] The second was the "Bitterroot" a bonded core bullet that had a very heavy, pure copper jacket with a bonded core. IIRC, these were made by hand, and were quite spendy, but worked well on game. I never bought many Bitterroots because of the price, and because their accuracy was iffy. A bullet I loaded and shot a fair bit of was Winchester's original style Silvertip, which was available as a component. We have it very good today, with many bullets to choose from, including solid copper and solid gilding metal bullets that perform immaculately and......shoot well too. I am still using Partitions in many of mine, simply cause they have worked so well over the years. e.g., this years moose. 1 - 180 Partition at 370 yards from my 300 WSM, and the work began! Regards, Eagleye.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom