Is there a legal minimum for barrel lengths on rifles and shotguns?

Canuck1911

Canuck1911

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I just took day one of my PAL course today and our instructor gave us this bit of homework to find out. He said he doubts we could find out the right answer so i thought i would check here first.

btw, this is my first post. I have only been lurking until now. cou:
 
From my studying, I understand that any Centerfire rifle or Shotgun that is less then 470 mm by design and is not otherwise prohibited is restricted and any Centerfire rifle or shotgun that has been altered to be less than 457mm is considered prohibited (altered being the key point, as a rifle with a 16.5 inch barrel that is not prohibited would be restricted, same with a 10 inch barrel ect.)

If Im wrong someone please correct me.
 
no, but it is illegal to cut any shorter than 18''.

so if me and you have each an 870, yours is a factory 14'' and mine is a 30'', both are non-restricted and legal (as long as they have an over al lenght of 26'' or greater). legally, i can cut mine to 18'', but below that would be prohibited.
 
you can cut a semi auto centerfire down to 18.5"

you can cut a non semi, or rimfire down to 18"

you can make (manufacture) a barrel any lengh you want. (if semi auto would be restricted under 18.5" though)

so you can buy a factory 8" barrel pump action shotgun... but if you already had a long one you can only cut it down to 18".

the laws are retarded.
 
So is that why when someone buys a factory 8.5 , 10 , 11.5 inch AR15 barrel theyre not prohibited because they were manufactured to that length and thus stay restricted ?

So if i cut my m14 down to 18" it would stay non restricted ?
 
Canuck1911 said:
Is there a legal minimum for barrel lengths on rifles and shotguns?

I just took day one of my PAL course today and our instructor gave us this bit of homework to find out. He said he doubts we could find out the right answer so i thought i would check here first.
Click to expand...

Barrel and Firearms Lengths
http://nfa.ca/node/128

The Lupara or Short Barreled Shotgun
http://nfa.ca/node/79

NFA Legal
http://nfa.ca/nfa-legal

FIREARMS AND OTHER WEAPONS
http://laws.justice.gc.ca/eng/C-46/page-3.html#anchorbo-ga:l_III

http://laws.justice.gc.ca/eng/C-46/page-3.html#anchorbo-ga:l_III

Criminal Code (R.S., 1985, c. C-46)

PART III
FIREARMS AND OTHER WEAPONS
Interpretation​

Definitions
84. (1) In this Part,

“prohibited firearm”
« arme à feu prohibée »

“prohibited firearm” means
(a) a handgun that

(i) has a barrel equal to or less than 105 mm in length, or

(ii) is designed or adapted to discharge a 25 or 32 calibre cartridge,

but does not include any such handgun that is prescribed, where the handgun is for use in international sporting competitions governed by the rules of the International Shooting Union,
(b) a firearm that is adapted from a rifle or shotgun, whether by sawing, cutting or any other alteration, and that, as so adapted,

(i) is less than 660 mm in length, or

(ii) is 660 mm or greater in length and has a barrel less than 457 mm in length,
(c) an automatic firearm, whether or not it has been altered to discharge only one projectile with one pressure of the trigger, or
(d) any firearm that is prescribed to be a prohibited firearm;

“prohibited weapon”
« arme prohibée »

“prohibited weapon” means
(a) a knife that has a blade that opens automatically by gravity or centrifugal force or by hand pressure applied to a button, spring or other device in or attached to the handle of the knife, or
(b) any weapon, other than a firearm, that is prescribed to be a prohibited weapon;

“restricted firearm”
« arme à feu à autorisation restreinte »

“restricted firearm” means
(a) a handgun that is not a prohibited firearm,
(b) a firearm that

(i) is not a prohibited firearm,

(ii) has a barrel less than 470 mm in length, and

(iii) is capable of discharging centre-fire ammunition in a semi-automatic manner,
(c) a firearm that is designed or adapted to be fired when reduced to a length of less than 660 mm by folding, telescoping or otherwise, or
(d) a firearm of any other kind that is prescribed to be a restricted firearm;

“restricted weapon”
« arme à autorisation restreinte »

“restricted weapon” means any weapon, other than a firearm, that is prescribed to be a restricted weapon;

http://laws.justice.gc.ca/eng/C-46/page-3.html#anchorbo-ga:l_III
Click to expand...

I suspect a trick question. There is a legal distinction between a shortened barrel "...whether by sawing, cutting or any other alteration..." and a barrel that was originally manufactured at that length. Currently, there is also a legal minimum barrel length of 105mm, but there are many, many grandfathered (and legal) prohibited firearms with barrels that are shorter than that.
 
Thanks for all the input folks. I suspected it was a bit of a trick question. I have another question he gave us that i will post up soon.
 
I am a noob on this matter. I am just wondering is shortening shotguns length by shortening the shock legal?
 
Captain Paul said:
so could I jump on a Lathe and make myself a 10inch barrel for an 870?

I feel like I might get flammed for asking that. lol
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Only if you were a licensed firearm manufacturer and only if you were "manufacturing" the barrel either from scratch or from a blank. We're splitting hairs, but it would still be illegal for a licensed manufacturer to cut down the existing barrel of his or someone elses gun... As silly as that may sound. The short barrel must be newly manufactured.
 
A firearm manufacturer's licence is necessary to commercially manufacture firearms.
A firearms manufacturer's licence is not necessary to make a firearm. (Homemade firearms are routinely registered).
Is a firearm manufacturer's licence necessary to manufacture - or finish from a blank - a firearm barrel? A firearm barrel isn't a firearm. Why would it be necessary to have a firearm manufacturer's licence to make something that is not a firearm?
If a person can make and register a firearm, obviously he can make a barrel for himself.
 
tiriaq said:
A firearm manufacturer's licence is necessary to commercially manufacture firearms.
A firearms manufacturer's licence is not necessary to make a firearm. (Homemade firearms are routinely registered).
Is a firearm manufacturer's licence necessary to manufacture - or finish from a blank - a firearm barrel? A firearm barrel isn't a firearm. Why would it be necessary to have a firearm manufacturer's licence to make something that is not a firearm?
If a person can make and register a firearm, obviously he can make a barrel for himself.
Click to expand...

Hmm.... you do make a good point. So then a individual conceivably could buy a barrel blank, or machine one form stock, manufacture it to a length of, say 10 inches, and that barrel would not be prohib as long as the individual could prove that he did not chop down an existing barrel?... interesting thought...
 
If the firearm is a longarm, a short or shortened barrel is not a prohibited device. A firearm with a sawed off barrel is a prohibited firearm, but the barrel itself, detached, has no status. Sub 105mm handgun barrels are a different issue.
 
tiriaq said:
If the firearm is a longarm, a short or shortened barrel is not a prohibited device. A firearm with a sawed off barrel is a prohibited firearm, but the barrel itself, detached, has no status. Sub 105mm handgun barrels are a different issue.
Click to expand...

From your explaination I could not take a 28" model 870 Rem & shorten the barrel to 20" myself...is that correct?
 
You can shorten your existing 870 barrel to any length greater than 18", without having the shotgun wind up as a prohibited firearm, as a result of the barrel work.
If you cut it to less than that length, your shotgun would become a prohibited firearm.
 
krausb said:
Hmm.... you do make a good point. So then a individual conceivably could buy a barrel blank, or machine one form stock, manufacture it to a length of, say 10 inches, and that barrel would not be prohib as long as the individual could prove that he did not chop down an existing barrel?... interesting thought...
Click to expand...

The burden is not on you to prove it was a legally manufactured barrel. The burden is on the Crown to prove the firearm was sawed or chopped. Unless there are obvious chop/saw marks, this could very hard to prove.

An individual could conceivably be in possession of a sub 18" sawed barrel prohibited firearm, but because the barrel "COULD" have been manufactured that way (no one knows the entire history of every barrel. Or maybe you do, the point is, the governmen't doesnt), the odds of being convicted are low.
 
It might not be very hard to prove a barrel had been chopped.
Most factory marrels do have markings relating to manufacturer, etc.
Most factory barrels are known to have been made in specific lengths.
There are also tool marks that would be characteristic of industrial production that would not be duplicated in a home shop.
Anyone with a shortgun would be well advised to not have a barrel of questionable pedigree.
 
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