XCR Accuracy?
- Thread starter vince
- Start date
- Location
- Niagara Region, Ontario. For now
Well doesnt appear anyone wants to brag! There has been some discussion on the topic, and from what I understand it is acceptable but thats about it!
F22_RaptoR
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Edmonton, Alberta
Your right there have been threads on this so just hit the search feature and type in XCR and you'll find range/shooting reports.
Make sure to go to the "Find Posts From" area and change it something further back than "A week ago"
Having had one apart now, I'm not so surprised these rifles have accuracy issues. The way the barrel fits into the receiver and is retained by a single set screw is a serious compromise to accuracy.
In order for the barrel to be easily removable, there has to be some clearance between the receiver and the barrel extension. It is exactly that clearance combined with the single set screw retainer that likely results in the iffy accuracy.
I don't think an XCR is ever going to be as accurate as an AR is capable of.
In order for the barrel to be easily removable, there has to be some clearance between the receiver and the barrel extension. It is exactly that clearance combined with the single set screw retainer that likely results in the iffy accuracy.
I don't think an XCR is ever going to be as accurate as an AR is capable of.
Don't really know the answer to that for sure. Possibly a better barrel would improve the accuracy but I doubt it will ever be as good as a high end AR target rifle. However it could be much better than the OEM chrome lined XCR barrel. We just wouldn't know till we have tried it. Remember, not all AR's are created equal either, some are more accurate than others.
I think the ability to buy a custom XCR barrel allows you to have a heavier or lighter or longer barrel than OEM or to choose a cartridge that the rifle is not offered in by the manufacturer.
For example, the XCR being non-restricted could be taken out hunting but there are better choices for hunting than the 223. 6.5 Grendel, 6x45 and 300 Whisper all spring to mind. Then some people just want to try something different just for the sake of it.
This is exactly the benefit that I see to the new barrel options that ATRS is offering. The factory XCR options are far from ideal for hunting both due to the front weight, and the cartridge. Here we can solve either, or both of these. A 6.5 Grendel with a lighter barrel would be nice.
Many have been asking about accuracy improvements for huntable calibers. In those situations, is the rifle going to be the limiter, or is the shooter?
Davy Crockett
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Fraser Valley
Somewhere from 2-4 MOA
- Location
- Niagara Region, Ontario. For now
For $2500?????????? WTF?????????????????
- Location
- Niagara Region, Ontario. For now
Id rather Tapco #### a Mini 14/30 or an SKS!!!!!
Davy Crockett
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Fraser Valley
You know what they say about internet groups...
First, I didn't say that was the groups I'm getting but that seems to be what a lot of people are reporting. Second, I'm not talking about hand loaded ammo, just dirty old 55 grain PMC/AE FMJ .223, the stuff most people are going to be shooting. If you do better great, but I don't think it's fair to mislead people into thinking this rifle is going to be a tack driver because the odds are it won't be.
Ar180shooter
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Ottawa, ON
More like 2 MOA, possible sub MOA with good reloads. 2 MOA is about what I'm getting from my Swiss Arms using Winchester White box.
That's good, but 3 shot groups don't mean much. To properly test a rifles accuracy, you want 10 shot groups.
Davy Crockett
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Fraser Valley
There are others on here who have gotten significantly worse than 2MOA but I'm not here to speak for them.
I'd say personally I get an honest 2 - 2.5 moa with AE 55gr FMJ and the original heavy one stage trigger. I don't think that's terrible, no worse than a lot of out of the box AR's. I may invest in the match trigger if I decide to keep the rifle in the future.
I'm not slagging the rifle, there's a lot to like about it and mine has never had any reliability issues but I still don't see it being an MOA or sub-MOA rifle in most cases.
Go to
http://www.robarm.com/XCR_Accuracy.htm
Disclaimer:
Given that the website is from the company that made the XCR there most be a grain of salt. However, I find that this is pretty good (but not exact) comparison to my own groups with a magnified optic.
My Personal Reality with the XCR
Are you going to punch regular one ragged hole groups at 100 yards with an XCR. Sadly no, not right now (More on this later). With practice I have found from my own experience and my range buddies that one can get 1.5-2 inch groups at 100 meters with regularity with practice and American Eagle (AE) 62 grain rounds. I have shot MOA groups but only recently after much practice and generally using 69 grain match rounds. In my own experience 62 grain and 69 grain bullets seems to shoot the best through my rifle. I have no experience with 77 grain .224 bullets so I cannot comment on them.
The reason I say it "not right now" is that compared to the AR15 the XCR is still an infant. The AR15 was not known to be the accurate and generally reliable (when kept lubed and maintained) firearm most of us know that it is, when it first arrived. The AR15 like most firearms have an exponential development. From my brief knowledge and minimal research I obtained these findings. If I am incorrect please politely add your findings with the reference. I'm human and can make mistakes (like throwing flyers to destroy amazing groups). The AR15 only truly started to become the light recoil tack driver after years of development starting with the U.S. Marines and Army Marksmenship Unit (AMU). The Marines first demanded changes that led to the A2 design (better sights, heavier barrel, and faster rifling twist). The AMU added match grade barrels, free floated them, and improved the trigger lock time. Next the ammo improved bringing match grade .223 ammo with 69, 75, 77 and 80 grain match bullets. The first AR15/AR10 came around 1964-5 and has taken almost thirty to forty years (SR-25 came around 1992 which boasted most "common" features and the Mk12 which appeared in 2002) before it really began to live up to it's potential.
Given that the XCR came out around 2005-06. I will afford it the possibility and potential to become as accurate as the AR15/AR10. Only now are we seeing custom stainless steel barrels thanks to Alberta Tactical Rifle. It will take time before gunsmiths fully understand the inner workings of the XCR and how it can be tweaked towards perfection. I believe the XCR will have a similar but likely slower development as it's popularity grows since it is not a service rifle/carbine in the U.S. military inventory.
Currently, I find the XCR to have generally good accuracy that would make it acceptable as a patrol rifle/carbine. What is deemed acceptable can have a different meaning for different people however. For this I consider that the U.S. military considered that the rifle had to shoot 4 MOA to qualify. The rifle had to be 2 MOA and the ammo 2 MOA and supposedly that is why 4 MOA is acceptable for a service rifle. Just something to think about.
Is the XCR perfect? No. Is any firearm perfect? I think not.
If you cannot live without your black/green rifle/carbine not able to shoot MOA or sub-MOA groups, don't buy it (at least for now). If you want one that works all the time as long as you do your part (good ammo, good magazines, seat the magazine properly... etc.), why not try it out.
References:
Venola, Richard (2005). "What a Long Strange Trip It's Been". Book of the AR-15 1 (2): 6–18.
http://world.guns.ru/assault/as18-e.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M16_rifle
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Navy_Mark_12_Mod_X_Special_Purpose_Rifle
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_the_AK-47_and_M16
http://www.robarm.com/XCR_Accuracy.htm
Disclaimer:
Given that the website is from the company that made the XCR there most be a grain of salt. However, I find that this is pretty good (but not exact) comparison to my own groups with a magnified optic.
My Personal Reality with the XCR
Are you going to punch regular one ragged hole groups at 100 yards with an XCR. Sadly no, not right now (More on this later). With practice I have found from my own experience and my range buddies that one can get 1.5-2 inch groups at 100 meters with regularity with practice and American Eagle (AE) 62 grain rounds. I have shot MOA groups but only recently after much practice and generally using 69 grain match rounds. In my own experience 62 grain and 69 grain bullets seems to shoot the best through my rifle. I have no experience with 77 grain .224 bullets so I cannot comment on them.
The reason I say it "not right now" is that compared to the AR15 the XCR is still an infant. The AR15 was not known to be the accurate and generally reliable (when kept lubed and maintained) firearm most of us know that it is, when it first arrived. The AR15 like most firearms have an exponential development. From my brief knowledge and minimal research I obtained these findings. If I am incorrect please politely add your findings with the reference. I'm human and can make mistakes (like throwing flyers to destroy amazing groups). The AR15 only truly started to become the light recoil tack driver after years of development starting with the U.S. Marines and Army Marksmenship Unit (AMU). The Marines first demanded changes that led to the A2 design (better sights, heavier barrel, and faster rifling twist). The AMU added match grade barrels, free floated them, and improved the trigger lock time. Next the ammo improved bringing match grade .223 ammo with 69, 75, 77 and 80 grain match bullets. The first AR15/AR10 came around 1964-5 and has taken almost thirty to forty years (SR-25 came around 1992 which boasted most "common" features and the Mk12 which appeared in 2002) before it really began to live up to it's potential.
Given that the XCR came out around 2005-06. I will afford it the possibility and potential to become as accurate as the AR15/AR10. Only now are we seeing custom stainless steel barrels thanks to Alberta Tactical Rifle. It will take time before gunsmiths fully understand the inner workings of the XCR and how it can be tweaked towards perfection. I believe the XCR will have a similar but likely slower development as it's popularity grows since it is not a service rifle/carbine in the U.S. military inventory.
Currently, I find the XCR to have generally good accuracy that would make it acceptable as a patrol rifle/carbine. What is deemed acceptable can have a different meaning for different people however. For this I consider that the U.S. military considered that the rifle had to shoot 4 MOA to qualify. The rifle had to be 2 MOA and the ammo 2 MOA and supposedly that is why 4 MOA is acceptable for a service rifle. Just something to think about.
Is the XCR perfect? No. Is any firearm perfect? I think not.
If you cannot live without your black/green rifle/carbine not able to shoot MOA or sub-MOA groups, don't buy it (at least for now). If you want one that works all the time as long as you do your part (good ammo, good magazines, seat the magazine properly... etc.), why not try it out.
References:
Venola, Richard (2005). "What a Long Strange Trip It's Been". Book of the AR-15 1 (2): 6–18.
http://world.guns.ru/assault/as18-e.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M16_rifle
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Navy_Mark_12_Mod_X_Special_Purpose_Rifle
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_the_AK-47_and_M16
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Three shot groups are statistically meaningless - unless they are stacked one on top of the other with the aiming points lined up. In all likelihood, the composite group size will be somewhat greater than any single 3 shot cluster.
I have fired only one brand new XCR. Nightforce 2 1/2 - 10 on top, several different loads, firing from a bench at 100m. Two shooters, both capable.
The rifle shot an honest 4 minutes. I was disappointed.
Would it settle down and shoot better in the future? I would certainly hope so.
Would I consider buying one on the basis of this experience? No.
I have fired only one brand new XCR. Nightforce 2 1/2 - 10 on top, several different loads, firing from a bench at 100m. Two shooters, both capable.
The rifle shot an honest 4 minutes. I was disappointed.
Would it settle down and shoot better in the future? I would certainly hope so.
Would I consider buying one on the basis of this experience? No.
