Alberta - Is RAMP Dead?

[norskie]

I was there, I heard him, and so did 300 other people. Enough substantiation for you?

Did some leg work myself

February 25th Red Deer Advodate article written by Bob Scammel has contents of Mr. Knights idea that cervids belong in Agriculture which was stated at the AFGA conference this spring.

I had heard of this third hand - but good to confirm.

 

[bubbasno1]

I actually reported it this morning to the administrator but I guess in fairness I should say I'm pretty sure as I don't have access to the IPs but on another site where this individual has had in excess of 20 profiles, I haven't been wrong about this individual yet so I suspect I'm right here as well. I'm sure you'll look into it....thanks! I can PM you the details if you like.

Now, back on track with RAMP....hopefully Grant answers one of us soon....it will be interesting to see what he or another government official has to say.

Firstly, pretty irresponsible of you to accuse someone of having multiple profiles when you have no solid proof except a hunch.

Secondly, I agree hopefully some information comes out in the near future. I know my emails have been read just not sure if any response is forthcoming. Just like everything else to do with open spaces secrecy is the theme of the day.

 

[sheephunter]

Well, with any luck the peanut gallery can hopefully put aside their petty personal agendas and we can get to the bottom of this rumour. It's way too serious of an issue to bog it down with petty chatter. Keep the e-mails flowing. Eventually someone has to answer them.

 

[guido]

Well, with any luck the peanut gallery can hopefully put aside their petty personal agendas and we can get to the bottom of this rumour. It's way too serious of an issue to bog it down with petty chatter. Keep the e-mails flowing. Eventually someone has to answer them.

Went from accusing one member of having multiple profiles, which was WRONG, to a whole gallery of posters with personal agendas. hmmmmm.

Patiently waiting for responses to my e-mailed request to the supposed people in the know. I am fully expecting a canned response that has a bunch of pleasant sounding words in it,

 

[norskie]

Well, with any luck the peanut gallery can hopefully put aside their petty personal agendas and we can get to the bottom of this rumour. It's way too serious of an issue to bog it down with petty chatter. Keep the e-mails flowing. Eventually someone has to answer them.

could cut the irony here with a chainsaw folks.....

 

[sheephunter]

As promised!

Thanks for your inquiry and for taking the time to contact me directly. There have been several changes to the RAMP pilot study this year. The following list summarizes those changes that have been made. We are in the process of updating the RAMP website with a notice explaining these changes. For year 2, RAMP will focus on continued assessment of current access management tools and development of other tools to improve communication between hunters, anglers, and private landowners.


1) The pilot study has been shortened to 2 years which will now end on March 31, 2011

2) All landowner payments i.e. habitat stewardship and access impact have been discontinued for this final year of the pilot study.

3) Landowners who choose to participate this year will continue to receive maps, signage, sign in boxes, and permission slips (RAC-SSC's).

4) RAMP staff will not be conducting any habitat health assessments however landowners will receive a Habitat Health Assessment Plan for their property developed by Cows & Fish, and Alberta Sustainable Resource Development.

5) All property maps have been removed from the website until new landowner agreements have been completed. The website maps will be available prior to hunting season and throughout the fall if/when new landowners join the program.

6) RAMP will be accepting more landowners into the program this year. Those interested can contact Grant Chapman.

7) Properties that are no longer in RAMP will have all signage, sign in boxes, and maps removed from the property and the website. Access managment on these properties will be up to the landowner.



All other aspects of the program will remain the same for this final year of the pilot study.

 

[guido]

Thanks SH It is the same e-mail I received. And I suppose everyone else. Looks like RAMP is going to die a slow death (Hopefully)

 

[sheephunter]

So am I reading #2 correctly that landowners will receive no compensation this year?

 

[sheephunter]

Thanks SH It is the same e-mail I received. And I suppose everyone else. Looks like RAMP is going to die a slow death (Hopefully)

Perhaps not so slow if there is no monetary compensation. Wasn't that the only incentive for landowners to participate? Seems to me with no carrot there will be no participants. I guess this is their graceful way of backing out rather that just saying it failed because there was no planning where the funding would come from. I've questioned the revenue source from day one and could never get a straight answer. I guess this explains why. No one had a clue where the funding would come from.

 

[sheephunter]

Just received confirmation that there is no monetary compensation for landowners this year. Pretty much the final nail I'd say.

 

[bubbasno1]

That was the rumors I was getting. No compensation for landowners. Really can't see any of them participating in this now. So thankfully this will be the death of the program.

 

[sheephunter]

That was the rumors I was getting. .

Ya me too but I feel more warm and fuzzy seeing it in print. Been way too many rumours since day one but nice to see this one have some substance!

 

[Tempest]

Ya me too but I feel more warm and fuzzy seeing it in print. Been way too many rumours since day one but nice to see this one have some substance!

Well its good that it is finally out there.

Dead at last.

Not sad to see it go but even those participating probably didn't deserve the death that this is going to take.

Someday you'll put down in writing all of these rumours and then you'll put down all the verifications of those rumours and perhaps it will come to you that perhaps we just got run over by a herd of zebras.

You are one piece of work.

 

[sheephunter]

Hopefully the time to celebrate is upon us. The optimisitic side of me says RAMP is dead...the pessimistic side says there are numerous ways the government could interpret the results of the pilot project.....not all in the resident hunters' favour.

I'll resist the temptation to trade insults tempest... The first and last one is yours.

 

[bubbasno1]

I fear this will open up the opportunity to try and implement HFH or a version of it. No funding necessary for that program which would definitely appeal to any politician especially if it could buy them a few votes.

 

[sheephunter]

I fear this will open up the opportunity to try and implement HFH or a version of it. No funding necessary for that program which would definitely appeal to any politician especially if it could buy them a few votes.

Just speculating out loud here but it would put an end to their funding problems for RAMP. No need for my tinfoil hat yet but it would be a wise idea for all sportsmen to keep an eye on what spin the government puts on the pilot project. It would be easy to say that landowners allowed plenty of access when compensated and little when not compensated so we need to figure out a plan for the user groups to fund this because the Government can't. The optimistic side of me says they are gracefully bowing out of this fiasco but I'm not willing to close my eyes and sleep comfortably yet.

 

[norskie]

Well its good that it is finally out there.

Dead at last.

Not sad to see it go but even those participating probably didn't deserve the death that this is going to take.

Someday you'll put down in writing all of these rumours and then you'll put down all the verifications of those rumours and perhaps it will come to you that perhaps we just got run over by a herd of zebras.

You are one piece of work.

Agreed.

I guess the rumor that paid hunting was threat was bogus.

I guess the rumor that AFGA and other outdoor groups had folks sitting at the table not sharing the information with the membership was bogus

I guess the thought that the hand picked working group was operating with there best interests was bogus.

I could go on and on.

If I had a quarter for every time a rumor was brought forth and proven correct I could likely buy a copy of a crappy hunting video.

Thank God some of these guys had the guts to report there "rumors" and the resolve to follow their gut.

 

[Waxy]

It is nice to see it in writing, but I'm still not sleeping easy. That info might have come down from the top, but the top wasn't willing to put their name on it. What's scarier to me, is that there are way too many ways that this could still be a nightmare for us in AB.

There's going to be some p'od landowners out there when they find out the money just dried up, not all of them for sure, but there'll be a vocal minority, you can bank on that. Are they going to blame Uncle Ted? Maybe. SRD and gov't? Likely. Are they going to blame the hunters that vocally opposed the program? You better believe it.

Are Morton, Gates, Knopff and the core group of landowners that were behind this from the start going to throw their hands up and give in? Not friggin likely. More likely their already scheming the next program (can you say HFH?) that'll avoid the pitfalls that RAMP and Open Spaces stumbled on.

Depending on landowner reaction to the cancellation of the program and their funding, this thing could be spun numerous ways that won't be good for AB hunters, and in particular the relationship between hunters and landowners. Sadly, those that caused the mess will likely simply slip away into the night and let others deal with it.

We need to stay vigilant and stay on top of the "rumours". Hopefully someone will do that over at AO too, even if it means stepping on some toes, because almost to a man, everyone that was instrumental in fighting Open Spaces and bringing attention to it has been banned from that forum.

Waxy

 

[sheephunter]

We need to stay vigilant and stay on top of the "rumours". Hopefully someone will do that over at AO too, even if it means stepping on some toes, because almost to a man, everyone that was instrumental in fighting Open Spaces and bringing attention to it has been banned from that forum.

Waxy

Ya, too bad that some of the most vocal opponents insisted on playing outside the forum rules but rules are rules I guess. Seems to me that there are still lots of "instrumental" members on other forums. Perhaps with names you just don't recognize. Anyhow, info is flowing freely, as always, on other sites that I'm a member of and Alberta's sportsmen and women should be well informed. I agree with your statements about remaining ever vigilant!

 

[Waxy]

Ya, too bad that some of the most vocal opponents insisted on playing outside the forum rules but rules are rules I guess.

If was actually true that "playing outside the forum rules" got you banned, and that "rules are rules", you'd be firmly entrenched on the banned list too.

I don't think it's any secret how things work over there.

Waxy