Interesting Long Branch No.4

LawrenceN

LawrenceN

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Here's some questions for all you experts on the No.4 Lee Enfields. I recently acquired a nice 1943, birch stocked, example. A few things of interest. On the left side of the part where the butt and forestock meet, there's also a number '52 stamped. I'm assuming a 1952 refrub. It weighs more than my other No.4's and that leads me to think it may have been cork and lead bedded for accuracy. You will have noted the PH5 target sight on it. Hard to see, but stamped into the wood on the left side below the receiver are the numbers "262" and on the right side of the buttstock itself are the letters "F R". The wood shows the normal compression dents and divots of any used rifle that old, but the bore is beautiful. On the underside of the stock ahead of the magazine well are the letters "KD" and a number "5". The stock components so far show the same serial number as the action and the buttstock also has the number "52" stamped on the underside of the wrist where it meets the metal. I haven't stripped it right down as yet, but I have a very knowledgable buddy who has one similar who could make sure I don't make any faux pas in the operation. Any information you could provide would be most appreciated as well as an idea of it's current market value. Thanks all!
1943LongBranchLeeEnfieldNo4004.jpg

1943LongBranchLeeEnfieldNo4001.jpg
 
twig_40 said:
What is DCRA?
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Twig, check the letters DRCA (not DCRA) stands for Dominion of Canada Rifle Association. This was from the good ol' days when the government actually supported shooting sports. We'd been through 2 world wars and the Korean conflict and everyone knew it was in our best interests to have experienced shooters to draw upon for military service.
 
plinker 777 said:
Not worth a thing......you should give it to me:D......is that suncorite i see on the bolt!:eek: yep definitely not worth your time.....if i give you my address I'll pay for the shipping so your not out ok?!:p
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Plinker I just COULDN'T hold you to that, as astoundingly generous as your offer is. I'd feel dreadful if you were out of pocket while doing me the favour of relieving me of the burden of ownership of this clunker. Maybe I'll cut the metal up for it's scrap value and use the wood for fire starter.
 
If the barrel is smooth with no bayonette lugs, it is likely a DCRA conversion from .303 to 7.62. And, what does the registration say .... ?

The rifles were not actually converted by the DCRA. The owner would send his No.4 rifle, often the slightly undependable #2 on the rack versus the known and reliable #1 on the rack, to Canadian Arsenals Ltd. They would change the barrel and stamp on the numbers. Swapping sights was a little deal, because all the screw holes line up with existing holes. If the owner wasn't up to changing the sight himself, all clubs had either an informal armourer or preferred access to military workshops. Whatever you do, be careful not to disrupt the bedding or careful fitting of parts and surfaces. There is a certain element of juju to getting No.4s to shoot properly.
 
value

Some of the shooters that had those rifles, took very good care of them and they looked like the day they were built. If the rifle is chambered in 303, there are several possibilities as to its provenance.
It could have been a military rifle set up for military matches or it could have been set up by a civilian for DCRA matches etc.

Many have washed out throats from thousands of downrange rounds and need to be rebarreled.

Depending on interior barrel condition and wear, the rifle could be worth anywhere from $400 - $650.

The 303 chambered versions, set up for military matches don't seem to have survived that well. I run accross a lot more ex DCRA rifles chambered in 7.62x51 than 303 Brit. That doesn't seem to increase their value though.
 
Thank you both, bearhunter and maple leaf eh. It is still in the original .303 calibre and the bore shows no sign of being anywhere near to "shot out". Without having it gauged by a gunsmith I can't tell anything more until I get it to the range.
 
LawrenceN said:
Plinker I just COULDN'T hold you to that, as astoundingly generous as your offer is. I'd feel dreadful if you were out of pocket while doing me the favour of relieving me of the burden of ownership of this clunker. Maybe I'll cut the metal up for it's scrap value and use the wood for fire starter.
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Fine then ...have it your way! You may want to take the rear sight off before you smelt it. might bring $5 or $10;).....all kidding aside, that's a beauty. Try to invert a .303 round in the muzzle, it should only go in about a 1/3 of the way. Bit of a low tech/ red neck way of checking, but in the absence of a mic it will give you an idea. I'm sure it's fine the rifle looks to well taken care of to be shot/ rotted out. Remember back in the day, their ammo was corrosive and as such if it wasn't cared for or shot often the barrels just couldn't handle it. Don't forget to post a range report after you shoot her, we'd like to know how it shoots!....and oh yea, if you find the rifle is just to heavy with all that "unnecessary" wood on it.....my offer will still stand:p
 
plinker 777 said:
Fine then ...have it your way! You may want to take the rear sight off before you smelt it. might bring $5 or $10;).....all kidding aside, that's a beauty. Try to invert a .303 round in the muzzle, it should only go in about a 1/3 of the way. Bit of a low tech/ red neck way of checking, but in the absence of a mic it will give you an idea. I'm sure it's fine the rifle looks to well taken care of to be shot/ rotted out. Remember back in the day, their ammo was corrosive and as such if it wasn't cared for or shot often the barrels just couldn't handle it. Don't forget to post a range report after you shoot her, we'd like to know how it shoots!....and oh yea, if you find the rifle is just to heavy with all that "unnecessary" wood on it.....my offer will still stand:p
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Thanks Plinker. I took your advice about trying a bullet in the muzzle to see where it sits. With the purchase of this rifle I also bought an UNFIRED 1950 Long Branch No.4. I'll be cleaning cosmoline off that for a while after I get it stripped down. I took a new Speers bullet and put in the muzzle of the '43, marked it with a fine felt tip pen, and then put that bullet in the muzzle of the '50 and again marked it with the same pen. Guess what? One line is right on top of the other, which tells me that the '43 had very few rounds through it. As I'd said when I started the post, the rifling is beautiful and crisp. Whoever owned and shot this babied it for sure. Maybe it was his first DCRA variant, and then he went to the rebarreled .308 models. Who knows? I would still love it if anyone could give me a good idea about the stampings on the stock of my '43. Given the condition of the bore and overall shape of the rifle, I think I've got a real keeper, but the virgin 1950 is still my little pride and joy.
 
Oh sure, rub it in why don't you! a beautiful '43 LB and your not happy without the cosmoline goo'd UNFIRED 1950 as well....I mean, I've heard of greed before but this just takes the cake! I DEMAND to see a pic of the 1950 dammit! To add insult to injury I'll bet that you'll be able to confirm with a micrometer that someone set up those sights on the '43 and stored it without even sighting it in:eek:!......Go buy a lotto ticket! :p
 
1950 unfired Long Branch No.4

plinker 777 said:
Oh sure, rub it in why don't you! a beautiful '43 LB and your not happy without the cosmoline goo'd UNFIRED 1950 as well....I mean, I've heard of greed before but this just takes the cake! I DEMAND to see a pic of the 1950 dammit! To add insult to injury I'll bet that you'll be able to confirm with a micrometer that someone set up those sights on the '43 and stored it without even sighting it in:eek:!......Go buy a lotto ticket! :p
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OK Plinker, you asked for it, you got it! I took a few pics, and when I get better light, I'll try for some tighter shots of the action. It's got some interesting stamps on the right side of the barrel just back of the muzzle. As near as I can make out, it says ".303 CAN" and under that (the stamps aren't perfectly clear) but it looks like "CAL ST A1B VT". Any thoughts from any of you experts? The wood shows the normal compression dents one would expect from a rifle this old, but the stock is still slightly rough to the touch from lack of handling. I will do some work on the stock to bring it up to better shape.
1950LongBranchLeeEnfieldNo4002.jpg
 
Those marks near the muzzle are US import stampings, done by Century Arms. Any rifle imported into the US will have em.

Nice grabs btw!

I've had a few new looking 50 LB's, they're very close to a crate rifle like the mummy wrapped Fazakerly Irish Contract rifles but Canadian!

BTW, my one 1950 parked rifle had a very tight chamber dimension. Brass fired in it barely expanded forward. Good rifles for brass life.



LawrenceN said:
OK Plinker, you asked for it, you got it! I took a few pics, and when I get better light, I'll try for some tighter shots of the action. It's got some interesting stamps on the right side of the barrel just back of the muzzle. As near as I can make out, it says ".303 CAN" and under that (the stamps aren't perfectly clear) but it looks like "CAL ST A1B VT". Any thoughts from any of you experts? The wood shows the normal compression dents one would expect from a rifle this old, but the stock is still slightly rough to the touch from lack of handling. I will do some work on the stock to bring it up to better shape.
1950LongBranchLeeEnfieldNo4002.jpg
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LawrenceN said:
OK Plinker, you asked for it, you got it! I took a few pics, and when I get better light, I'll try for some tighter shots of the action. It's got some interesting stamps on the right side of the barrel just back of the muzzle. As near as I can make out, it says ".303 CAN" and under that (the stamps aren't perfectly clear) but it looks like "CAL ST A1B VT". Any thoughts from any of you experts? The wood shows the normal compression dents one would expect from a rifle this old, but the stock is still slightly rough to the touch from lack of handling. I will do some work on the stock to bring it up to better shape.
1950LongBranchLeeEnfieldNo4002.jpg
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Also have a 1950. Is your rear sight Mk.III?
 
LawrenceN said:
It's got some interesting stamps on the right side of the barrel just back of the muzzle. As near as I can make out, it says ".303 CAN" and under that (the stamps aren't perfectly clear) but it looks like "CAL ST A1B VT". Any thoughts from any of you experts?
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Those are import marks.
 
OMG :eek:...look @ the mag and receiver (not a scratch)....ME LIKIE!!!! Raw linseed oil and a lot of elbow grease for the furniture. Brass butt plate or aluminium? anything inside?(oiler & pull through).
A tip for oiling that a fellow cgner gave me when I purchased wood from him {thanks Ron} he hand rubs in the oil with the palm of his hand.....I suspect that the added friction helps the oil and wood absorption ratio. either way it works well!....try it, I guarantee you will appreciate the outcome:). beauty rifles, beauty find and thanks for the pics. Plinker777
 
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