Winchester Primer Problems

JMB is my Hero

JMB is my Hero

Member
Rating - 100%
42   0   0
Location
Port Alberni, BC
We'll start with the vital statistics.


.270 Win handloads
Hornady 130 gr GMX
Nosler brass (trim length 2.530 in, twice fired)
56gr IMR4831 (worked up from 51gr)
Winchester Large Rifle Magnum primers
Browning A-Bolt
73bc1f71.jpg
[/IMG]
5f0a7dde.jpg

This I have never come across before. I have seen firing pins rupture primers in too hot loads in other people rifles before. Never have I had an issue, and I've never seen a rupture in this fashion. While developing handloads I start at 90% of recommended max pressure, then work up. Typically I watch the primer for excessive flattening, and for that raised lip that develops around the firing pin. During the initial stages I saw nothing wrong right up to max and ventured as high as 56.5gr(max is listed at 56.1gr). First shot came out looking fine, primer was good. There was no shiny marks on the head stamp from the bolt face. I was happy......till the next shot. Shot #2 of the 56.5gr load blew the corner out of the primer, sent a bit of smoke pouring out of my action and all in all scared the crap out of me. Shot #3 was dismantled and recycled.


Since the 56gr load was fairly accurate I went with it. I loaded the rest of the 130 GMX I had left and went to sight my rifle in. I put almost 20 rounds of this load through my rifle before the next one failed.

Any ideas on whether if it's primer failure, my general Dumb-Assness for loading hot, or maybe loose primer pockets in the Nosler brass? Now this being said I have loaded with these primers in Federal and Winchester brass(some pretty hot loads) and never had an issue.

PS I'm guessing I should replace the bolt. Anyone know where I can find a bolt for a 90's A-Bolt?
 
i would either light load the rest of the primers, or toss them (in the fire:)).

how deep is the etching on the bolt face? i personally don't see it having any bad effects.
 
Bolt is still usable.

The max load is the max in THEIR rifle, not yours. I have seen Start loads that were much too hot in a given rifle.

You were shooting a load too hot for that rifle. Since you can't read pressures, read velocity with a chrony. With good powder, pressure translates to velocity, which you can read.
 
JMB is my Hero said:
Any ideas on whether if it's primer failure, my general Dumb-Assness for loading hot, or maybe loose primer pockets in the Nosler brass? Now this being said I have loaded with these primers in Federal and Winchester brass(some pretty hot loads) and never had an issue.

PS I'm guessing I should replace the bolt. Anyone know where I can find a bolt for a 90's A-Bolt?
Click to expand...

Well, you loaded them, were the primer pockets loose? Not that I think that has anything to do with what happened.

As Ganderite stated, you shouldn't be venturing into max+ territory without a chrony. Not all rifles will exhibit any visual signs of pressure until it's too late.

I wouldn't worry about the bolt-face etching either.
 
I had the same result when I used some ammo my uncle loaded.He passed away and I got the ammo which I didn"t know how old it was.I pressed the old primers out and reprimed with new which worked fine.I think it was a bad batch of primers.
 
Been loading for this gun for 15 years, guess you learn something new everyday. I would not have thought that load was too hot. And priming the brass took little effort, but they didn't exactly fall in.

You guys would still use the bolt eh? I would have though that the damaged section of the bolt face would create a weak point for further primer problems.
 
GAIRLOCHIAN said:
I had the same result when I used some ammo my uncle loaded.He passed away and I got the ammo which I didn"t know how old it was.I pressed the old primers out and reprimed with new which worked fine.I think it was a bad batch of primers.
Click to expand...

I'm a little wary of punching out live primers. Is it safe to do on a press? I tossed some brass because of this.
 
lyman54 said:
I'm a little wary of punching out live primers. Is it safe to do on a press? I tossed some brass because of this.
Click to expand...

I've done it several times, slow and steady wins the race.

If your super worried fire off the primers in your rifle. Just clean the gun after your done.

Get an old rag and put your barrel into it and it will be really quiet. Dampen it if your doing alot as it will heat up.
 
This bolt will be just fine. There is another, similar thread about this here.
I have seen the phenomenon several times over the years.
Annoying, but not fatal, lol.
Eagleye.
 
Deprime live primers all the time. never had a problem.

When you load a rifle beyond the limit, a good rifle will show no problems at all. This makes it look safe.

But the pressure is contained by a series of containers, the case and primer being the first. When it lets go, it is the weak point in the chain that does it. This can be a poor case/pocket/primer. And once the gases start to leak out, they can cut metal and even wreck the rifle.

The fact that there was never a problem could be an indication there was never a bad primer or case before.

Get a Chrony. best $100 you can spend. Note the velocity in the book and take that as the speed limit. You will reach the limit with more or less powder they used in their rifle. each rifle is different.
 
Ganderite said:
Deprime live primers all the time. never had a problem.

When you load a rifle beyond the limit, a good rifle will show no problems at all. This makes it look safe.

But the pressure is contained by a series of containers, the case and primer being the first. When it lets go, it is the weak point in the chain that does it. This can be a poor case/pocket/primer. And once the gases start to leak out, they can cut metal and even wreck the rifle.

The fact that there was never a problem could be an indication there was never a bad primer or case before.

Get a Chrony. best $100 you can spend. Note the velocity in the book and take that as the speed limit. You will reach the limit with more or less powder they used in their rifle. each rifle is different.
Click to expand...

Sounds logical. And here I really wanted to get mad at Winchester, guess I'm big enough to admit my foolishness.
Thanks for the help Gents, it's always nice to have the CGN tech staff/sounding board.
Tyler
 
madpat said:
I would suggest taking the advice given in this thread: http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php?t=799016 which also involved win primers and nosler brass.
Punch the primer and inspect it to see if it failed or if the brass was at fault.
And as stated in this thread, chronies are cheap and really give you a good idea of hour your round is behaving.
Click to expand...

guess it pays to read who posts threads and what not. i was sure this was the same guy as in that thread, the holes look exactly the same!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom