375 Ruger Factory ammo

[Gatehouse]

So if I buy a rifle that wasn't intended for the 375 Ruger, there would be minimal dicking around to use this cartridge? If I buy a Ruger rifle in 375 H&H it should work fine, if I buy a Ruger in 375 Ruger it will also work fine. I didn't realize you meant modifying short actions for the H&H.

If you read the whole thread you would have seen where I was talking about FACTORY actions. For example, The Ruger MK II action will not accept a H&H, so they needed to make thier magnum rifle actions longer, which adds cost.

What do cell phones have to do with either cartridge?

Quite a bit. As soon as we had cell phones with the same performance as the old ones the size of a brick but were smaller, people switched to the smaller ones. The smaller ones with the same performance were considered superior. For most people, it's a pretty easy example to follow, as humans generally see same performance in a smaller package as an asset.

So Hornady makes the brass, who else? I like Winchester, Lapua, Norma, and Nosler personally... Most if not all make the H&H.

I've used the Hornady brass for quite a few loads and it works well. No complaints. Nosler is making 375 Ruger ammo (one of the points already made on this thread that you didn't really read) so you could get Nosler brass from them if you prefer.

I can buy the H&H factory loaded ammo two of three places that sell ammo here, Walmart doesn't have it. I know none of them here have the 375 Ruger yet, maybe they will catch up. Although I hand load, so I guess that doesn't really matter.

Factory ammo is readily available, but not at Walmart. It's a phone call away if a local store doesn't have it. For handloaders, it's a moot point, unless you are the type that tries to scrounge all your brass from the dirt at the shooting range, in which case you probably won't have much success.

You are right on the powder, my bad, I messed up when comparing from book to book by not using the same grain bullet.

I will have to call my PH, as I don't think it matters what someone on the net says about its use in Africa legally. I want to be sure before I waste my $$.

Considering it's been used extensively in Africa already, I doubt you will have problems, but it's up to you.

So in other words, so far it's shorter, less available brass and ammo, and in some cases not available at all, all other things close to equal.

It's shorter, works in shorter actions, has a slight performance increase, brass requires less trimming and brass and ammo are very available if you aren't a complete moron and unable to use a telephone.

I will keep researching, but so far I think I will be buying the H&H. Last thing I need is to pull a blonde moment and lose or forget my ammo, and end up carrying around a pretty walking cane.

People that are prone to forgetting their ammo should really only use 30-06's.

 

[Cleftwynd]

Wow, calm down! I have never ever forgot or lost my ammo, probably because I think of things like that and prepare.

Your cell phone comparison might make sense if we were talking about the batteries or something. I don't think the the rifle size has reduced 600% since the 80's. just the cartridge resulting in shorter actions which makes at most 8 ounces difference, not 6 lbs.

I did read the whole thread, I never once thought we were discussing modifying Ruger rifles for the H&H. All manufacturers make rifles for the H&H and no dicking around required, including Ruger.

I don't buy factory rolled, but if I did, I wouldn't want to HAVE to order it online due to hazmat. I wouldn't have to with H&H.

I realize Nosler WILL be making it, but I couldn't find any Nosler brass in stock anywhere yet as of a few days ago. H&H is everywhere.

6% more case volume, and 60 to 150 fps increase with almost the same volume of powder, that's cool, as is the less trimming, but that's part of reloading. I have a few cartridges that are much harder on brass then either of these. But the Ruger has another slight advantage there, people think, even those that are using the Ruger haven't reloaded enough to determine case life and brass prep yet.


So instead of asking you for something else that would prove it is so superior, and having insults insinuated in return. I shall remove myself from this topic and look elsewhere. I might even get one and compare myself so I get some real information, instead of opinions and emotions mixed with attitude and insults.

I didn't expect such an odd reaction from you, I was just looking for something more solid than "I said so" or "THE NEW KING".


My apologies to you and anyone else I have offended. Mods feel free to edit or remove any of my posts that are out of line.

 

[Gatehouse]

Wow, calm down!

Couldn't be calmer. I'm pretty direct in person, too.

I have never ever forgot or lost my ammo, probably because I think of things like that and prepare.

Tha's good that you don't forget your ammo. Then you can use cartridges other than the 30-06

Your cell phone comparison might make sense if we were talking about the batteries or something. I don't think the the rifle size has reduced 600% since the 80's. just the cartridge resulting in shorter actions which makes at most 8 ounces difference, not 6 lbs.

Cell phones, computers, weight of outdoor gear, smaller engines in cars that do more and cartridges- it's all the same thing. Humans see smaller with same performance as superior.

I did read the whole thread, I never once thought we were discussing modifying Ruger rifles for the H&H. All manufacturers make rifles for the H&H and no dicking around required, including Ruger.

I see you are just not getting it. Sorry, I've tried to spell it out several times. If you read the whole thread (and the many others on the topic, as I suggested) then you would understand the difference between Rugers STANDARD action and Rugers MAGNUM action and why developing the 375 Ruger made sense for Ruger and consumers.

I don't buy factory rolled, but if I did, I wouldn't want to HAVE to order it online due to hazmat. I wouldn't have to with H&H.

Or, since you plan ahead, you could ask your local gun store to bring some ammo in if they aren't stocking it. I have seen it in several shops in Vancouver, Edmonton, Vanderhoof, Prince George...ETC

I realize Nosler WILL be making it, but I couldn't find any Nosler brass in stock anywhere yet as of a few days ago. H&H is everywhere.

So is Hornady brass, and it's accurate and robust. Available with a phone call, if not at a good local store. No hazmat fees.

6% more case volume, and 60 to 150 fps increase with almost the same volume of powder, that's cool, as is the less trimming, but that's part of reloading. I have a few cartridges that are much harder on brass then either of these. But the Ruger has another slight advantage there, people think, even those that are using the Ruger haven't reloaded enough to determine case life and brass prep yet.

I've been loading for the NEW KING for at least 4 years. I've gone over much of it right here on CGN. Loads, data, case life, case trimming, accuracy......Bullets from 220gr to 350 gr. it's all here, on CGN.

So instead of asking you for something else that would prove it is so superior, and having insults insinuated in return. I shall remove myself from this topic and look elsewhere. I might even get one and compare myself so I get some real information, instead of opinions and emotions mixed with attitude and insults.

I didn't expect such an odd reaction from you, I was just looking for something more solid than "I said so" or "THE NEW KING".

You ask questions, won't do any research yourself and are bothered when you get direct answers?

You could have done some searches on the topic, as I suggested several times on this thread. Then you would have had all the information compiled over several years, without getting your feelings hurt when you ask the same questions over and over and it's pointed out to you.

 

[c-fbmi]

Cleftwynd;

You got him back peddaling, keep pushing and asking all those unanswerable questions, now for some facts;

The 375 H+H has been the most sold rifle and cartridge every year in bores over 33, including since the Ruger 3/8" bore arrived.
Ammunition is available from more companies and in more places around the world than any other cartridge with a bore over 33.
Every major rifle maker in the world chambers for the .375 H&H
Rifles are available from basement budget (Zastava) to some of the most expensive in the world, in .375 H&H. And every range in between.
Holland & Holland designed the .375 with the taper intentionally for ease of feeding and extraction, 100% reliability for use by men who used their rifle every day and whos lives depended on this reliability.
This cartridge was designed and loaded with 3 bullet weights, 235 gn, 270 gn and 300 gn and was loaded for Holland & Holland by Kynoch to put all three bullet weights into a 4" circle at 100 yds with iron sights, with no change of sight settings. It will still do this today with appropriate loads.
On the reloading end of the spectrum, all major brass manufacturers make .375 H&H brass.
The case sizes easily and the belt gives you perfect headspace everytime, even if you push the shoulder back a little too far.
The ballistic edge is neglegible with the new powders we have today (I load mine to 2935 fps with a 270 gn TSX and have shot this load in 55 deg c heat with no signs of pressure and had 100% reliability). Where's the ballistic edge I keep hearing about?
Even though my action throw is longer than the Ruger .375, my action (Rem 700) actually weighs less than the Ruger.
I can seat my bullets out to optimize land proximity and powder capacity, this cannot be done with the Ruger. (I know this for a fact as my son has an African in .375 Ruger)

Ruger could very well have dethroned the old H&H had they SAAMIed the 375 Chatfield-Taylor or the 375-300 Win Mag wildcats, thus giving hand loaders their infinite choice of brass. I know several Ruger owners that are having a lot of problems with Horn brass, a couple on CGN, Kevan here on this thread is one. Horn brass is too soft IMHO and is junk consistancy wise. In the H&H, if one brand of brass doesn't perform to your expectations try another of the 20 or so available. If a factory load doesn't perform to your expectations try another of the 20 or so available.

I submit to you all, that any percieved deficiencies the old .375 H&H has when compared to the Ruger offering are just that........PERCIEVED. None of the many animals I have taken with the old H&H cartridge would have died any faster or any deader or run any less or more yards if hit the same with the Ruger. I see no superiority of internal, external or terminal ballistics from the Ruger. Just another wannabe 375 H&H, a clone, an imposter, the illegitimate offspring of the TRUE KING OF THE 37s. You can't fix what ain't broke, period, and for 100 years the .375 H&H ain't been broke.
If you feel you need more there's bigger and faster out there in the 375 RUM, the 375 Wby and the 378 Wby. None of these has ever even come close to the old girl in sales I might add, even though they REALLY do have a ballistic edge.

One more little tidbit for all who may travel to South Africa with their 375s to hunt. South Africa law has just changed and all ammunition MUST be shipped as a separate piece of luggage. I found this out in Sept. when it cost me an extra $373.00 to remove my ammo from my checked bag and ship separate. Now my ammo box is a small metal cash box that locks as per airline regs. My odds of this small box not making it to SA went up exponentially the minute it became separated from my main checked bag. In my case, this time, it made it and it made it back, thank God!!
BUT this new law makes arriving with a rifle and NO ammo a very real, if not even probable, possibility. Which rifle would you rather arrive in Jo'burg with, having no ammo, the .375 H&H or some obscure odd duck Ruger offering that does everything an H&H does but in a shorter action with a sharper shoulder and no belt?............AND NO AMMO!!! GOOD LUCK ON YOUR HUNT!!!
But don't fear 'cause every outfitter and PH have a .375 H&H they will rent you AND an endless supply of ammo at 5-10 bucks a pop.

Just a few considerations in the bigger picture of world hunting.

Douglas

Oh ya, I forgot........ALL HAIL THE REAL KING - THE OLD KING and the TRUE MONARCHY OF THE 37s

 

[Cleftwynd]

If Gatehouse would just provide something more than what I am not disagreeing with I would have been happy, all I was asking for was some reason why the 375 Ruger is so superior as to make the H&H obsolete. I don't understand what the insults are about, but whatever.

I am still intrigued, I love oddballs and wildcats, but I still think the H&H is a far better choice for 99% of the people looking for a good 375. Rugers offering doesn't seem to offer anything extra, other than "it's shorter". Lord, I am even tired of typing that let alone reading the broken record responses.

If I could afford it, I would own both. In the last few days I have purchased two FN made mausers, both J C Higgins model 50's, one complete, and one with a broken stock and sawed off barrel. I will use the second action for an H&H I think.

 

[Gatehouse]

]

Cleftwynd;

You got him back peddaling, keep pushing and asking all those unanswerable questions, now for some facts;

Backpeddling? BS. I've been saying the same thing since I got a 375 Ruger in 2008

The 375 H+H has been the most sold rifle and cartridge every year in bores over 33, including since the Ruger 3/8" bore arrived.
Ammunition is available from more companies and in more places around the world than any other cartridge with a bore over 33.
Every major rifle maker in the world chambers for the .375 H&H
Rifles are available from basement budget (Zastava) to some of the most expensive in the world, in .375 H&H. And every range in between.

And most guys want a quality, handy rifle that is affordable. They don't want junk but they don't want to spend thousands. Enter The NEW KING.

Holland & Holland designed the .375 with the taper intentionally for ease of feeding and extraction, 100% reliability for use by men who used their rifle every day and whos lives depended on this reliability.

Back to the old tapered case argument. If it was valid in 2012, all cartridges woudl look like it. We figured out how to make bottleneck cartridges feed and extract a long time ago.

This cartridge was designed and loaded with 3 bullet weights, 235 gn, 270 gn and 300 gn and was loaded for Holland & Holland by Kynoch to put all three bullet weights into a 4" circle at 100 yds with iron sights, with no change of sight settings. It will still do this today with appropriate loads.

I can do that with 235-350gr bullets with my 375 Ruger. Not that it really matters since nobody hunts with 3 different weights of bulets at the same time.

On the reloading end of the spectrum, all major brass manufacturers make .375 H&H brass.

Which is a moot point really, as long as you have some decent brass, and Hornady 375 Ruger brass works well.

The case sizes easily and the belt gives you perfect headspace everytime, even if you push the shoulder back a little too far.

375 Ruger brass sizes easily, and if you are pushing the shoulder back too far on ANY cartridge, you need to re-examine your loading technique.

The ballistic edge is neglegible with the new powders we have today (I load mine to 2935 fps with a 270 gn TSX and have shot this load in 55 deg c heat with no signs of pressure and had 100% reliability). Where's the ballistic edge I keep hearing about

?

And I keep repeating- It's similar performance in a smaller package.

Even though my action throw is longer than the Ruger .375, my action (Rem 700) actually weighs less than the Ruger.

And if you used a lighter rifle in 375 Ruger, it would be lighter, too. Another moot point.

My 375 Ruger with the Macmillan stock weighs about 8.5 lbs IIRC. It doesn't need to be any lighter- or heavier.

I can seat my bullets out to optimize land proximity and powder capacity, this cannot be done with the Ruger. (I know this for a fact as my son has an African in .375 Ruger)

So your rifle has a long throat. Big deal. My Ruger is accurate and has as much or more velocity than the performance that the H&H reputation is built on.

Ruger could very well have dethroned the old H&H had they SAAMIed the 375 Chatfield-Taylor or the 375-300 Win Mag wildcats, thus giving hand loaders their infinite choice of brass. I know several Ruger owners that are having a lot of problems with Horn brass, a couple on CGN, Kevan here on this thread is one. Horn brass is too soft IMHO and is junk consistancy wise. In the H&H, if one brand of brass doesn't perform to your expectations try another of the 20 or so available. If a factory load doesn't perform to your expectations try another of the 20 or so available.

Now this is funny...FIrst you go on about how the H&H tapered case is so great, and now you say the straighter walled 375 CT would have dethroned the H&H.

So funny. How come my Hornady brass has long life and I get excellent accuracy? I guess I am the only one that got the "good" batch of brass?

I submit to you all, that any percieved deficiencies the old .375 H&H has when compared to the Ruger offering are just that........PERCIEVED. None of the many animals I have taken with the old H&H cartridge would have died any faster or any deader or run any less or more yards if hit the same with the Ruger. I see no superiority of internal, external or terminal ballistics from the Ruger. Just another wannabe 375 H&H, a clone, an imposter, the illegitimate offspring of the TRUE KING OF THE 37s. You can't fix what ain't broke, period, and for 100 years the .375 H&H ain't been broke.
If you feel you need more there's bigger and faster out there in the 375 RUM, the 375 Wby, the 375 Edge and the 378 Wby. None of these has ever even come close to the old girl in sales I might add, even though they REALLY do have a ballistic edge.

Nobody wanted the big 375's. The only one I personally would have wanted was the 375 Weatherby/375 AI. People wanted similar to H&H performance in a nice package, which is why the NEW KING has been, and will continue to be- so successful.

One more little tidbit for all who may travel to South Africa with their 375s to hunt. South Africa law has just changed and all ammunition MUST be shipped as a separate piece of luggage. I found this out in Sept. when it cost me an extra $373.00 to remove my ammo from my checked bag and ship separate. Now my ammo box is a small metal cash box that locks as per airline regs. My odds of this small box not making it to SA went up exponentially the minute it became separated from my main checked bag. In my case, this time, it made it and it made it back, thank God!!
BUT this new law makes arriving with a rifle and NO ammo a very real, if not even probable, possibility. Which rifle would you rather arrive in Jo'burg with, having no ammo, the .375 H&H or some obscure odd duck Ruger offering that does everything an H&H does but in a shorter action with a sharper shoulder and no belt?............AND NO AMMO!!! GOOD LUCK ON YOUR HUNT!!!
But don't fear 'cause every outfitter and PH have a .375 H&H they will rent you AND an endless supply of ammo at 5-10 bucks a pop.

I've seen on the Accurate reloading Africa forum that 375 Ruger ammo is becoming more available in Africa. But I guess that means that everyone considering taking a grand old double rifle or anything else not as common as 375 H&H and 30-06 should also scrap their plans to hunt with thier favorite rifles. Or not....

Just a few considerations in the bigger picture of world hunting.

.

Which mean sweet eff all to most guys who hunt mostly in Canada

Once again, all we see the H&H doing better than the 375 Ruger is providing a bit of nostalgia. If the 375 H&H was introduced today it's case design would be laughed at, because we know we can do it all in a smaller package. The 375 Ruger is what the H&H would look like if it was introduced in modern times.

 

[Gatehouse]

If Gatehouse would just provide something more than what I am not disagreeing with I would have been happy, all I was asking for was some reason why the 375 Ruger is so superior as to make the H&H obsolete. I don't understand what the insults are about, but whatever.

I am still intrigued, I love oddballs and wildcats, but I still think the H&H is a far better choice for 99% of the people looking for a good 375. Rugers offering doesn't seem to offer anything extra, other than "it's shorter". Lord, I am even tired of typing that let alone reading the broken record responses.

I'm really sorry that I hurt your feelings. If you still can't see how a modern design cartridge with H&H+ performance offered in affordable quality rifles is appealing, I don't think you will ever get it.

If I could afford it, I would own both. In the last few days I have purchased two FN made mausers, both J C Higgins model 50's, one complete, and one with a broken stock and sawed off barrel. I will use the second action for an H&H I think.

Or you can just order a Ruger that will work as well or better, cost less and be on your doorstep within a week or two. But I see the appeal in taking an old junker and working on it until it is a nice rifle. They were very good actions.

 

[Cleftwynd]

You keep saying anything Nyone else says about the H&H moot, when the EXACT same thing they said is applicable to the Ruger.

So availability is moot, less chance is messing up sizing is moot, more reliable extraction is moot, etc, etc....

No better performance from the Ruger, and he said the chat field would have dethroned the H&H because it actually outperforms the H&H, start paying attention to what is stated, and asked, instead of intentionally leaving out the pieces that count.

Give it up Gatehouse, if any of us had interest in the NEW KING, or anything you had to say, .... well, not anymore. You are a horrible salesman.

 

[Cleftwynd]

Or you can just order a Ruger that will work as well or better, cost less and be on your doorstep within a week or two. But I see the appeal in taking an old junker and working on it until it is a nice rifle. They were very good actions.

That statement right there just proved you are talking out of your ass. Anyone with any experience or knowledge at all can inform you what a J. C. Higgins model 50 is, and as most will tell you, the BEST mass produced action ever built. I like and own Rugers as well, but there never has been one that will ever come close to that FN built Mauser action.

Try researching that one for a while.

 

[Gatehouse]

You keep saying anything Nyone else says about the H&H moot, when the EXACT same thing they said is applicable to the Ruger.

So availability is moot, less chance is messing up sizing is moot, more reliable extraction is moot, etc, etc....

Sorry, but it's true. People keep talking about schit that doesn't matter. It doesn't matter that you can screw up your handloads- Just do them properly. It doesn't matter the case shape if they both will feed and extract reliably. It doesn't matter if brass selection is only one manufacturer at this time, since the brass works just fine and is available if you arent' too lazy to pick up a phone. And no, it doesn't matter to most of us if they can't buy ammo in Africa. We are in Canada.

So all that schit just doesn't matter unless you are the type that needs to be spoonfed.

No better performance from the Ruger, and he said the chat field would have dethroned the H&H because it actually outperforms the H&H, start paying attention to what is stated, and asked, instead of intentionally leaving out the pieces that count.

I see why you are having so much trouble understanding things. You don't actually comprehend things well.

Case in point is what you said above, especially about the 375 CT. Cfbmi said that the CT would have dethroned the H&H due to brass availability. You think he said that it outperforms the H&H. The CT has less case capacity than the other two. It won't outperform them,and CFbmi never said that it would.

There is nothing WRONG with the H&H. I have owned and loaded for them. They work well. It's just that the Ruger is slightly better, for all the reasons I've listed over and over for you. You are looking for some magical answer why the Ruger is superior along the lines of "I can shoot bullets 3x as fast with half the powder. " It's just not that complicated.

Give it up Gatehouse, if any of us had interest in the NEW KING, or anything you had to say, .... well, not anymore. You are a horrible salesman.

I'm not in sales, but I do give direct answers to questions. That you are unable to comprehend them isn't really my fault. But I am sorry that your feelings are still hurt.

 

[Gatehouse]

That statement right there just proved you are talking out of your ass. Anyone with any experience or knowledge at all can inform you what a J. C. Higgins model 50 is, and as most will tell you, the BEST mass produced action ever built. I like and own Rugers as well, but there never has been one that will ever come close to that FN built Mauser action.

Try researching that one for a while.

There you go again....not really reading.

You didn't see where I said they were very good? FN made them very well. And you could have them in any cartridge you wanted, as long as you wanted 270 or 30-06.

 

[Cleftwynd]

Haha, first time in my life I actually cared what the ignore feature was for. This guy does nothing but toss insults and refuse to act mature.



Edit: hey that's kinda neat! It hides everything the fool posts! This thread almost makes sense now!

 

[c-fbmi]

C'mon guys play nice, this is a debate and as such is no place for personal deroggatory remarks. Please........we have a lively debate going here let's not ruin it by making personal attacks.

Gatehouse you missed what I said about action weight, not rifle weight in reference to your comments about the H&H requiring a longer and heavier action, similar to your cell phone analagy.

As far as value for money, there are many moderate priced rifles in the H&H chambering which compare favorably to the Ruger price wise and are far from junk, Remington, which is my choice, Winchester, Browning, CZ and many more all around the same price and quality of firearm and every bit as good as a Ruger or better. Not at all an eliteist chambering.

My reference to the C-T and 300-375 was made in the context that IF Ruger had chosen to take on the venerable old H&H with one of these more modern designs, they may have had a better chance due to much more availability of brass that could be used by reloaders to reform to the Ruger and thus opened up endless possibilities, AND achieved the ballistics they were seeking in a mid length action. The point being, if you want to compete against a known icon, don't reinvent the wheel so no one recognizes it, start with something that people know ie the short, straight sided, sharp shouldered, belted case.

And finally world wide availability is a factor whether you wish to admit it or not. Virtually every man who buys a .375 dreams of going to Africa and facing off with lions and buffalo and the like, regardless of how futile this dream is, it is none the less there. So whether or not he actually goes is irrelavent, but things like ammo availability will affect his decision on which chambering to buy. It's not about down to earth reality buying, it's about the dream. And for those of us lucky enough to realize this dream and go to Africa it is a very real concern. Also, by the way ammo for most non obscure doubles is readily available, as the double rifle is still very much at work in Africa. I have seen 450/400s, 450 NEs, 470 NEs, 500 NEs and have not seen but know of at least 2 577 NEs all at work daily with different PHs.

Douglas

 

[captonion]

So other than it is shorter, in your OPINION you think it is superior. Would that be because it has a very slight velocity advantage by using up to 20% more powder?

20% more powder in a casing with only 4% more volume? Hows that?

For me, I'll take the H&H, for personal reasons that matter not here.

Hmmm, I guess it does!

How is the Ruger superior to the H&H offering, other than length?

The Ruger boasts equal, to a bit better performance out of a rifle of lighter weight, with a standard action, and shorter barrel length...Dangerous game performance from an average deer rifle platform...For many people this is indeed superior....

I myself like the lack of a ''belt'' as I have never been big on belted magnums for personal reasons that matter not here...

Gatehouse has been on here forever and has ongoing theads of his love affair with the 375 Ruger, that contains alot of jesting, and good humor...Take it for what it is!
Truth be told, Gatehouse is an outstanding member of CGN, who I find to be a wealth of good usable info....Many members could take note! By putting him on your ignore list, you are the only one missing out!

 

[Boomer]

I like displacement. If the .375 H&H and Ruger cartridges are good, and they are, then the .375 Ultra and .378 Weatherby must be better. Not because they will drive a 260 gr Accubond beyond 3000 fps, but because they will drive a 380 gr bullet at nearly 2400. Driving a bullet of that mass, and at that velocity, puts these .375 cartridges in the same league as a .416. Yet they can be loaded to match the performance and recoil of their smaller brothers, so they do everything the .375 Ruger and H&H will do, while doing a few things they won't. A magnum length 550 action from CZ or a used Brno 602 is similar in price to a Ruger. Where the Ruger shines compared to the CZ/Brno is that it is a slim rifle that will be friendlier to carry over a long day on the trail.

Regardless of the velocity that can be realized with normal weight bullets, if you restrict yourselves to these, neither the Ultra nor the .378 offer any real advantage in performance, except to flatten trajectory slightly. That particular "advantage" probably can't be exploited in the real world where the majority of game is shot at ranges closer to 200 yards than to 400. Thus the real advantage of these cartridges only applies when soft point bullets heavier than 300 grs are selected. If you're not going to choose heavy for caliber expanding bullets, then either the Ruger or the H&H, and I've had the opportunity to use both, are better choices. Performance is a combination of the bullet's mass, its expanded frontal area and its velocity at impact. When a solid is chosen, the shorter the bullet, the blunter the nose, and the straighter the sides, all combine to maximize penetration, and the faster the solid impacts the deeper it will penetrate. This is opposite to most observations with soft points, as rapid the expansion, the result of high velocity impacts, diminishes penetration, thus creates a wider but shallower wound. On very big game, this would be considered a disadvantage.

I like .375s of most flavors . . .

Size comparison between Ruger Alaskan and Brno 602

Low target density bullet performance with the 380 gr Rhino . . .

High target density bullet performance of 270 gr XLC and 300 gr X bullets compared to a 380 Rhino

Early accuracy test with 380s loaded to 2300 and fired with a 2.5X Burris Scout; by the way, that was from prone, and you haven't lived until you've shot a heavy loaded .375 Ultra prone . . .

 

[Johnn Peterson]

Good and VERY informative post Boomer. Thank you for that and the photos.

 

[Gatehouse]

Gatehouse you missed what I said about action weight, not rifle weight in reference to your comments about the H&H requiring a longer and heavier action, similar to your cell phone analagy.

You were basically making a Remington vs Ruger weight comparison.

As far as value for money, there are many moderate priced rifles in the H&H chambering which compare favorably to the Ruger price wise and are far from junk, Remington, which is my choice, Winchester, Browning, CZ and many more all around the same price and quality of firearm and every bit as good as a Ruger or better. Not at all an eliteist chambering.

Until the NEW KING came around, nobody was making rifles like the Alaskan, unless you wanted a custom job. If you wanted a CRF 375 H&H they were generally more expensive than a non H&H rifle of the same brand.

My reference to the C-T and 300-375 was made in the context that IF Ruger had chosen to take on the venerable old H&H with one of these more modern designs, they may have had a better chance due to much more availability of brass that could be used by reloaders to reform to the Ruger and thus opened up endless possibilities, AND achieved the ballistics they were seeking in a mid length action. The point being, if you want to compete against a known icon, don't reinvent the wheel so no one recognizes it, start with something that people know ie the short, straight sided, sharp shouldered, belted case.

I would have been silly to go that route. Shooters finally figured out that adding a belt was unnecessary, and by this time were quite familiar with beltless magnums (WSM/RUM) To offer what was basically a step backwards would have made no sense. As it turned out,they were correct- as demonstrated by the overwhelming success of the NEW KING. Never before has a 375 caliber cartridge been received so well. Ruger sold more 375 Ruger rifles in 2 years than Holland and Holland sold 375 H&H Rugers in the last 100 years!!!

And finally world wide availability is a factor whether you wish to admit it or not. Virtually every man who buys a .375 dreams of going to Africa and facing off with lions and buffalo and the like, regardless of how futile this dream is, it is none the less there. So whether or not he actually goes is irrelavent, but things like ammo availability will affect his decision on which chambering to buy. It's not about down to earth reality buying, it's about the dream. .

I've always agreed that the H&H beats the NEW KING in one aspect- nostalgia.

And for those of us lucky enough to realize this dream and go to Africa it is a very real concern. Also, by the way ammo for most non obscure doubles is readily available, as the double rifle is still very much at work in Africa. I have seen 450/400s, 450 NEs, 470 NEs, 500 NEs and have not seen but know of at least 2 577 NEs all at work daily with different PHs

You reinforced my point when you said NON OBSCURE. Ammo is not readily available for a good percentage of rifles that people may take there. Maybe they are old, maybe they are wildcats, maybe they are a 375 RUM....But its their pet rifle, they want to hunt with it, so they take it along with their carefully crafted handloads, and they take extra effort to ensure that they have ammo. 375 Ruger IS available in Africa, so if losing your ammo is a concern,source some out before you go. Most Africa trips take some time to put together, so you will have time.

When people play the "world wide ammo" card they are also saying that if someone has a slightly obscure or obsolete chambered rifle, he should leave it at home, due to ammo availability. Of course they seem to only say that when the topic of taking a 375 Ruger comes up. They never say "don't take the .585 Nyati, as you won't find ammo for it." They say "cool, have fun."

 

[Gatehouse]

Haha, first time in my life I actually cared what the ignore feature was for. This guy does nothing but toss insults and refuse to act mature.



Edit: hey that's kinda neat! It hides everything the fool posts! This thread almost makes sense now!

 

[c-fbmi]

Gatehouse has been on here forever and has ongoing theads of his love affair with the 375 Ruger, that contains alot of jesting, and good humor...Take it for what it is!
Truth be told, Gatehouse is an outstanding member of CGN, who I find to be a wealth of good usable info....Many members could take note! By putting him on your ignore list, you are the only one missing out!

Captonion is correct here, I enjoy the debate but it is all in good fun. I will continue to advocate for the .375 H&H and I'm sure Gatehouse will continue to tout the wretched Ruger offering. But always with respect and in the correct prespective. Gatehouse most definately is an expert on the Ruger chambering and is a valued member of the CGN community.

 

[Gatehouse]

Boomer, I always figured that Ruger saw your rifle and it inspired them to make the Alaskan.

Once the Alaskan was introduced and sold so well, other manufacturers jumped right in there and started offering their own versions of The Boomer Gun.

The introduction of the NEW KING changed everything about 375 rifles.