Ya ya, you got me. I can't shoot! I'm still waiting for a worthwhile contribution from you Tim. Lots of useless negativity but nothing worthwhile.
So I'm curious... you have a different set of ethics for birds than deer?
How much to lead a running whitetail deer?
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Ya ya, you got me. I can't shoot! I'm still waiting for a worthwhile contribution from you Tim. Lots of useless negativity but nothing worthwhile.
So I'm curious... you have a different set of ethics for birds than deer?
There's usually only a few seconds available to deal with a running deer. IMO this should only be reserved for animals that are relatively close, and if you need to think about it too much you may as well shoulder your rifle and let the deer walk. It's a split second decision and no everyone can make that shot. You need to evaluate potential success, speed, direction, obstacles and safety in the time it takes to shoulder your rifle and click the safety off. It takes a big man to admit he can't make the shot and put the safety back on. Not so big to blaze away wildly into the woods. All the calculation in the world won't help you, it's all experience, ability and knowing your rifle. If it's your first time you're probably better off observing the white flag run away.
Last few deer were all running and what I did was follow through with the rifle and when I was at the tip of its nose I pulled the trigger and kept on with the follow through. The deer were all inside of 75 yards and at a good pace. The last deer was shot at three times between myself and my hunting partner and the deer did not even flinch but dropped dead about 100 yards away with three bullet holes in the vitals. I am not sure this is a formula but this has worked for me
Good luck hunting
Good luck hunting
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Ya ya, you got me. I can't shoot!
So I'm curious... you have a different set of ethics for birds than deer?
Nope, because I can lead and hit both.
However I typically wait for a broadside shot on ducks for a double lung and with deer I wait until they just start slowing down and tipping their antlers as they ease their way into the decoys.
Go troll another thread.
So I'm curious... you have a different set of ethics for birds than deer?
Nope, because I can lead and hit both.
However I typically wait for a broadside shot on ducks for a double lung and with deer I wait until they just start slowing down and tipping their antlers as they ease their way into the decoys.
Go troll another thread.
You're not shooting at that deer as it's slowing down for a landing with a three foot wide shot pattern either.... It's running hellbent for leather for the nearest shot deflecting cover and jumping up and down at the same time.
I believe the follow through is key, I hunted for a few years with my heavy barrel 308 and the forward weight seemed to help out. I killed every running deer I shot at with that gun, usually dead through the lungs, a couple through the neck.
The last 2 bucks my wife and I shot... Friday evening and yesterday at 1pm, both ran. First one was between us and a wide open hay field. He was in a swath of trees and headed out into the field. When we hit the fence, my wife settled in for a shot and I whistled as loud as I could. From a full bouncing run to a dead stop and full broadside turn. Boom, dead on the spot. Under 100 yards but not by much.
Yesterdays deer was up above us and in full flight after realizing what we were. I cradled my rifle and let er rip with another whistle and lo and behold... At 85 yards (rangefinder) , he stopped just like the last one, turned broadside and made it another 10 yards with no lungs
Carry a shrill whistle and try it
As for lead on a bolting animal... The swing and follow through, much like shot gunning. I have taken a moose that thou hit hard at 100 yards ran like johnson towards the timber and at about 250 , my 7mm rem mag dropped him on the run. I was swinging at his speed and just as I caught up to mid shoulder, touched one off, continuing the swing to follow through. I feel that I only made that shot due to having a horseshoe firmly imbedded in my azz. My hunting partners would agree
Yesterdays deer was up above us and in full flight after realizing what we were. I cradled my rifle and let er rip with another whistle and lo and behold... At 85 yards (rangefinder) , he stopped just like the last one, turned broadside and made it another 10 yards with no lungs
Carry a shrill whistle and try it
As for lead on a bolting animal... The swing and follow through, much like shot gunning. I have taken a moose that thou hit hard at 100 yards ran like johnson towards the timber and at about 250 , my 7mm rem mag dropped him on the run. I was swinging at his speed and just as I caught up to mid shoulder, touched one off, continuing the swing to follow through. I feel that I only made that shot due to having a horseshoe firmly imbedded in my azz. My hunting partners would agree
If you have to ask how much to lead an animal, then it's obvious that you don't know how much to lead, and that you are just throwing lead, and hoping to get lucky. I have far more respect for the animals that I hunt, than to do that.
As far as shooting game birds on the wing, I average over 95% at skeet, so I obviously have my leads figured out. If I was averaging 50%, or if I never shot clays in the off season, then comparing shooting running deer with a rifle, to wingshooting gamebirds with a shotgun, might make sense.
i used a shotgun at 110 yrds (rangefinded), doe was running, and i led her 1-2 deer lengths, keeping my bead moving at same rate.
The first slug hit hind quarters, slowing her down to a near stop. Second shot was a slug (1300 fts copper solid, 1oz) was through the neck dropping her.
This was luck, and a blessing, as we took two deer out of that bush for one week of hunting.
gun: remington. sight TRS-25 red dot.
general rule of thumb is to lead it two deer lengths (but hey, this is a GENERAL unwritten rule)
The first slug hit hind quarters, slowing her down to a near stop. Second shot was a slug (1300 fts copper solid, 1oz) was through the neck dropping her.
This was luck, and a blessing, as we took two deer out of that bush for one week of hunting.
gun: remington. sight TRS-25 red dot.
general rule of thumb is to lead it two deer lengths (but hey, this is a GENERAL unwritten rule)
x2 whole heartly agree, well said
Lots of talk in this thread... Likely a lot of tree stand hunters and not a lot of spot and stalk guys... I spot and stalk and sometimes make shots on running deer... Criteria being "is the deer close enough"... "Is the shot open"... I typically don't take the shot over 50 yards (dependant on territory) and I lead the deer as I would a bird and squeeze on front shoulder and get a second ready quick just in case... Lots of holier than thou here but that is what I do... I actually practice this as well by having a buddy roll a tire downhill at the local quarry with a target hung in the middle... Bottom line is practice your shots and take it when you are confident...
Lots of talk in this thread... Likely a lot of tree stand hunters and not a lot of spot and stalk guys... I spot and stalk and sometimes make shots on running deer... Criteria being "is the deer close enough"... "Is the shot open"... I typically don't take the shot over 50 yards (dependant on territory) and I lead the deer as I would a bird and squeeze on front shoulder and get a second ready quick just in case... Lots of holier than thou here but that is what I do... I actually practice this as well by having a buddy roll a tire downhill at the local quarry with a target hung in the middle... Bottom line is practice your shots and take it when you are confident...
I've only ever shot one animal on the run. A caribou just inside of 100yds. It was in the middle of a lake and I had plenty of time for as many follow-up shots as I would have needed. I was successful, but not a shot I normally take.
But there are plenty of guys around that are very good at shooting at running game. I don't think I'm one of them is all.
But there are plenty of guys around that are very good at shooting at running game. I don't think I'm one of them is all.
One thing I learned on cinema ranges is that it is hard to hit a moving target 5 yards away. At 5 yards there is no lead, the bullet gets there in under 1/100 of a second.
The problem is that you brain takes time to react.
Mean reaction time for college-age individuals is about 190 milliseconds to detect a visual stimulus. At 10 mph/15fps, that is 3 foot. So if a deer jumps out 10 yards in front of you, lead doesn't work.
Swing works, but mental arithmetic won't cut it. Mental arithmetic takes me more than 190 milliseconds on a good day.
The problem is that you brain takes time to react.
Mean reaction time for college-age individuals is about 190 milliseconds to detect a visual stimulus. At 10 mph/15fps, that is 3 foot. So if a deer jumps out 10 yards in front of you, lead doesn't work.
Swing works, but mental arithmetic won't cut it. Mental arithmetic takes me more than 190 milliseconds on a good day
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It sounds like you're no better than your hunting group in regards to your ethical standpoint on hunting and making a clean quick 100% shot. If you're fairly new to deer hunting, just remember that even though the old guys in camp are shooting running deer and sometimes hitting them, it doesn't mean you have to start trying it for yourself if you're unsure of your shooting abilities. When you said they
If you're tossing out a few shots all your doing is guessing that you hit it. See blood? Great you hit it... where did you hit it? The vitals? The guts? Blow its udder off? Who knows where you hit it. What happens if you don't see blood after the first few yards? Toss it up as a loss? What if you had actually nicked the deer or shot it in the guts and it runs a few clicks away and dies? What a waste that would have been.
How embarrassed would you feel having 20 people look for a deer that you think you shot? What an absolute waste of their time and yours. If everyone helps look for that deer, that could be 20 hours or more combined hunting time thrown away. How do you feel taking an hour out of your prime hunting time to look for someones deer that they gut shot because they didn't know their limits. I personally wouldn't be too impressed, especially since they can just wait till a better opportunity comes up later in the week.
Get pissed off, I don't care. I'm not the only one here with this view.
If you or your friends haven't finally got the nack of it yet, don't keep trying it every year with poor results.
it only tells me that they're fools, plain and simple. They aren't hunting deer at all, so don't even call it that, they're shooting at deer.
If you're tossing out a few shots all your doing is guessing that you hit it. See blood? Great you hit it... where did you hit it? The vitals? The guts? Blow its udder off? Who knows where you hit it. What happens if you don't see blood after the first few yards? Toss it up as a loss? What if you had actually nicked the deer or shot it in the guts and it runs a few clicks away and dies? What a waste that would have been.
How embarrassed would you feel having 20 people look for a deer that you think you shot? What an absolute waste of their time and yours. If everyone helps look for that deer, that could be 20 hours or more combined hunting time thrown away. How do you feel taking an hour out of your prime hunting time to look for someones deer that they gut shot because they didn't know their limits. I personally wouldn't be too impressed, especially since they can just wait till a better opportunity comes up later in the week.
Get pissed off, I don't care. I'm not the only one here with this view.
If you or your friends haven't finally got the nack of it yet, don't keep trying it every year with poor results.
