Over and under?
- Thread starter TrxR
- Start date
Baikal makes a 12 guage with ported barrels that is quite reasonably priced I believe it is called an IZH-27 sporting, has screw in chokes as well as flourescent sights and shock absorbing butt plate.
I have it in 20 gauge and shoots really nice, I bought mine new years ago and it was like $600 IIRC
I have it in 20 gauge and shoots really nice, I bought mine new years ago and it was like $600 IIRC
Bakil over/unders are good for a basic setup. I purchased one for $700 bucks, has screw-in chokes that I can easily get and I have never had any major technical issues with it (just once there was an issue, where it was found to be user error).
I hit extremely well with this particular shotgun. It has extractors AND ejectors easily switch between the 2 with a simple 1/4 turn of 2 screw with a dime, every time you open the action it puts the safety on (great for beginners), which can be taken off (though not super simple to do that), breaks down easily, and I don't mind if it gets a safe kiss or 2.
I hit extremely well with this particular shotgun. It has extractors AND ejectors easily switch between the 2 with a simple 1/4 turn of 2 screw with a dime, every time you open the action it puts the safety on (great for beginners), which can be taken off (though not super simple to do that), breaks down easily, and I don't mind if it gets a safe kiss or 2.
There is lots of little parts in an O/U, and you get what you pay for. If you want one to last the remainder of your life, they start above 2 grand. If you only want it to last 4 or 5 years, there is lots of choice under a thousand. I shot trap for ten years with a Beretta 686, its never been in for repair. I've had it since 1990
Funny, my "cheap" Bakil has had 3 owners and thousands of rounds down the pipes, no issues and must be coming up on almost 7-8 years old. Sorry for the implication (not directly directed at you), but I find it quite elitist to say that only "good" guns out there start at 2G's... I wonder if that is why there are very few members under the age of 28'ish at the clubs I have been 2. Maybe they have come to check things out and are told that the only "good guns" start at such prices and immediately turns some potential shooters away. I know of one character who told me that my gun was junk and that I should just save up for a perazzi, as that is what he shoots... I then proceeded to beat his score on the next round. There are plenty of good beginner guns out there to be found that will last for a grand or under, just as there are some brands to avoid. (again fiddler not directly directed at you, just something I have noticed from lots of sport clay shooters)
I have an opened mind. Show me your gun in 25 years. I'm not biased towards any brands in particular, I've just seen so many cheap guns never reach the finish line. A cheap gun won't last two years on a weekly trap shoot. I recommend that when you go to a gun store, hold the "inexpensive" one up against a good one and tell me there is no difference. If that doesn't convince you, then shoot them at the range side by side. We all have our opinion, and having been down this road already, I'd say don't waste your good money on a disposable shotgun. There are some very tiny parts in an O/U, they need to be made well to last. Thats my opinion, but its your money not mine.
BTW, Have you considered why your gun has had 3 previous owners? A Beretta only has one live owner.
Beretta687EELL
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- SW Ontario
If you are sure you want to shoot clay targets and you want the best value for your dollar in an O/U ... first, look at "good" used Berettas and Brownings. Older Winchesters and Remingtons have good value, but the B guns, generally are better overall for a number of reasons. Choke tubes are desirable because they will allow you to shoot different clay games. There are lots of 40 year old safe queens available for $800 to $1,000. Make sure you know what you are buying, as a worn used gun will cost $400 to $800 to bring it back into shooting condition.
I would also add my voice to reiterate the fact that inexpensive guns do not stand up over time and heavy use. I've seen them break down on the line, time and time again. A "good" used gun can be sold for what you paid for it, after you shoot it for a few years, when you buy your next clay target gun.
The most important thing is to have a good fitting gun. It should come up level and square to your body and feel comfortable in your hands.
I would also add my voice to reiterate the fact that inexpensive guns do not stand up over time and heavy use. I've seen them break down on the line, time and time again. A "good" used gun can be sold for what you paid for it, after you shoot it for a few years, when you buy your next clay target gun.
The most important thing is to have a good fitting gun. It should come up level and square to your body and feel comfortable in your hands.
Yes, the one died, the other sold it to me when he heard I wanted to try trap.
Never said it was designed to go for a 1/4 century, but it has held up just fine to date, nor do I imply the good guns aren't good they are, just really expensive to get into the game. No offense to you sir.
The best of the cheap is Baikal. Like most Russian products they are crudely built, handle like stumps, trigger pulls are awful, fit and finish aren't great and barrel regulation is often a joke. But like Russian tanks they are generally serviceable, solidly built and not hard to fix when they break. They are miles ahead of the POS Mossberg o/u or most of the other Turkish delights that have washed up on our shores.
I've owned B-guns including Baikal, W's, P's and K's too, some new but most used. If you can identify good from bad, a quality brand used gun can be purchased, shot and then resold for about what you paid for it if you lose interest. I've rarely lost money on a quality used over/under and sometimes even made a profit.
If someone wants to get into clay target shooting the only reason to buy a shotgun is if you don't already have one. Otherwise start with what you have even if it's not perfect and don't rush into anything. Try different guns, ask questions and find out what suits you best. You'll be shotgun shopping soon enough if you get the bug but will have a better idea of what you want and why.
I've owned B-guns including Baikal, W's, P's and K's too, some new but most used. If you can identify good from bad, a quality brand used gun can be purchased, shot and then resold for about what you paid for it if you lose interest. I've rarely lost money on a quality used over/under and sometimes even made a profit.
If someone wants to get into clay target shooting the only reason to buy a shotgun is if you don't already have one. Otherwise start with what you have even if it's not perfect and don't rush into anything. Try different guns, ask questions and find out what suits you best. You'll be shotgun shopping soon enough if you get the bug but will have a better idea of what you want and why.
Everybody's points in this discussion have validity. But the OP is asking about what might be a reasonable gun to give it a try that won't break the bank. Many new shooters don't want to make the big investment in a more expensive gun when they are not sure whether clay shooting is for them.
Better to have a new shooter on the line with a Baikal than to have him/her not take up clay shooting because they didn't want to drop a couple of thousand or more on a gun. If the new shooter starts to get close to 25,000 targets a year they probably won't be shooting a Baikal but will have moved on to something else.
Understood, just giving the OP insight from the other side of the fence. There is a reason. And a used 686 in excellent shape can be had for 1500.
Don't care what he buys (really), just sharing some info.
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Leather_n_Lace
Member
I know it's a lot of money but I bought a 686 and I just love it. I have a Citori XT Trap too but I still think i like the 686 better. If you watch the used ads and take your time you should be able to pick one up for a reasonable price and I think you will thank yourself for it later. I'm really short with a short LOP and had half the stock cut off mine LOL. The only person it will ever be any use for now is someone else that's 5 foot nothin'. I haven't regretted my decision for a minute. JMO. Good luck and I hope you find something that you like.
D.
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R&R Rancher
CGN Regular
- Location
- Manitoba's Interlake
I can understand a new shooter wanting an O/U. I did back when I first started. A good used semi-auto is less expensive and softer recoiling. It should still retain its resale value if the desire to upgrade is there at a later point in time. It's a good platform to learn the sport. If looks are important some of the target grade ones have beautiful wood
This post is pure gold.
I believe it to be factual, based on experience, and perhaps the most intelligible summary of the 'lower quality vs higher quality' shotgun debate.
Brad.
I believe it to be factual, based on experience, and perhaps the most intelligible summary of the 'lower quality vs higher quality' shotgun debate.
Brad.
For someone just getting into shooting clay, that doesn't have a shotgun, I would recommend a good used B gun over a low end new gun. If you end up liking the clay sports, the B gun will last for a long time, and if you don't like it, you can usually sell it, without taking a significant loss. On the other hand, the low end guns often won't stand up to years of high volume shooting, and issues with regulation, or mechanical issues, can prevent a new shooter from truly enjoying the sport. I myself have used Browning Citori models, for over 25 years, and although I have shot several other brands, some costing several times as much, I have had no real issues with the Brownings, and I shoot them at least as well, as any other gun.
