Truth abou Target/Grange's 3-week Ontario CFO LATT processing time.

Punisher-One said:
If you sent me a PM I would gladly send you an email with everything I have observed that I am concerned about. I will even do it from my real email address if you like. If you care and if you are open to changing things. There are things I have seen there that I would never post in a public forum about a range. I support our sport too much to say some things in public.
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Seriously, I should send you a PM? You post lies and threaten me on a public forum and I am the bad guy?

EVERYTIME adn ANYTIME someone has ever brought me a legitimate complaint, I have addressed it. I have invested a ton of money to keep Target open and growing. But I am not going to be held hostage by a small number who want to impose their views and opinions.

My email is everywhere. If someone legitimately wants change, all they had to and have to do is call or contact me.

And yes, if in the end we have to disagree, you are free to take your business elsewhere. But to try to shame me publicly with bull and then take some imaginary highroad is not acceptable.

JR
 
Punisher-One said:
So JR can call us liars and that is ok with CGN admin but you caution us? Come on my friend.
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Obviously, you are not my friend, or you would have called or contacted me with your concern, not post third hand vile and purport as fact.
 
If we're talking about professionalism. The most bizarre situation I've witnessed was an unnamed female employee (mid-20's or early 30's) hand over a black rifle to what appeared to be her male friends to pose for photos. three or four, 20 year olds passing the rifle around posing for action photos. Professionalism of staff could be improved a bit. Another situation was when I needed batteries. I wanted a box of 12. Was told because of no small boxes left I would have to buy them individually. When I voiced concern that is completely ridiculous the small boxes were found!! Professionalism there lacks or did about a year ago when I last stepped foot in the doors.
 
cmsl333 said:
If we're talking about professionalism. The most bizarre situation I've witnessed was an unnamed female employee (mid-20's or early 30's) hand over a black rifle to what appeared to be her male friends to pose for photos. three or four, 20 year olds passing the rifle around posing for action photos. Professionalism of staff could be improved a bit. Another situation was when I needed batteries. I wanted a box of 12. Was told because of no small boxes left I would have to buy them individually. When I voiced concern that is completely ridiculous the small boxes were found!! Professionalism there lacks or did about a year ago when I last stepped foot in the doors.
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Bad on us on both issues... Trying to work through these though. When was this? We made some significant changes about 3 months ago having specific retail guys/girls, which should help out on the level of knowledge and customer service.

Thanks for giving me specific examples. We can use these for training purposes.

We had a similar event happen at the last sale when one of the guys wouldn't sell someone a 10 pack of magazines because they weren't taped together already (rolling eyes here)... Sometimes a little training and common sense can go a long way.

I have cut and pasted these to the GM so we can discuss with the staff.
 
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Thanks J.R. I see. will send a note to the president email for this. it's a little bit confusing between the two organizations in terms of which one handles what. it's ok.
As for the member number 2000, that would be another funny story because this is what I have been getting from EVERYONE in target since my very first PAL class. At least the guys/gals in store are very consistent. Lol...

TSE JR said:
Luckey,

Thanks for the follow-up.


I will look into the start date. Fortunately, once the new laws come into effect, there will be no need for a waiting period as the LTATT becomes part of the P.A.L. This will also help speed things up.

There most definitely is NOT 2000 members. There is less than 1000 members and this fluctuates monthly. Unfortunately, the GRANGE club controls the paperflow, so any issues with that needs to be brought up with them. It has nothing to do with budgets, it has to do with the Grange itself. We have asked to have a Grange representative (B.J.) available at specific scheduled times, but we cannot demand. Those changes have to be made by the Grange executive.
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TSE JR said:
Seriously, I should send you a PM? You post lies and threaten me on a public forum and I am the bad guy?

EVERYTIME adn ANYTIME someone has ever brought me a legitimate complaint, I have addressed it. I have invested a ton of money to keep Target open and growing. But I am not going to be held hostage by a small number who want to impose their views and opinions.

My email is everywhere. If someone legitimately wants change, all they had to and have to do is call or contact me.

And yes, if in the end we have to disagree, you are free to take your business elsewhere. But to try to shame me publicly with bull and then take some imaginary highroad is not acceptable.

JR
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I am going to leave the lying thing for the PM I replied to you. Thank you for the PM I honestly did not expect that and I appreciate that. I will double-state here that I have not lied. Everything I said here is the truth as I have had it told to me by friends of mine, personal friends not FB or internet friends, that have worked or still work at Target.

I did not threaten you. I simply said I will save the page and can post it again later. I do not agree with deleting threads because you feel like it. That is not fair.

I post my opinions here so others can make an informed decision. I believe the value for money spent at Target for a membership to be excessive. Most of this is due to concerns I have expressed to you now in PMs. These concerns are mostly related to the walk-in program and it's administration and how it is enforced and run by staff. If I can not take my guests (guests of a paying member) onto the range for a booth because of walk-ins I shouldn't be paying $600/year. For $600/year I should be able to have a booth for myself and my PAL/LTATT holding guest all to myself. If walk-ins want booth priority they should pay the $600 to join like everyone else. This should be explained explicitly to staff members. Walk-ins should come second to paying members. There is a reason we pay to be members.

I have said positives. The staff, for the most part, is knowledgeable and friendly. There are a few guys there who have gone above and beyond to help me out. I express my thanks and gratitude to them in person but I will do so again on here. There are a few that have been nothing but a pylon that is paid to say "no" and "too many walk ins" to members.
The store is actually very good. Like I said your prices on 5.11 can't be beat and the only place I have found better 5.11 prices are in the US. Your Fenix lights are priced far lower than some competition and even match some US pricing on certain models.

The range upgrades have been talked about for YEARS. I have been a member since 2011 and I have been hearing about "upgraded backstops" and "upgraded ventilation" since that time. I have not seen that happen yet. If and when it does happen I will be happy.
 
CGN Admin said:
The forum will not tolerate accusation made in the public forum.

The poster "sharked", you need to retract calling people liars immediately, or we will hand you an infraction. This is not the first time you post accusation in the public.
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Respectfully, if you call someone a liar, and can prove they are a LIAR, what is the infraction? If people lie, shouldn't members be able to let others know about that person/business character? I am asking the question, in general, not validating anyone's claim that someone is a liar. Again, this is NOT agreeing, or saying anyone is a liar.
 
so... i just got back from my orientation and i had a pleasant experience. my clsc instructors (joel and michael, i believe) were awesome. they answered all our questions and were very professional. i decided to pick up a couple mags for my AR and the sales guy/RO that helped me was very helpful as well. he even showed me how to convert my AR from commercial to milspec. looking foward to becoming a full member.
 
Sunman said:
Respectfully, if you call someone a liar, and can prove they are a LIAR, what is the infraction? If people lie, shouldn't members be able to let others know about that person/business character? I am asking the question, in general, not validating anyone's claim that someone is a liar. Again, this is NOT agreeing, or saying anyone is a liar.
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Sunman, that IS the point.

A couple of members are posting here about things they "heard" or were "told" that are either complete bull####, lies, fabrications or simply half-truths. While the poster may not feel they are lieing, they are perpetuating a lie. Which is what I am complaining about. There is no back up, no proof. Just the word of an anonymous ex-employee.

As anyone who either has teenagers or works with young adults will confirm; many workers now refuse to take responsibility or acknowledge that they may no be (gasp) perfect and when they get called to the mat or fired, it somehow magically has nothing to do with them.

That being said. I think the current team works really well together.

If someone sees an infraction suitable for CFO action, by all means call them. We deal with them weekly and would rather have a matter investigated while we still have full video footage.

Our extensive video also allows us to regularly review complaints and issues. Often this allows things to be rectified quickly amd with little room for interpretation.

I don't like airing dirty laundry publicly as well, but there is ALWAYS a full story behind every person fired. Most people who leave Target do so as adults, but if they didn't, I suggest you ask yourself "why"?

I have never walked away from criticism and when we deserve it, bring it on. We cannot improve if we do not know. Especially when I am 2000 miles away.

Also, yes, the renos have been talked about for a couple of years now. But I had to get Target turning a profit, even a small one before I could justify the investment.

People seem to forget the background and history of me getting involved with Target. I had to remortgage my home to invest into Target to keep it open. I still have not been able to draw even this money out.

If someone thinks they can do better, buy Target from me and have your say on how things work... Please.

Otherwise, send me a note, email or phone call and I will try to address Target Issues. Remember the Grange is seperate and I have little influence.

JR
 
luckey said:
Thanks J.R. I see. will send a note to the president email for this. it's a little bit confusing between the two organizations in terms of which one handles what. it's ok.
As for the member number 2000, that would be another funny story because this is what I have been getting from EVERYONE in target since my very first PAL class. At least the guys/gals in store are very consistent. Lol...
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The number may be in use because we do nor recycle member numbers. But I wish I had 2000 members. If I did, I would only allow walk-ins 2-3 days a week as the facility would be so alive all the time.
 
The business owner has provided explanation to all the concerns and a contact channel to address concerns. If this goes back and forth again anymore in a combative manner, including comments irrelevant to this discussion, we will make sure the forum rule applies. We have infracted someone who dragged another unrelated business into this discussion, that is not even concerning Target Sports.

This means anymore "I heard from someone else" comments, that is not something you have personally witnessed will be removed.

We have been reasonably tolerant already, now pay attention to the "manner" part.

Manner and Etiquette in the Business Member Forums

http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/faq.php?faq=new_faq_item#faq_faq20


business forum is for the business to answer customers' inquiries and advertise their products. It is not the place for other discussions, bickering with other members, general price complaints, advertising products of other businesses and making non-service/product related comments.
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luckey said:
Thanks J.R. I see. will send a note to the president email for this. it's a little bit confusing between the two organizations in terms of which one handles what. it's ok.
As for the member number 2000, that would be another funny story because this is what I have been getting from EVERYONE in target since my very first PAL class. At least the guys/gals in store are very consistent. Lol...
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The staff are probably going on what membership # they are up to. When I joined my membership # is in the 1800s but of course of the 1800 before I joined many have moved on...the shocking thing for me was the member turnout for Annual Meeting, barely 20 members showed up to voice concerns or give suggestions for improvements. At that point I sure was hoping there wasn't 1800 members with that sad turnout...
 
CFO processed the LATT last Friday on the same day and I got it in the email today! So happy! Thanks everyone for making it happened! See you guys on the range. Yeeha!
 
luckey said:
CFO processed the LATT last Friday on the same day and I got it in the email today! So happy! Thanks everyone for making it happened! See you guys on the range. Yeeha!
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congrats! glad everything worked out.

i just did my first probationary shoot today and the excitement of becoming a full member is killing me. lol
 
And one more thing I forgot to mention, (I was too happy to think straight I guess. :) ), given the situation, Grange also extended my membership for one month which is really great and this is the extra mile/service we like!
Like I said, if we really work together as a team and focus on the issues themselves, we can make our club better and better for everyone. If everything going like this, I can't see why people won't like to join.
And as SGuard6 said, we, as member, should also try to participate as much as could, only then we can have positive influence on our club and have it towards where we want it to be. I can see myself being here for the years to come. Cheers!


luckey said:
CFO processed the LATT last Friday on the same day and I got it in the email today! So happy! Thanks everyone for making it happened! See you guys on the range. Yeeha!
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picked up my LTATT tonight. i know it was emailed by the CFO today and it was ready for pick up this evening so there was no delay on the club's part. im a happy camper!
 
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