Steel Core Ammunition on our Range

[Spotagwan]

Wrong. You pull the trigger, you are responsible. No exceptions.

What he said , you should know about your ammo, you should know about your gun, you should know what the range rules are and you should be considerate of them while on the range property...!!! Hands down !! no newb excuses .....

[powerbench]

What he said , you should know about your ammo, you should know about your gun, you should know what the range rules are and you should be considerate of them while on the range property...!!! Hands down !! no newb excuses .....

AND be responsible for the bullet and the end result, they should pay for the repairs.

[Nickhoffmeier]

At Phoenix in Edmonton they always check your ammo with a magnet to ensure that there is no steel core ammo.

[TSE_Sales]

Do you do spot checks to catch these guys? It looks like they tried to shoot it intentionally because the paper targets hang a few feet lower than the dolly.

I'd hate for my range fees to go up again and again for these repairs.

Good morning,

We do, and all ammo is supposed to be inspected by range staff when people check in at the front counter.

Thanks
Colin

[zZ_denis]

Im sorry to be the one to say this, but this thread is full of misinformation. While a shooting range can make up whatever rules they want, (and the members must follow them), the "no steel core" requirement by indoor shooting ranges is complete BS. I think this nonsense spawns from retarded politicians in US that banned mild steel core ammo under the premise that it's "armor piercing". The steel core in surplus ammo is a cost saving measure. Its NOT designed to have better penetration at all. Any high-velocity rifle bullet would've done the exact same damage to that plate. I'd be willing to bet that a hot, lead core .223 or .243 will cause more damage than a steel core 7.62x39. The reason that plate got chewed up is because you didn't spec the requirements properly to the supplier. Either that, or the specs weren't followed. An AR500 target MUST be water jet cut. Most steel places don't have a water jet, and they use a plasma cutter. This ruins the temper of the metal and makes it soft on the edges. As a result, its no better than mild steel near the cut, and any high velocity rifle round will damage it. I have an 8" gong made from 3/8" water jet cut AR500. It has taken hundreds of hits of steel core 7.62x39 and there is absolutely zero damage. The only damage on the gong are tiny craters left by lead core .223 @~3300fps.

The only logical reason that I can think of to disallow mild steel core ammo at the ranges is to prevent people from using actual ARMOR PIERCING ammo. However, considering the availability of true AP ammo, I highly doubt that anyone would ever attempt to use it on an indoor shooting range, even if mild steel core ammo was allowed.

[bsand]

Im sorry to be the one to say this, but this thread is full of misinformation. While a shooting range can make up whatever rules they want, (and the members must follow them), the "no steel core" requirement by indoor shooting ranges is complete BS. I think this nonsense spawns from retarded politicians in US that banned mild steel core ammo under the premise that it's "armor piercing". The steel core in surplus ammo is a cost saving measure. Its NOT designed to have better penetration at all. Any high-velocity rifle bullet would've done the exact same damage to that plate. I'd be willing to bet that a hot, lead core .223 or .243 will cause more damage than a steel core 7.62x39. The reason that plate got chewed up is because you didn't spec the requirements properly to the supplier. Either that, or the specs weren't followed. An AR500 target MUST be water jet cut. Most steel places don't have a water jet, and they use a plasma cutter. This ruins the temper of the metal and makes it soft on the edges. As a result, its no better than mild steel near the cut, and any high velocity rifle round will damage it. I have an 8" gong made from 3/8" water jet cut AR500. It has taken hundreds of hits of steel core 7.62x39 and there is absolutely zero damage. The only damage on the gong are tiny craters left by lead core .223.

The only logical reason that I can think of to disallow mild steel core ammo at the ranges is to prevent people from using actual ARMOR PIERCING ammo. However, considering the availability of true AP ammo, I highly doubt that anyone would ever attempt to use it on an indoor shooting range, even if mild steel core ammo was allowed.

No. It's not allowed due to potential for sparks that may ignite unburnt powder down range and ricochets. They tend to over hype the damage I'll agree with that. But main reason is fire and ricochets.

[VinnyQC]

Im sorry to be the one to say this, but this thread is full of misinformation. While a shooting range can make up whatever rules they want, (and the members must follow them), the "no steel core" requirement by indoor shooting ranges is complete BS. I think this nonsense spawns from retarded politicians in US that banned mild steel core ammo under the premise that it's "armor piercing". The steel core in surplus ammo is a cost saving measure. Its NOT designed to have better penetration at all. Any high-velocity rifle bullet would've done the exact same damage to that plate. I'd be willing to bet that a hot, lead core .223 or .243 will cause more damage than a steel core 7.62x39. The reason that plate got chewed up is because you didn't spec the requirements properly to the supplier. Either that, or the specs weren't followed. An AR500 target MUST be water jet cut. Most steel places don't have a water jet, and they use a plasma cutter. This ruins the temper of the metal and makes it soft on the edges. As a result, its no better than mild steel near the cut, and any high velocity rifle round will damage it. I have an 8" gong made from 3/8" water jet cut AR500. It has taken hundreds of hits of steel core 7.62x39 and there is absolutely zero damage. The only damage on the gong are tiny craters left by lead core .223 @~3300fps.

The only logical reason that I can think of to disallow mild steel core ammo at the ranges is to prevent people from using actual ARMOR PIERCING ammo. However, considering the availability of true AP ammo, I highly doubt that anyone would ever attempt to use it on an indoor shooting range, even if mild steel core ammo was allowed.

The main reason to disallow steel bullets ricochet. To some extent, damaging property kinda sucks, but a steel core bouncing back to your face and taking someone's eye out is a gazilion times worse. The reason most ranges will disallow any kind or shape of steel is practicality: it's super easy to just test if a bullet will stick to a magnet, not so much to test what kind if steel is present, or wheter it's a steel jacket or a steel core.

My range disallows even the surplus 7.62x25 shot from a tokarev because it's magnetic. I don't agree with that, but I do understand that it's much easyer to just test the bullets with a magnet than whatever you'd need to do with every lot of ammo to figure out if it should be allowed or not. Then the endless arguing that would ensue...

[Bugout]

At Phoenix in Edmonton they always check your ammo with a magnet to ensure that there is no steel core ammo.

Bimetallic jacketed lead core ammo will attract a magnet, and will also spark a lot on the steel backstop. Cutting a round open is the only true method, and that only proves that the one round being cut is not steel core. In a bulk case there may be some steel core thrown in.

[RMacD]

http://www.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a567525.pdf

Objective analysis. The bane of the self declared expert. If one cares to research the subject one will find that, like everything else "surplus", ammunition varies in quality and specs. Here is another more subjective comment but rational just the same.
http://www.shootsmart.com/shoot-smart-rule-9-explained/
You may also want to read the Wikipedia entry for the cartridge. Note the 1989 move to harder steel to improve penetration. Accept that the only sensible approach for an indoor range is to ban all steel component ammo rather than trying to figure which will cause damage or be unsafe and which will not.

[RMacD]

http://www.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a567525.pdf

Objective analysis. The bane of the self declared expert. If one cares to research the subject one will find that, like everything else "surplus", ammunition varies in quality and specs. Here is another more subjective comment but rational just the same.
http://www.shootsmart.com/shoot-smart-rule-9-explained/
You may also want to read the Wikipedia entry for the cartridge. Note the 1989 move to harder steel to improve penetration. Accept that the only sensible approach for an indoor range is to ban all steel component ammo rather than trying to figure which will cause damage or be unsafe and which will not.https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/7.62%C3%9739mm