U.n. Firearms marking regulations

[pedja]

Does that mean that even firearms from United States will have UN marks who comes into Canada?

[r_wpg_rif]

So I wrote to my Jim Carr, my MP. First (after a couple of weeks) I got the standard text from his aid. Then I told them that the response was off point and basically made me feel as though he didn't care what I have to say. I know he doesn't because I'm disagreeing with the party line. So a few weeks later I get this:

Good afternoon Mr. Brown,

I apologize for my previous email – It did not respond to the points that you had raised about marking of firearms and changes to their oversight in Canada. Thank you for responding to my email and giving me an opportunity to listen to what you have to say and to provide information that I have related to this issue. I have taken the points that you have raised in this regard forward with Minister Carr, as well as with his colleagues in the Department of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness, which are the lead officials on this portfolio.

I understand the concerns that you have about the control of firearms markings being made by police, rather than elected officials. Our government believes that the most effective method of evaluating the levels of control and safety requirements for firearms is best made by law enforcement – this is not limited to law enforcement only. Decisions that are made by police can be influenced by key stakeholders, such as constituents and leading firearms organizations, who can contact their elected officials with organized opposition to changes that are proposed. This government is committed to working with Canadians to reduce gun violence in Canada, and we believe that this is best achieved with the leadership of enforcement officials, who directly influence this objective and experience it daily.

In regards to the markings of firearms, your concern about their applicability to reducing gun violence does not provide a claim that can be made as opposed to those supported by law enforcement. Law enforcement officials in Canada believe through their role as the key stakeholder in public safety that markings help police to better investigate the criminal use of firearms. Marking will not only help to better identify firearms that are being registered and used in Canada, but are also part of our continuing efforts to get illegal guns off of Canada’s streets.

I understand if you would like to provide some further information in regard to the claims that you have raised about new policy regarding the markings of firearms. I would be happy to answer any questions that you may have or to take your comments forward with the Minister again in the future.

Kindest Regards,

Shawn Singh

Constituency Assistant | Adjoint de circonscription Hon. Jim Carr, MP/député

Winnipeg South Centre | Winnipeg-Centre-Sud

T: (204) 983-1355

F: (204) 984-3979

jim.carr.c1a@parl.gc.ca
Twitter: @jimcarr_wpg
Facebook: /jim.carr.lib


Any ideas on how to answer this one?

[icelink]

If we had a STRONG organization like the NRA this would never happen.......so sick of this $hit

[Bigrounds8mil]

Forgive me if this has been asked already, but its been on my mind more the closer we get to June.

The whole point of this additional marking system is supposed to help with identifying illegal firearms that get smuggled in from the US, correct? If thats the case, then how will run-of-the-mill law enforcement be able to know if your unrestricted rifle has been here since 1975 or if they believe its an illegal firearm smuggled in because it doesn't have the "current" UN mark? Only thing I could think of is bring your receipt with you everywhere you go, and thats only good if you buy it from a retailer. From what I've gathered its rare to find police that are lenient or knowledgable regarding firearms law, eventually they could track it back to the importer im sure but while they do that possible gun seizure, maybe have to go to court, a lot of potential hassle and grey areas involved in this...or maybe I'm just being paranoid?

[Robbs]

Law enforcement officials in Canada believe through their role as the key stakeholder in public safety that markings help police to better investigate the criminal use of firearms. Marking will not only help to better identify firearms that are being registered and used in Canada, but are also part of our continuing efforts to get illegal guns off of Canada’s streets.

Funny how a UN firearms marking scheme designed to combat global arms trafficking, suddenly becomes a tool for police to investigate criminal use of firearms in Canada! Does the government and its MP's even know what they are doing? I don't think so. The dumb leading the dumber. This has got to stop.

[Granddad]

"...then how will run-of-the-mill law enforcement be able to know if your unrestricted rifle has been here since 1975 or if they believe its an illegal firearm smuggled in because it doesn't have the "current" UN mark?..."


Exactly.
That`s the lunacy of this hair-brained scheme. What about the zillions of firearms that are already in the country legally?
Guess what these nebishes will come up with next: All firearms owners will have to have all their existing firearms engraved with the UN marking number at the owners`s expense, in order to be `legitimate`. Firearms not so marked will be deemed as contraband and confiscated. Just wait. They`ll implement it slowly, step by step. Same way you boil a frog.

[Bigrounds8mil]

"...then how will run-of-the-mill law enforcement be able to know if your unrestricted rifle has been here since 1975 or if they believe its an illegal firearm smuggled in because it doesn't have the "current" UN mark?..."


Exactly.
That`s the lunacy of this hair-brained scheme. What about the zillions of firearms that are already in the country legally?
Guess what these nebishes will come up with next: All firearms owners will have to have all their existing firearms engraved with the UN marking number at the owners`s expense, in order to be `legitimate`. Firearms not so marked will be deemed as contraband and confiscated. Just wait. They`ll implement it slowly, step by step. Same way you boil a frog.

I forsee a lot of people that have their PAL's just for "bragging rights" if thats the case. I never bought any guns, and I certainly didn't bury them anywhere...

[VinnyQC]

So I wrote to my Jim Carr, my MP. First (after a couple of weeks) I got the standard text from his aid. Then I told them that the response was off point and basically made me feel as though he didn't care what I have to say. I know he doesn't because I'm disagreeing with the party line. So a few weeks later I get this:

Good afternoon Mr. Brown,

I apologize for my previous email – It did not respond to the points that you had raised about marking of firearms and changes to their oversight in Canada. Thank you for responding to my email and giving me an opportunity to listen to what you have to say and to provide information that I have related to this issue. I have taken the points that you have raised in this regard forward with Minister Carr, as well as with his colleagues in the Department of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness, which are the lead officials on this portfolio.

I understand the concerns that you have about the control of firearms markings being made by police, rather than elected officials. Our government believes that the most effective method of evaluating the levels of control and safety requirements for firearms is best made by law enforcement – this is not limited to law enforcement only. Decisions that are made by police can be influenced by key stakeholders, such as constituents and leading firearms organizations, who can contact their elected officials with organized opposition to changes that are proposed. This government is committed to working with Canadians to reduce gun violence in Canada, and we believe that this is best achieved with the leadership of enforcement officials, who directly influence this objective and experience it daily.

In regards to the markings of firearms, your concern about their applicability to reducing gun violence does not provide a claim that can be made as opposed to those supported by law enforcement. Law enforcement officials in Canada believe through their role as the key stakeholder in public safety that markings help police to better investigate the criminal use of firearms. Marking will not only help to better identify firearms that are being registered and used in Canada, but are also part of our continuing efforts to get illegal guns off of Canada’s streets.

I understand if you would like to provide some further information in regard to the claims that you have raised about new policy regarding the markings of firearms. I would be happy to answer any questions that you may have or to take your comments forward with the Minister again in the future.

Kindest Regards,

Shawn Singh

Constituency Assistant | Adjoint de circonscription Hon. Jim Carr, MP/député

Winnipeg South Centre | Winnipeg-Centre-Sud

T: (204) 983-1355

F: (204) 984-3979

jim.carr.c1a@parl.gc.ca
Twitter: @jimcarr_wpg
Facebook: /jim.carr.lib


Any ideas on how to answer this one?

Wow, that guy could just have responded with a one liner insult and it wouldn't be any different.

The marking is officially to identify illegally smuggled canadian firearms internationnaly (most probably in conflict zones), not to reduce gun violence IN canada. Your mp either is an idiot or he thinks you're one. I'd be insulted.

[VinnyQC]

Forgive me if this has been asked already, but its been on my mind more the closer we get to June.

The whole point of this additional marking system is supposed to help with identifying illegal firearms that get smuggled in from the US, correct? If thats the case, then how will run-of-the-mill law enforcement be able to know if your unrestricted rifle has been here since 1975 or if they believe its an illegal firearm smuggled in because it doesn't have the "current" UN mark? Only thing I could think of is bring your receipt with you everywhere you go, and thats only good if you buy it from a retailer. From what I've gathered its rare to find police that are lenient or knowledgable regarding firearms law, eventually they could track it back to the importer im sure but while they do that possible gun seizure, maybe have to go to court, a lot of potential hassle and grey areas involved in this...or maybe I'm just being paranoid?

No, the whole point is to identify firearms that have been made or imported in canada then found their way into some conflict zone illegally (think some african warlord killing a bunch of civilians).

The basic scenario looks pretty much like this: A few hundred US/Canadian/french/british soldiers under nato or UN mandate get into some remote village in africa where the local warlord is going for a genocide. Let's fast-forward a bit here and skipto the part after we're done burying them, we check their firearms (a few hundred AKs or ARs) and see they're all marked CA17 or US17. Then everyone knows these rifles were made or imported in canada or US in 2017. It's got nothing to do with protecting the streets of toronto or vancouver.

Now, I know the objections:
1-The african warlord will scrub the marking. No he won't. Why would he bother? He does not care one bit if everyone knows where his firearms have been, so why waste time?
2-But you can trace all that with the serial number. True. This marking is totally useless.
3-So wtf does that marking appy to airsoft and 22lr then? Nobody takes that stuff to an armed conflit! True. Going to war with a 22lr is as stupid as it gets. But if the other guy has an airsoft...

It makes no sense in itself for canadian importers to mark the firearms. It's not like Wolverine was ever going to send a few crates of ARs to somalia illegally. We all know that. It's a no-brainer. The only semi-good reason to follow the UN rules is to gain the moral high ground on an international level when we want to force other countries where that stuff actually happen to also mark their firearms. We can't ask China or the Philipines to mark their guns if we don't mark ours.

[P0WERWAGON]

what about the requirement to mark Airsoft AND paintball guns? how does that effect the illegal ARMS trade?