Is the SL8 short rail version legit?
I don't understand what you mean by that. It is called SL8-4, same as the SL8-5 but shorter rail without the sights.
Here is my take. Get the Tavor if you like the value and resale value. The type97 version 3 is probably the best deal out there, I have no idea if new ones will come to the market ever again. From what I have seen, it is more accurate than the X95, just the safety is kind of oddly placed, trigger is similar to the X95 but no after market trigger like for the X95 - but the aftermarket triggers for the X95 are expensive anyways, most people shy away from that.
You want to buy one which takes AR magazines, cheap and they come in all kind of variations, even as 10 rounder short pistol magazines. You really want that, especially with our mag limit in Canada and for bench rest shooting.
That sets the SL8 back since the magazines are proprietary and the short 5 rounders are rare and expensive. It can be modified to take standard G36 magazines or the Pmags can be filed but you still have a long 30 round magazine which makes bench rest shooting very hard. Everything on the SL8 is not interchangeable with other rifles, even if you take the rail off, you can't find nice scope mounting solution. Then it is also front heavy. As much as I like the SL8, you may want to think twice.
The next one is the BCL Siberian and since there were no recent bad reviews, I assume it is reliable. More than the WK180 gen 2 which is a few hundred cheaper but not shy of horror stories when it comes to failures.
So first is the X95 if you don't mind the price, then the T97 gen 3, then the Siberian.
I don't have experience with every semi in the Canadian market, but the ones I have used I have extensive experience with
For reliability and "modern" style function, Tavor checks most of the boxes except for price and if you don't like bullpups. The X95 is for sure an improvement in ergonomics over the first design, but they are both extremely reliable. You can abuse the hell out of a Tavor and it keeps on running.
I have 3 WS-MCR, all around 10K round count and other than replacing a few minor parts here and there (firing pin, firing pin spring, hammer/trigger pins) they have been very reliable, and reasonably accurate, too. Downside is they are a bit clunky and heavy, but that may not be an issue, depending on what you are doing.
I have one Gen 1 WK-180 which I find is a bit lighter and more ergonomic with the thinner barrel and half size handguard, compared to the MCR. It only has about 5000 rounds through it but I've had to replace the hammer and trigger pin, and pin that holds the ejector in has worked it's way free a few times and jams it up. I think the hole in the bolt for the pin is a but oversized, maybe. But that happened early on and it's gone about 3000 rounds without working itself out now.
My friend has a BCL Siberian and if I was going to do it all over again I would probably go that route, as it's a much more refined version of the MCR/WK. More ergonomic, less "clunky" and is pretty accurate, too. He only has 1500 rounds through it though, so time will tell on it's reliability. I think he said that he was going to clean it at this point, too.
I don't have a T97 but another friend (since moved away)had one and it seemed quite reliable. I was actually pretty impressed with it when I shot it. I guess I thought it was going to be a bit junky but it wasn't at all.
At the risk of being labelled a heretic, I actually prefer some of our available semi's over the AR15. I find the Tavor more reliable and compact and I find the various 180 models to have better accuracy and better recoil impulse than most off the shelf AR15's I've owned. They also don't get as dirty and require less maintenance. AR15's with DI get filthy in comparison. The real downside to the 180's we have compared to the AR15 is the lack of mass production like the AR15 so the price of a 180 style is simply higher for what you get.
I would wait and save to spend the 3.6k plus taxes for the CZ Bren 2. Best rifle out there.
Well well, but not at that price point. That would be the VZ58/CZ858.
If you scroll up a little bit, you will see that the Bren2 has horrible accuracy? How can this count for "best rifle out there".
Best hyped rifle maybe.
I had terrible experience with the Bren 2. Bought it with every upgrade possible from HB industries and Haga defence. Put a primary arms plx c 1-8x and went to sight it in. I honest to god thought I didn’t torque the scope mount properly at first the accuracy was that bad. Eventually settled with a 6” 5 shot group with 55g bulk ammo. Took it the next weekend to a 3 gun comp and had a failure early in the day that left it unusable. Sent it back and had a new barrel put on, when I got it back I was still unimpressed but the accuracy did improve to about 3.5” group. Accuracy was trash when hot.
I hope I’m the only one who has this bad of an experience with one, but even still I believe they are heavily over priced. IMO if you had $4k to spend on a Bren 2 I would suggest to buy a Siberian (or possibly a Raven) and spend the rest on quality glass (NOT vortex) and mount.
Colin, what barrel did you have on your Bren 2 during your initial (unacceptable) accuracy testing? And what barrel was it replaced with following your unacceptable results from the first zeroing trip? My point here, is that I don't believe you are operating with a factory CZ Bren 2 Barrel in any of your accuracy testing. My best guess (prove me wrong) is that you are shooting a Bren 2 retro-fitted with a NR Barrel of indeterminate origin. If that is the case, then the poor accuracy cannot be blamed on the CZ Bren 2, as it is no longer that rifle. It is a Bren 2 fitted with an aftermarket barrel that may or may not have been properly mounted, head-spaced, etc. Or it may just be a low-end Barrel blank that they (whoever did the re-barreling) chose for cost-saving reasons. My point is that once you removed the factory CZ Barrel, all expectations for factory-level accuracy became null and void. You are no longer shooting a factory CZ Bren 2 when it has been fitted with an aftermarket barrel, which is the "heart and soul" of the rifle. That fact must be pointed out in any discussion of accuracy, reliability, or overall performance, lest you sow confusion regarding the respective capabilities of the factory rifle versus a rifle retrofitted with a (lesser quality?) aftermarket Barrel.
So, one former owner (ColinD), who doesn't like the perceived value versus pricing, claims the Bren 2 can't group less than 3.5 MOA when cold and opens up when hot. And based on that singular comment, you choose to perpetuate the negativity by stating as "accepted fact" that the Bren 2 has "horrible" accuracy. I call Bull-####e. Your hasty acceptance of "ColinD's" claim, with nothing else to reinforce or validate his opinion, suggests that you have an axe to grind against that particular firearm. if that is the case, why not just tell us your own first-hand findings regarding the CZ Bren 2?
FWIW, my Bren 2 exhibits typical accuracy for a 5.56mm/.223 cal, gas-operated, modern sporting rifle, typically producing 2 MOA 10-round groups at 100m with bulk PMC 62gr XTac ammo and 1.5 MOA 5-round groups with Federal 69gr Gold Medal Match. I have witnessed zero POI-shift nor perceptible expansion of group sizes as my rifle heats up through normal use, including limited "Rapid fire" (albeit with 5-round mags). The CZ Bren 2 Factory barrels are quality tubes - Cold-Hammer Forged (CHF), and properly stress-relieved - such that they are the equal of any other major manufacturer offering CHF Barrels. To suggest that the Bren 2 has "horrible" accuracy is to spread unsubstantiated disinformation, period. That is what you are doing, Fritzhanzel - perpetuating disinformation regarding the Bren 2's accuracy. Needless to say, your bias is showing....
Do we even know if "ColinD's" Bren 2 is sporting a factory CZ barrel? And in what length? To my knowledge, mine is one of a very few "Factory" 14" Barreled Rifles in Canada. The rest are (at best) 11" Factory Carbine Barrels, or aftermarket Non-Restricted length tubes of indeterminate origin. Short carbine barrels are hardly conducive to optimal accuracy results, and aftermarket Barrels are an accuracy crap-shoot at the best of times.
As for the VZ-58, it is a heavily-dated design from the 1950s that is badly in need of ergonomic enhancement. The baseline ergos are crap, from the Selector Lever to the Bolt Catch. The rifle is nowhere near Optics-Ready, with most of the various flimsy optics mounting solutions emanating from China. Sacrifice your Rear Iron Sight in order to mount a Miniature Red Dot Sight (MRDS)? Not a bloody chance! Yes, the VZ58 is light and handy and fires and intermediate cartridge. That's about where the positives end. The "best rifle out there?" Not by a long shot....
As "Johhny12gauge" suggested, take a look at the small arms everyone in Europe is currently rearming themselves with. The short list consists of the HK416 (France and likely Germany) and the CZ Bren 2 (Czech Republic, Hungary, Ukraine, France (GIGN), etc). If you discount the minor-power outliers like the Latvians with their LMT piston-driven AR rifles, the Slovenians with the bizarre FN FS2000, or the Lithuanians with the dated HK G36 and that's what you are left with. The 416 and the Bren 2 are neck and neck for European ground forces rearmament. If the latter truly exhibited "horrible accuracy", I'm sure that we would have heard about it from various credible national trials reports long before now. The Bren 2 "horrible accuracy" theory simply holds no water as it makes no sense whatsoever.