Best 5.56 rifle right now?

fritzhanzel said:
I checked youtube and if you would bother doing the same, you would find out that your "results" are more optimistic than any of those.

Average is around 5/6 inch groups and most tight group is 2 inches.

And obviously you don't know anything about the VZ58 and optics mounting, it comes with the side rail and VZ offered mounts which are even today most sought after,

Then you could mount the extention to the rear as well and so on, but why do I talk to somebody who has no clue?

Your posts are always entertaining, one day you rave about one rifle, 3 weeks later you post "I have to sell due to financial restraints" and now you spend 4 or 5 K on the Bren 2.

Dude, I have patience, not sure how much.
Click to expand...


LOL, I fear that it is you who has no clue about modern military firearms and what sets one apart from another in the eyes of their end-users. Your continued defence of a 1950s design with optic mounts so few and far between that originals are still sought after, is simply laughable. As I stated, the VZ-58 was a fine rifle for its time, but even the Czech Republic has seen fit to replace it with with the Bren 2.

Funny how you tried to double-down and reinforce your negative comments regarding Bren 2 accuracy, especially seeing as how they were based on a single rifle with an after-market barrel. Nice two-step there! My accuracy results are what they are. They are repeatable, and verifiable. I have plenty of credible witnesses who are also CGNers who will attest to what I say. You on the other hand, reference some nebulous internet accounts of poor accuracy as evidence in support of your incorrect supposition. Have you even fired a Bren 2 for accuracy? For all we know, you were watching a video featuring another Bren 2 with an after-market barrel...

FWIW, I bought my Bren 2 when IRG first advertised them back in June of 2022. I have been shooting and otherwise greatly enjoying it ever since. So much for your "theory" about a rapid turn-over of rifles within my collection. It is heartwarming however, that you find my life so utterly fascinating that you would feel compelled to track my personal purchases and sales. Creepy, but heartwarming....

Tell you what, why don't you do you, and I'll try to stay in my lane avoiding you where possible. That way we need not expend energy tit-for-tatting with our various bon mots. Where our interests intersect, we'll just have to try to play nicely. It's not gonna be easy, I certainly grant you that. But for the sake of the children we ought to at least try....
 
Last edited:
I can speak for the accuracy of my factory 11” rifle with flat trigger. 55gr American Eagle or 55gr Campro reloads I can do 2 MOA at 100m benched all day long with a 1-8 Bushnell. I am by no means a good static position rifle shooter. The better placing guys all seem to be using Bren 2 and B&Ts for 3gun in ON right now. I had a 180 gun and it was good for the money but not in the league of an in service rifle. I’ve owned around 30 semi centre fire rifle designs, along with having shot most others for work and play. I still would take the Bren over any. At this point the conversation really should be what we can legally purchase and use so if $3600+tax and restricted is in an option at any point I wouldn’t hesitate to buy over anything else out there currently.

Had I to do it over I’d go the 16” version. Better factory stock, handguard, can take to the US and slightly better performance.
 
Had the opportunity to shoot a Gen 3 T97 for a whole afternoon.

It shouldered nice balanced not bad, the rail sported a nice compact Bushnell, it fed and fired without a hitch. Stripping it down showed a simple tough design that just didn't fail. I seemed just as accurate as my buddy's Tavor as well and maybe had a slight edge using 55 grain bulk ammo.

Safety is in a stupid place but mag changes were not an issue with practice, I keep my finger out of the trigger when not firing so the safety was not an issue to me, but it is in a dumb place as with some bullpups.

While short and handy moving to a bullpup takes some serious practice compared to AR type layouts.

At the end of the day it is an inexpensive rifle that allows you to also buy, mags, and glass, as opposed to just a more expensive rifle purchase. The T97 is a tank and can be dropped and rough handled, it will not let you down and always goes bang!

Can't find any new ones, I may have missed the boat. :(
 
randyhub said:
Had the opportunity to shoot a Gen 3 T97 for a whole afternoon.

It shouldered nice balanced not bad, the rail sported a nice compact Bushnell, it fed and fired without a hitch. Stripping it down showed a simple tough design that just didn't fail. I seemed just as accurate as my buddy's Tavor as well and maybe had a slight edge using 55 grain bulk ammo.

Safety is in a stupid place but mag changes were not an issue with practice, I keep my finger out of the trigger when not firing so the safety was not an issue to me, but it is in a dumb place as with some bullpups.

While short and handy moving to a bullpup takes some serious practice compared to AR type layouts.

At the end of the day it is an inexpensive rifle that allows you to also buy, mags, and glass, as opposed to just a more expensive rifle purchase. The T97 is a tank and can be dropped and rough handled, it will not let you down and always goes bang!

Can't find any new ones, I may have missed the boat. :(
Click to expand...

Consider the Keltec RDB, which is an excellent design, decently executed by our Southern cousins at roughly the same $1500 price-point as the Gen 3 T97. You can have a brand-NIB RDB if you have an aversion to used firearms, thus avoiding the problem with finding a new T97. Do yourself a favour and check out the RDB - you might be pleasantly surprised! I certainly was, and only sold mine because I simply had too many 5.56mm rifles and carbines at the time. Equipped with the Keltec Aluminum MLOK Handguard, the RDB is hard to beat for the money. Just saying.....


20221227-134851.jpg
 
Bartok5 said:
Consider the Keltec RDB, which is an excellent design, decently executed by our Southern cousins at roughly the same $1500 price-point as the Gen 3 T97. You can have a brand-NIB RDB if you have an aversion to used firearms, thus avoiding the problem with finding a new T97. Do yourself a favour and check out the RDB - you might be pleasantly surprised! I certainly was, and only sold mine because I simply had too many 5.56mm rifles and carbines at the time. Equipped with the Keltec Aluminum MLOK Handguard, the RDB is hard to beat for the money. Just

No disrespect to the civilian RDB but it is not the same military build as the T97, compare the springs and overall build. Pretty confident a 15 foot drop test between the 2 would favor the T97 IMHO. Just saying.
Click to expand...
 
CdnLibertarian said:
What's the best 5.56 I can get right now in Canada that isn't the Tavor, B&T or Bren?

I know everyone recommends those 3 but I'm on a budget, at the same time I don't want absolute garbage.
Click to expand...

Nobody of the most recent posters is really interested what you want. Bartok5 does the usual derailing towards what he thinks everybody else should do.
 
Last edited:
randyhub said:
Bartok5 said:
Consider the Keltec RDB, which is an excellent design, decently executed by our Southern cousins at roughly the same $1500 price-point as the Gen 3 T97. You can have a brand-NIB RDB if you have an aversion to used firearms, thus avoiding the problem with finding a new T97. Do yourself a favour and check out the RDB - you might be pleasantly surprised! I certainly was, and only sold mine because I simply had too many 5.56mm rifles and carbines at the time. Equipped with the Keltec Aluminum MLOK Handguard, the RDB is hard to beat for the money. Just

No disrespect to the civilian RDB but it is not the same military build as the T97, compare the springs and overall build. Pretty confident a 15 foot drop test between the 2 would favor the T97 IMHO. Just saying.
Click to expand...

It is a Kel-tec.
Click to expand...
 
SKIP THE KELTEC. WHO wants a rifle without an ejection port accessible for pulling out the brass that won't eject when you need to tune the gas system out of the box.

Type 97 over Kel-Tec.
 
This is true, I was talking to a guy yesterday on GP about this about his 308 semi auto. I was being nice about it saying I could buy new for (barely) less but I was interested in his if he was willing/able to move on price. He said he paid way more new and can't go any lower, I could buy brand new and have it that day for less. Another example, PC9's in Saskatoon were on sale from $875 at Northpro sports and guys are selling same guns without upgrades or optics for $1050+. Wild times!
 
Freezyny said:
This is true, I was talking to a guy yesterday on GP about this about his 308 semi auto. I was being nice about it saying I could buy new for (barely) less but I was interested in his if he was willing/able to move on price. He said he paid way more new and can't go any lower, I could buy brand new and have it that day for less. Another example, PC9's in Saskatoon were on sale from $875 at Northpro sports and guys are selling same guns without upgrades or optics for $1050+. Wild times!
Click to expand...

That's why the only rifle worth buying from a private seller is a SKS. People are trying to sell used for more than new, especially when you have a bit of patience. Deals always come up from dealers.

One reason the used market is so dead.
 
scianna54 said:
That's why the only rifle worth buying from a private seller is a SKS. People are trying to sell used for more than new, especially when you have a bit of patience. Deals always come up from dealers.

One reason the used market is so dead.
Click to expand...

This is my problem, I want a Type 97 real bad but you can't get a new one anywhere and no one knows if it'll ever happen again. All the used ones are overpriced (imo)
 
CdnLibertarian said:
This is my problem, I want a Type 97 real bad but you can't get a new one anywhere and no one knows if it'll ever happen again. All the used ones are overpriced (imo)
Click to expand...

The gen3 will only go up more in price. Why? No supply and it is a really nice rifle. Except the supplied magazine but that's what I have my garbage bin for.
 
Gatehouse said:
At the risk of being labelled a heretic, I actually prefer some of our available semi's over the AR15. I find the Tavor more reliable and compact and I find the various 180 models to have better accuracy and better recoil impulse than most off the shelf AR15's I've owned. They also don't get as dirty and require less maintenance. AR15's with DI get filthy in comparison. The real downside to the 180's we have compared to the AR15 is the lack of mass production like the AR15 so the price of a 180 style is simply higher for what you get.
Click to expand...

I hear ya and agree. Off the rack AR-15's I had issues with, needed warranty work. Additionally off the rack AR's weren't any more accurate than the options out there today.
 
Sorry to keep beating this dead horse, but are you guys mostly good with the Siberian? On the r/canadaguns sub reddit everybody trashes the Siberian and there are horror stories of the gas block breaking right outta the gate.

Should I pull the trigger on it and hope for the best?
 
From the looks of the Siberian, it can’t be shot with the stock folded as the stock covers the ejection port. Is this an accurate statement? I’ve never handled one so I’m not sure. It is what prevented me from purchasing one
 
aldy86 said:
From the looks of the Siberian, it can’t be shot with the stock folded as the stock covers the ejection port. Is this an accurate statement? I’ve never handled one so I’m not sure. It is what prevented me from purchasing one
Click to expand...

Yes, it is blocking the ejection port.
 
I think you have to go with good stories. The Templar is heavy but most range reports I’ve read and guys who’ve used them at matches have good things to say. The Stirling is probably better but a bit pricier. All the other 180 based guns have reports of issues.
 
You asked for options. The RDB is a bullpup option (which the OP appears to favour in the T97) that nobody had mentioned yet, so I mentioned it. Contrary to Fritzhandle's usual pointless and pithy comments, my recommendation was NOT a derail but a viable option that had not yet been explored. My recommendation had nothing whatsoever to do with what I "think' anyone particularly needs. The OP requested options outside of certain specific firearms, so I gave him precisely that. Some here don't like the RDB because it is bullpup and is therefore prone to difficult stoppages on the very rare occasions that a malfunction actually occurs (if the infinite gas adjustment system is properly balanced). I would suggest that this characteristic is endemic to all bullpup designs, to a greater or lesser extent. Want a bullpup because reasons? Fine, but your stoppages will be more difficult to clear than a conventionally laid-out rifle. That is simply a key disadvantage associated with the use of bullpup firearms.

Nobody here is suggesting that anyone carry a Keltec product into life-endangering battle. As one of the small handful on this site who has actually engaged in personal combat against a declared enemy of Canada, I have a pretty good idea of what is and is not suitable for that rather serious purpose. Funny, I don't recall running into you over there Frizdamsel, but I digress. The RDB is a purely civilian modern sporting rifle with some innnovative design features and a remarkably simple operating system. Nobody reading this should feel compelled to buy a Keltec just because it was pointed out as a viable Non-Restricted bullpup option. Why would they? It is simply one option among many, worthy of consideration if one is performing an honest assessment of their individual needs and uses versus capabilities, reliability, accuracy, ergonomics, cost and so forth.

If you aren't willing to consider all available options, you may just be a "gun snob" and not realize it. Some of you need to check your bias at the door, lest you needlessly overlook a cost-effective and functional solution to your particular shooting needs. Just saying....
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom