Tnw m2/m3hb eta

fenceline said:
My statement is about how a gun receiver doesn't need to have ever been assembled or fired full auto, for it to be considered a full auto receiver.

For them to be all reclassified, the law would need to change. I'm sure the liberals have ideas on how to do that.

Currently however, the RCMP do not, and never have, had that ability or power on their own outside of the interpretations of the firearms act, which is politician controlled.

The rcmp are the messenger, the firearms act is the message, politicians are the author.
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Well actually the RCMP firearms lab in the past have never been listed by law as the governing body to determine classification status of firearms for civilian ownership.
 
stencollector said:
From the Canadian Criminal Code:
“prohibited firearm”

« arme à feu prohibée »

“prohibited firearm” means

(a) a handgun that

(i) has a barrel equal to or less than 105 mm in length, or

(ii) is designed or adapted to discharge a 25 or 32 calibre cartridge,

but does not include any such handgun that is prescribed, where the handgun is for use in international sporting competitions governed by the rules of the International Shooting Union,

(b) a firearm that is adapted from a rifle or shotgun, whether by sawing, cutting or any other alteration, and that, as so adapted,

(i) is less than 660 mm in length, or

(ii) is 660 mm or greater in length and has a barrel less than 457 mm in length,

(c) an automatic firearm, whether or not it has been altered to discharge only one projectile with one pressure of the trigger, or

(d) any firearm that is prescribed to be a prohibited firearm;

The TNW was never capable of fully automatic fire. With the RCMP's newer interpretation that the recycled plates make it a C/A, does that automatically infect or change the status of the right sideplate? Also, remember that at present, the RCMP cannot change the classification of the previous guns nor are they supposed to change the entries. The only entry for a prohibited (C/A) TNW is the one Canadian Arsenals gun that someone submitted. That is the maker on the FRT entry. At present, all other TNWs remain non-restricted.

I do agree that their funding and the weight they carry in court make it difficult to beat them. Many have tried, and few have succeeded.
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Except they made guns from demilled full auto guns too which is why the additional entries were made.
 
fenceline said:
My statement is about how a gun receiver doesn't need to have ever been assembled or fired full auto, for it to be considered a full auto receiver.

For them to be all reclassified, the law would need to change. I'm sure the liberals have ideas on how to do that.

Currently however, the RCMP do not, and never have, had that ability or power on their own outside of the interpretations of the firearms act, which is politician controlled.

The rcmp are the messenger, the firearms act is the message, politicians are the author.
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So why don't you have your RPD ? :rolleyes:
 
#1bcshooter said:
So why don't you have your RPD ? :rolleyes:
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Same reason people waited 4 years for the stg44 in 22LR. They take their time. I can list a whole lot of guns that have been in the process longer than my rpd.

The cbsa won't import a gun without the support of the rcmp legal opinion on classification that is the rpd.

The fa classifies guns. The rcmp make opinions in the form of the frt. Unfortunately to challenge that opinion one must disagree, possess then get charged.

Remember the cz958? It was floating around getting shot in the woods with no frt. No one got charged there because they were right. It was NR.
 
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mildcustom2 said:
Well actually the RCMP firearms lab in the past have never been listed by law as the governing body to determine classification status of firearms for civilian ownership.
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They aren't law. But as the lab has said before they are responsible for determining the classification of guns based on how the law is written. The frt was designed to capture those interpretations for ease of reference. The cbsa for example won't import a firearm without referencing this opinion.

And judges make case law through court rulings after hearing evidence. The rcmp lab is considered a court approved expert in the field, and certain members of the lab's examination team are considered experts in firearms classification. Their opinions can be given as evidence, thus influencing case law.

So while not law, they have considerable influence on the courts and politicians.
 
fenceline said:
They aren't law. But as the lab has said before they are responsible for determining the classification of guns based on how the law is written. The frt was designed to capture those interpretations for ease of reference. The cbsa for example won't import a firearm without referencing this opinion.

And judges make case law through court rulings after hearing evidence. The rcmp lab is considered a court approved expert in the field, and certain members of the lab's examination team are considered experts in firearms classification. Their opinions can be given as evidence, thus influencing case law.

So while not law, they have considerable influence on the courts and politicians.
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Again I say nowhere is it written that the RCMP firearms lab is responsible for making the determination of classification for civilian owned firearms. There was no reference in the firearms act or any other legislation. They just automatically assumed the role.

I am confident in a court of law one could easily show that the lab is not an expert by any means. Compare a Colt 22LR AR to a regular AR? Restricted based solely on looks despite internals being completely different. Yet you have the Moderm Hunter which uses 95% off the shelf AR parts yet is non restricted. And it looks exactly like an AR. Or how about comparing the AR look alike shotguns that are restricted based on looks but share almost nothing in common with the AR platform. Maybe look at the G36 or MP5's in 22LR, nothing in common other than exterior looks but Prohib. These are only an example of the many one could use to prove they classify based on a political agenda not based on what's written in the firearms act.

Classifying firearms as converted auto is one that would most likely be very easy to prove in court as being a scam. Reality is what's the difference between a M2HB that's a purpose built semi auto from new parts and a full auto one that's been disassembled and machined so it's exactly the same as a purpose built semi auto? Absolutely nothing !!! So why does it even matter?

Where does it say that a prohibited firearm is one that started life as a full auto and was converted to semi auto? RCMP firearms lab going to rely on assumptions or interpretations of law or are we going to follow what's written word for word.


Definition of a prohibited firearm

According to the Criminal Code, a prohibited firearm is:

a handgun that
has a barrel equal to or less than 105 mm in length, or
is designed or adapted to discharge a 25 or 32 calibre cartridge, but does not include any such handgun that is prescribed, where the handgun is for use in international sporting competitions governed by the rules of the International Shooting Union,
a firearm that is adapted from a rifle or shotgun, whether by sawing, cutting or any other alteration, and that, as so adapted,
is less than 660 mm in length, or
is 660 mm or greater in length and has a barrel less than 457 mm in length,
an automatic firearm, whether or not it has been altered to discharge only one projectile with one pressure of the trigger, or
any firearm that is prescribed to be a prohibited firearm



Experts my @$$.
 
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stencollector said:
I fear we may be poking a giant with this talk. They can do their own figuring out without us helping them.
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The giant was poked the minute the 1919 and M2HB were allowed to be sold to civilians. The end game from that moment was to eventually figure out a way to take them from owners. It takes 2...3.....4 years to get a semi auto approved because they are trying to figure out any reason they can to not let civilians own a firearm. If they can't come up with a good reason then they pass it however they will still revisit it to try and reclassify if they can.

That's the case with any semi auto or restricted firearm with the RCMP. Fact is they don't want anyone to own anything because we are all a threat to them in their eyes. We are the criminals is the message they have been sending to all law abiding firearm owners for a really long time.
 
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