1-6x variable or 3x fixed? What would you choose?

Rhythm & Soul

Rhythm & Soul

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Purchased my first AR and looking for a scope. Wouldn't it be nice to buy two rifles? Then I wouldn't need to pick just one glass...maybe
Intended use? Range only
Local range offers up to 200m distance, so looking to shoot anywhere between 20 and 200 meters.
Once I properly learn how to shoot, do some rifle competition.

My two options are:
- Vortex Strike Eagle 1-6X
- Vortex Spitfire 3X
Any suggestions? let me know if you need more info
 
I would save your money for optics from a better brand. A fixed 3x optic is doable but some find it difficult to use up close. The 1-6 gives you the advantage being that it is a variable but it costs you in added weight. For 200 metres you could get away with a red dot with no problems.
 
I had the spitfire and didn't like the tight eye relief, but other than that it was ok. I have a gen 1 1-4 razor and love it but it was kind of expensive and is heavy. The bushnell 1-4 FFP with the throw lever is a great value, also the strike eagle just came out in a 1-8 so maybe have a look at on of those. There's so many options though, mostly depends on what you like and what you want to spend.
 
Kidd X said:
I would save your money for optics from a better brand. A fixed 3x optic is doable but some find it difficult to use up close. The 1-6 gives you the advantage being that it is a variable but it costs you in added weight. For 200 metres you could get away with a red dot with no problems.
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I thought Vortex was a good brand. Maybe for their high end products? What about Nikon? My knowledge on the scopes...and firearms in general is very poor
Thats good to know that maybe a red dot might do fine for up to 200m


Uisge said:
I had the spitfire and didn't like the tight eye relief, but other than that it was ok. I have a gen 1 1-4 razor and love it but it was kind of expensive and is heavy. The bushnell 1-4 FFP with the throw lever is a great value, also the strike eagle just came out in a 1-8 so maybe have a look at on of those. There's so many options though, mostly depends on what you like and what you want to spend.
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I'll check out the Bushnell.
Yes I saw the new strike eagle 1-8, and also Nikon is releasing a new model too
 
Look at leupold mark6 1-6x20 in 5.56 retical cm-r
I think I'm gonna go with that one on my h&k sl-8
Or the elcan tr 1-3-9
It's a tuff battle for these scopes,trying to find the right scope for what you wanna do... and they are the same price more or less
 
The bushy is pretty nice for the money, friend of mine has one. Decent glass, First focal plane, throw lever, illumination. I doubt it's as durable as the higher end stuff but it's only $400.
 
Rhythm & Soul said:
Purchased my first AR and looking for a scope. Wouldn't it be nice to buy two rifles? Then I wouldn't need to pick just one glass...maybe
Intended use? Range only
Local range offers up to 200m distance, so looking to shoot anywhere between 20 and 200 meters.
Once I properly learn how to shoot, do some rifle competition.

My two options are:
- Vortex Strike Eagle 1-6X
- Vortex Spitfire 3X
Any suggestions? let me know if you need more info
Click to expand...

I personally went for an Elcan Spectre DR 1-4X which is a fixed 1x or fixed 4x. IMO a 6x power is overkill for an AR platform.
 
thanks for all your suggestions
the leoupold mark 6 and the elcan are way out of my budget... but well, I didn't mentioned that on the original post
I'm looking at $700-800 max
 
The Vortex Strike Eagle or Primary Arms 1-6x or 1-8x scopes will serve you better than a fixed 3x. If you are going to compete in 3 Gun or IPSC you will need 1x for speed at close ranges (CQB matches are more linear so a 3X can work). Depending on the match, you will likely have small targets (3" frangibles, steel or IPSC mini targets at 100+ yards). While the glass on the Vortex or Primary Arms scopes are not as clear as higher end scopes, they are very usable at up to 300 yards.

Be picky about which reticle works for you when you are moving and shooting fast. You won't have time to dial-in elevation so you need to be able to shoot at multiple ranges from 10 yards to 200 yards using holdover points on the reticle - and find the right holdover immediately. Too complicated a reticle will slow you down. Too simple and you won't have enough holdovers.

I suspect that the folks saying that a red-dot is fine at 200 yards either only shoot at large steel, or at IPSC classic targets. This doesn't work for me or for anyone in the matches I'm in - it was tried and now no-one uses red-dots anymore. Red dots are great at 50 yards and under - very fast. At longer ranges they are at a disadvantage.
 
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Pr589 said:
I suspect that the folks saying that a red-dot is fine at 200 yards either only shoot at large steel, or at IPSC classic targets. This doesn't work for me or for anyone in the matches I'm in - it was tried and now no-one uses red-dots anymore. Red dots are great at 50 yards and under - very fast. At longer ranges they are at a disadvantage.
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Yeah good luck hitting 4" steel at 200 yards with a red dot. Even at 100 yards it's stretching it.
 
Pr589 said:
I suspect that the folks saying that a red-dot is fine at 200 yards either only shoot at large steel, or at IPSC classic targets. This doesn't work for me or for anyone in the matches I'm in - it was tried and now no-one uses red-dots anymore. Red dots are great at 50 yards and under - very fast. At longer ranges they are at a disadvantage.
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That's interesting. I'm personally only interested in person-sized targets and given that anything that I shoot at is likely to shoot back at me, I don't find a red dot at 200 to be a disadvantage. But for gun games you may want to gussy up your equipment a bit.
 
Rhythm & Soul said:
I thought Vortex was a good brand. Maybe for their high end products? What about Nikon? My knowledge on the scopes...and firearms in general is very poor
Thats good to know that maybe a red dot might do fine for up to 200m




I'll check out the Bushnell.
Yes I saw the new strike eagle 1-8, and also Nikon is releasing a new model too
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Vortex is junk and I know some Vortex lovers will get their feathers all ruffled over that comment. Have a look around on this forum and others, the stories of failed optics under zero abuse or right out of the box are never ending. Vortex doesn't manufacture their optics they simply source them and rebrand them. I don't support low end junk built in sweat shops in countries that abuse their people. I also don't buy gear based on a warranty which is pretty standard with with any quality brand. The top end Vortex stuff seems to get good reviews(for what I'm not sure, and that's from gamers not service members) but it also costs as much as more reputable brands/makes/models that have long track records of outstanding service.

Nikon is ok but suffers the same issues as any other optic in that price range... Made in a sweat shop with substandard craftsmanship and parts. For your budget I would look hard at a Leupold(assembled in the USA with offshore/Asian parts) or hunt for a deal on a Trijicon TR24, there's a couple in the EE right now. Cheap optics only leads to buying more. Either more cheap optics to replace the ones that failed or eventually to higher quality optics. If you buy a good optic the first time you won't waste your time and money searching for another later. Optics can be moved from gun to gun, something to keep in mind..

Pr589 said:
The Vortex Strike Eagle or Primary Arms 1-6x or 1-8x scopes will serve you better than a fixed 3x. If you are going to compete in 3 Gun or IPSC you will need 1x for speed at close ranges (CQB matches are more linear so a 3X can work). Depending on the match, you will likely have small targets (3" frangibles, steel or IPSC mini targets at 100+ yards). While the glass on the Vortex or Primary Arms scopes are not as clear as higher end scopes, they are very usable at up to 300 yards.

Be picky about which reticle works for you when you are moving and shooting fast. You won't have time to dial-in elevation so you need to be able to shoot at multiple ranges from 10 yards to 200 yards using holdover points on the reticle - and find the right holdover immediately. Too complicated a reticle will slow you down. Too simple and you won't have enough holdovers.

I suspect that the folks saying that a red-dot is fine at 200 yards either only shoot at large steel, or at IPSC classic targets. This doesn't work for me or for anyone in the matches I'm in - it was tried and now no-one uses red-dots anymore. Red dots are great at 50 yards and under - very fast. At longer ranges they are at a disadvantage.
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If you zero your AR properly there is no need to holdover for anything inside 200 metres.

I call BS on the 3" targets beyond 100 metres. There are very few rifles that are sub 2 MOA accurate and the bulk ammo the vast majority of competitors use is far from capable of that. Red dot optics work they just don't provide the same benefits that an LPV does. Having shot 12" targets to 400+ yards with red dot optics I can tell you it's doable.

mebiuspower said:
Yeah good luck hitting 4" steel at 200 yards with a red dot. Even at 100 yards it's stretching it.
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Again I call BS on a 2 MOA target. Not saying you haven't had to do it, just saying it's far from realistic and not the norm.

BigUglyMan said:
That's interesting. I'm personally only interested in person-sized targets and given that anything that I shoot at is likely to shoot back at me, I don't find a red dot at 200 to be a disadvantage. But for gun games you may want to gussy up your equipment a bit.
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Agreed. :cheers:
 
Good post by Pr589.
Another option is a RDS with a magnifier (3x) but this will increase the rifle weight and may put you over your budget.

This question depends on what distance and style you do the majority of your shooting at. If all you do is bench shooting then a 1-6 is fine since you can take your time lining up your shot. My issues with most scopes is the eye relief problem but I shoot mostly CQB matches so I just use a RDS.

I have other scoped rifles for precision shooting. My AR is my fun gun!
 
I think some of the serving CGN'rs need to have a broader perspective. Most of us don't shoot on a two-way range. I'd say this is a very special-purpose need in the sport shooting context. The worst that will happen if my scope fails is that I drop out of a match and have wasted gas money and a match fee - not worth and additional $2k for me.

As to BS on 3" targets at 100+ meters, stage designers don't make stages and targets where everyone is guaranteed a maximum score. is it challenging? Yes but matches are designed that way to separate the good from the very good. I don't think you can say BS until you've shot the same matches I have. Your tone says more about you than about your experience.

On not needing holdovers at under 200 yards - I think it depends on the size of the target. Let's say you use a 50/200 yard zero. At 10 yards you will hit about 2-3" high depending on the height of your optic. At 100 you will be about 2" high. Having a dead-hold at any of those distances will cause a miss on that mythical 3" target even if you are "properly" zeroed. If 50/200 isn't a "proper" zero, I'd like to know what is. Seems to me that "proper" depends on your use. 50/200 is what I find most useful for my gun games using an AR and my ammo. If I was using an AR 10 or a 22 LR rifle I think my zero might change. Others seem to think that there is only one right way to zero. Small thinking for small folks.
 
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Pr589 said:
The Vortex Strike Eagle or Primary Arms 1-6x or 1-8x scopes will serve you better than a fixed 3x. If you are going to compete in 3 Gun or IPSC you will need 1x for speed at close ranges (CQB matches are more linear so a 3X can work). Depending on the match, you will likely have small targets (3" frangibles, steel or IPSC mini targets at 100+ yards). While the glass on the Vortex or Primary Arms scopes are not as clear as higher end scopes, they are very usable at up to 300 yards.

Be picky about which reticle works for you when you are moving and shooting fast. You won't have time to dial-in elevation so you need to be able to shoot at multiple ranges from 10 yards to 200 yards using holdover points on the reticle - and find the right holdover immediately. Too complicated a reticle will slow you down. Too simple and you won't have enough holdovers.

I suspect that the folks saying that a red-dot is fine at 200 yards either only shoot at large steel, or at IPSC classic targets. This doesn't work for me or for anyone in the matches I'm in - it was tried and now no-one uses red-dots anymore. Red dots are great at 50 yards and under - very fast. At longer ranges they are at a disadvantage.
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I agree with this guy ^^^^

I have a Vortex 3X magnifier, 1-6x Vortex Strike Eagle & 1-8x Primary Arms and I prefer the two variable optics
 
Black Sheep here :)

Look at the SIGHTRON 1-7x. You get top shelf glass, a clear reticle with an illuminated red dot. Excellent tracking, generous eyebox etc.
In the current crop of AR optics that range from mediocre to outstanding, this optic challenges Swarovski at half the cost. What else do you need to know :)
 
I have in the past owned quite a number of different scopes in the 1-4 range. I found the Millet DMS 1-4 a bit lacking optically, however it was not very expensive and you tend to get what you pay for. I have also owned two Vortex PST 1-4X scopes. The first one I got the illumination control did not work which was a disappointment, however the second one worked fine, however I found the reticle a bit busy. I have also owned the Leupold AR 1-4X scope which I liked because it was very light weight and good optically. At the present time I have two Leupold VX-R 1-4 scopes, one with duplex reticle and the patrol with the special purpose reticle. I like these scopes because they are not two heavy, also the reticles and the automatic turn on and off of the illumination using a motion sensor.
 
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