.223 or .308 for Target Shooting

Guff

Guff

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Hey everyone,

I am looking for recommendations on the purchase of my first precision rifle.

I have narrowed my search down to Savage. Now I am tossing up caliber. What I would really like is the 10FP HS Precision but it only comes in .308. The only drawback I see to .308 is cost per round. Alternatively I can get the 10FP in the Choate stock (Funny looking thing) in .223. The only positive to this is the cost per round for .223.

Checking at the local gun shop I can get inexpensive American Eagle loads for .223 for about $7/20. Alternatively, it's approximately $14/box for similar .308 (they didn't have AE for direct comparison). So it will cost me twice as much or I can shott half as much with .308.

While I want to ensure that I can still afford to shoot the quantity I want to shoot I also don't want to end up with a rifle that I'm not truely happy with (performance, feel, and look).

I am looking to move to reloading but this is an expense that will have to be spread over time (I have a wife and kids to balance! if you know what I mean!) and I have no comparative analysis of cost savings for reloads v. factory - and I realize it's all apples and oranges until I match the load to the rifle, etc. but I've got to start somewhere!


I'd really like to hear your thoughts and experiences.

Thanks
 
223 is definately cheaper...and the only real limitation compared to 308 would be at longer ranges..(although some would beg to differ!;) )
A precision 223 rig is also easier on the shoulder for those extended range sessions, and learning the ins and outs of shooting and reloading is probably a little easier.
I started with 223, and of course have expanded my 'repetoire' to 22-250,
243, 308, 6.5X55 (my current favourite, by the way) as time went by.
Just jump in and get your feet wet...:D
 
It sounds like, given your situation of shooting factory loads, that the .223 would work best for you. It is a great round and will definately tickle your fancy for long range shooting.

Now, I know you have your heart set on Savage and I am like you, I think that the Choate stock is funny looking, have you thought of going with this Savage rifle:

12Varminter.jpg


It is there model 12 low profile. Its available in the .223 your after and comes with a SS Fluted barrel and stock that doesn't make you want to puke.
 
Everything is cheaper with a 223

Everthing is cheaper with a 223 and as for longer ranges, well there other calibers with higher ballistic coefficients than 308.

I am not bashing the 308 ,my precision rig is in this caliber. I thought well that is what the army uses so it has to be the best. Well its not
 
A 223 with a 80g SMK shoots about the same (elevation and wind drift) as a 308 shooting 155 SMK, in fact you can use the same tables for come-ups. The 308 needs a 1:13 twist for the 155g bullet and the 223 needs at least a 1:9 twist for the 80g bullet, maybe a 1:8 would be better. With the 223 you are already max'd out bullet wise and with the 308 (with a 1:12 twist which will still shot the 155's fine thank you) you can step up to the 175 SMK or bigger. Lapua makes really excellent 308 brass. 223 brass is mostly junk IMO.

I know the current and past 3 or 4 time Cdn 5.56 champ (Stan F.) uses RP nickel plated 223 brass. I think he ran out of JLK's so is using SMK now, JBD would know for sure, he once reloaded for Stan but has since trained Stan to roll his own :) JBD was probably the first to use the 556 in LR competition in Canada and Bill Wilde was the guy in the US to first use this cartridge in LR comps. JBD and Bill W. had a few phone calls to each other back then. No one figured the little 556 would make 1000 yds!

The 223 can only take deer out to 300 yds or so were the 308 is good out to 800-850 yds or so. Both these cartridge/bullet combs (223/80g vs 308/155g) suck beyond 800 yds IMO. If you use a scope (FClass) and use the 175 SMK you have just put yourself in F-Open class. Things to think about...
 
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A 1:9 might stablize 80gr SMKs. Mine won't, although it is fine to 75gr. My 1:8 will shoot 80s. For very long range .223 shooting, long barrels tend to be standard.
One of the Savage heavy barrelled 1:9 .223s would be a good rifle to start with; so would one in .308. The .223 certainly has an advantage for ammunition costs. The white box 55gr. ball isn't going to be the best past 300 or so. You'll need at least 68/9gr. bullets. You can get set up for loading for no more than $200. If you are going to do any amount of shooting, it is just about a necessity to handload.
 
What type of range do you have available?

I am quite pleased with my .223 (Tikka, 1:8)

A friend shoots a .308 Tikka (diff. model), no better than I do mine, and his is louder and much more of handful.

They are both good...and I am considering some type of .308, but it hardly seems worth all the huss and fuss to be honest. Maybe later.
 
223 is the answer...

Guff said:
Hey everyone,

I am looking for recommendations on the purchase of my first precision rifle.

I have narrowed my search down to Savage. Now I am tossing up caliber. What I would really like is the 10FP HS Precision but it only comes in .308. The only drawback I see to .308 is cost per round. Alternatively I can get the 10FP in the Choate stock (Funny looking thing) in .223. The only positive to this is the cost per round for .223.

Checking at the local gun shop I can get inexpensive American Eagle loads for .223 for about $7/20. Alternatively, it's approximately $14/box for similar .308 (they didn't have AE for direct comparison). So it will cost me twice as much or I can shott half as much with .308.

While I want to ensure that I can still afford to shoot the quantity I want to shoot I also don't want to end up with a rifle that I'm not truely happy with (performance, feel, and look).

I am looking to move to reloading but this is an expense that will have to be spread over time (I have a wife and kids to balance! if you know what I mean!) and I have no comparative analysis of cost savings for reloads v. factory - and I realize it's all apples and oranges until I match the load to the rifle, etc. but I've got to start somewhere!


I'd really like to hear your thoughts and experiences.

Thanks
Click to expand...
if you want lots of shooting stick with the 223. although i reaload 308 still hard in my pocket. i own a savage 10fp, the stock is not that good. get the one the hs or mcmillan it might cost a bit but its worth it. actually i ordered a medalist stock from bell and carlson;getting it tomorrow. i already got a call from the dealer.
 
Carlos,

Let us know what you think of that medalist stock... I am considering one for my 12 FV (which shoots .223 really well)

I am another supporter of .223 especially if you are starting out. You won't be shooting at super long distances, and it's a great round to shoot lots of and really learn... once you've mastered the .223, and you feel that you want to stretch it out... then consider another rifle...

Savages are great rifles by the way.
 
223 or 308 precision

Bought a Ruger no 1 223 cause falling blocks turn me on big time. 223 does the same thing and cheap to shoot with no kick. Also makes a killer varmint rifle. Got a 4.5-16x4200 and I am in love. Gonna reload soon too. Life is good.
 
I have a Ruger stainless laminated stock varmint/target in .308, I also have a Winchester 70, stainless barrel, Macmillan stock in .223. I like them both and the will both shoot one hole at 100 yards if I'm on my game. My .223 is a 1:9 and it shoots 69 gr match bullets really well but won't stabilize heavier bullets as well. .223 is cheaper, easier shooting and quieter to shoot but I feel I get more wind drift with it than my .308. My advice is start with the .223, being quieter and lighter recoiling you will develop good technique sooner.

My advice about loading is start asap. Buy a Lee Loader and a used scale and you'll be dollars ahead in no time. Varget is a good powder for both 69 gr .223 and 155 to 168 gr .308.

Enjoy! The shooting, loading and camaraderie are all great.
 
I chose 308,after looking at those tiny 223 cases to reload.I gather a 223 needs a faster twist to shoot heavy bullets than the factory barrel.If I get serious, a custom 223 tube and a bolt head can be only a wrench away on my Savage.Less brass ,a 308 is $22 a fifty to reload,same as the 303,less than the 30.06.
 
if cost of ownership and shooting is a big factor (when is it not?), consider a 22LR. A good shooting rifle is dirt cheap. Mount a quality scope. Get some Fed bulk from Wallyland and have at it.

Most 22LR will shoot this ammo 1" at 40yds. Some at 75yds. The key to learning how to shoot a precision rifle is to be a precision shooter and that means trigger time.

For the cost of 3 range sessions with a centerfire (older CIL anschutz are around $100 to 150 at many gunshows), you have your 22 and you can now really learn to dope conditions, gain trigger and breathing control, lots of shooting without breaking the bank.

Ballistics will also mimic your 223/308 at LR. There are a growing number of shooters practising at 100 to 200yds with 22LR. Gives them a similar sensation to shooting 600yds to 1000m.

When you are able to afford centerfire, start reloading right away. you are dropping your shooting cost by at least 1/2 and the ammo will be more accurate.

At that time, why not a Savage in 243? The 6mm bullets are amazingly accurate, cheaper then the 30cal and more then capable of doing well at 1000m. Wind drift is way less then either. Recoil is less then the 308 to.

The 223 is a great cartridge and the better between the 308/223 for cost per bang. Factory ammo is plentiful and surprisingly accurate.

Just depends on where you want to be a few months from now.

Jerry
 
Why do guys purchase "precision rifles" and then look for the absolute cheapest ammo to shoot through them?:rolleyes:

If ammo cost is a factor and you won't be reloading, Mysticplayer gave you some good advice. Buy yourself a top quality production .22LR. That is something you can afford to feed top quality ammo to all day long.

If you're wedded to a centerfire, get the .223 Ammo is half the price of comparable .308 Win and you can get really good deals on surplus .223 for your precision shooting needs.:rolleyes: ...or, go buy yourself a reloading outfit and put together your own real precision loads for about the same price as the cheap stuff!
 
+1 on what the Newfie said! I love my .22lr and have been know to pump 500 rounds through her no problem in a few hours. I reload my .308 winchester, and it serves me fine as a long range target rifle. If you wana blast off rounds get the least expensive on ammo. If long range shooting and a pea shooter are one in the same to you get a .223 and have a blast if its solely your one rifle for the purpose. So you have to gauge your use.
 
+1 on Mysticplayer's post, except I'll tell you to buy a new .22 . Spend as much as you can afford on it and then start-off with mid-priced glass.

Think of it this way, if you buy a good .22 and maintain it properly, it will be still in good condition after 100,000 (yup, one hundred-thousand) rounds, if you were shooting at a really competitive level this is where you'd send it in for a rebuild.

By the time you've fired 100,000 rounds from your .223 you'll have completely shot-out 10 barrels, at least.

Spend $600 or $800 or even $1000 on a really good .22, you'll never be sorry and your kids and grandkids won't be either.
 
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