223 questions, full lenght or neck sizing / COL

Tak

Tak

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Hey Gents,

Just went and tryed my new 223 yesterday, a marlin xlvh. I was shooting Zmax and Superformance factory ammo (53grains and 55grains, still hesitating on wich one I will reload with varget). Shot groups about 2-3 inches at a 100 yds, first day, no vise, factory ammo, cheap rest. All in all not too bad for me. Most of the error is probably from the shooter but still, wanna try to tighten those up a bit. I was just wondering what you guys thought about neck sizing VS full lenght. Do you guys recommand full lenght sizing for the first time and then neck size or go to neck size right away. Also, is there a way to neck size using a FL Die ( I thought it said so in my hornady or nosler manual but couldn't find it again for the sake of my life. )

Any other thing or comment you guys can think of to improve will also be appreciated.

Cheers

JP
 
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"...neck sizing VS full length..." Hi. It depends on what rifle you have. You can't neck size only for any action but a bolt action. All the others require FL resizing every time.
You can neck size only for the rifle the cases were fired from. No neck sizing only for two like chambered rifles. You can use the same brass for two rifles but you must FL resize when changing rifles.
The only thing neck sizing does is make the brass last a bit longer. It has nothing to do with accuracy.
"...which one I will reload..." Two grains difference won't make any difference.
"...no vise..." A vise for what? No vise is required. Just a solid rest, cheap or otherwise. Cheap, like a bag of cat litter or sand, is good. You don't need a high priced rest.
"...to neck size using a FL Die..." Yep. It takes some trial and error fiddling with the die until it neck sizes only.
"...to improve..." Work up the load first. You have to work up the load for your rifle. When shooting test loads, shoot off a solid bench rest for group only. Make sure you keep the loads separated and change targets between strings.
 
Yeah It's a bolt action, I was concerned about neck sizing because the reloading books say you can get better accuracy since the brass doesn't expand again since it is already at your rifle chamber's dimensions, but if it doesn't make any difference not sure if ill do it, althought might be worth it to save the brass. I was shooting on a 1 gallon oil jug with a folded cloth on top of it lol. Next time will try to have some kind of sand bag.
 
The only reason I neck size is so that I don't have to lube the cases, after 2 or 3 reloads the cases often need to be full length sized to chamber easily. If you set the full length sizing die to bump the shoulder back about .002" you will get good accuracy and case life.
 
Neck size all the way for a boltgun. No lube needed, brass is not stretched like it is with FL sizing, concentricity is improved, brass life is longer, less trimming needed. FL dies can produce runout with the expander ball and they stretch the brass requiring trimming after sizing. You will still need an FL die to bump the shoulder back every now and then. The Lee deluxe 3 die set would be a good choice. You get an FL die, dead length seater and collet neck sizer.
 
sunray said:
"...neck sizing VS full length..." Hi. It depends on what rifle you have. You can't neck size only for any action but a bolt action. All the others require FL resizing every time.
Click to expand...

Not true at all. I have always only neck sized for my Ruger No. 1 falling block. I also would imagine any hinge break single shot rifle cartridges would work equally well with only neck sizing.
 
Neck sizing is way easier. All you have to do is clean and dry lube the neck. I don't shoot a lot, but will put 40 rounds through my 223 on a trip to the range. The difference between FL sizing 40 brass or neck sizing is substantial. If it were for my 338 win mag it would make little difference as I don't shoot it nearly enough.

As far as which bullet to use for reloading I would try a 53gr V-max or one of the other boat tail offerings. The improved BC will work well when reaching out past 300 yards. I have found Varget to be accurate, but it does not seem to produce the speed I was looking for. Benchmark has become one of my favorite powders. That being said Varget is a really popular 223 powder.

Cheers. George
 
dastt said:
How would one go about setting that up?
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I blacken a case with soot from a candle and size in my FL sizer that has been screwed out a couple of turns checking to see how much of the neck was sized. I screw the die in and resize till the die just touches the shoulder then check the case in the rifle to see if there is any drag when chambered. If you get a case gauge like the RCBS precision Mic you can do this more accurately but for me this works well enough.
 
Depends on how you're doing it but pressing the primer out alone does not resize the brass. Your sizing die will have a decapping pin that presses the primer out as the die sizes or you can use a decapping die which only has a decapping pin in an overbore die that does not contact the brass.

GMoon said:
When you spit out the used primer.... does that not resize the brass too?
Click to expand...
 
Tak said:
Hey Gents,

Just went and tryed my new 223 yesterday, a marlin xlvh. I was shooting Zmax and Superformance factory ammo (53grains and 55grains, still hesitating on wich one I will reload with varget). Shot groups about 2-3 inches at a 100 yds, first day, no vise, factory ammo, cheap rest. All in all not too bad for me. Most of the error is probably from the shooter but still, wanna try to tighten those up a bit. I was just wondering what you guys thought about neck sizing VS full lenght. Do you guys recommand full lenght sizing for the first time and then neck size or go to neck size right away. Also, is there a way to neck size using a FL Die ( I thought it said so in my hornady or nosler manual but couldn't find it again for the sake of my life. )

Any other thing or comment you guys can think of to improve will also be appreciated.

Cheers

JP
Click to expand...

I'm a huge fan of neck sizing, so much faster. If you use a lee collect die, you don't need to lube at all. Not sure about other neck sizing dies and methods.

Neck or FL, the sizing method is going to be much more accurate then you and/or your loads. So until you've worked up that sweet spot accurate load for your rifle, neither will make a difference. Do whatever is easier, get good, and work up a good load, then MAYBE you'll be able to tell a difference.

Some people will tell you that FL is more accurate, it depends on the dies and how you use them. Some Neck methods, like lee, just work the neck so you can put a fresh bullet it, and if your case get misshapen, it does not fix that. Your case can loose concentricity over time and that can start to compromise accuracy.

Some high end FL dies allow you to dial in a custom headspace, creating a perfect fitting round to your chamber, giving you the effect that you can get from neck sizing while working out and brass warping issues that happen over time. I've never bothered with that myself, but then, my loads are still more accurate then I am. You'd be into posh high end benchrest rifle shooting at that point.
 
Thanks a lot for all the input guys, Ill try that trick with the sooth to use my FL sizing die as a neck sizing one see if it works !
 
223 questions, full lenght or neck sizing

sunray said:
"...neck sizing VS full length..." Hi. It depends on what rifle you have. You can't neck size only for any action but a bolt action. All the others require FL resizing every time.
You can neck size only for the rifle the cases were fired from. No neck sizing only for two like chambered rifles. You can use the same brass for two rifles but you must FL resize when changing rifles.
The only thing neck sizing does is make the brass last a bit longer. It has nothing to do with accuracy.
"...which one I will reload..." Two grains difference won't make any difference.
"...no vise..." A vise for what? No vise is required. Just a solid rest, cheap or otherwise. Cheap, like a bag of cat litter or sand, is good. You don't need a high priced rest.
"...to neck size using a FL Die..." Yep. It takes some trial and error fiddling with the die until it neck sizes only.
"...to improve..." Work up the load first. You have to work up the load for your rifle. When shooting test loads, shoot off a solid bench rest for group only. Make sure you keep the loads separated and change targets between strings.
Click to expand...

There is more "fail" in the above post than is worth responding to. When asking reloading questions please ignore the above member as he is usually wrong.
 
I guess you got enough responses to make up your mind already but ill add my 2 cents anyway since I shoot lots of .223 and I both neck size and FL size

Neck sizing will prolong the life of your brass, but at a cost... after a few firings the rounds get harder to chamber and some times a little sticky when ejecting

FL sizing will make chambering and ejecting smooth but it will work the brass more (reducing life of the brass/ and more trimming) My current batch of Lapua brass has 9 firings, my last batch was Remington and I got case head separation at about 8 firings


what I do is Neck size for 3 to 5 firings then FL resize. When I FL resize i set up my die to only push the shoulder back 1 to 3 thou (takes some practice to figure this out)


I have not noticed a difference with accuracy between neck and fl resizing

good luck with the realoading
 
aheppner said:
Neck sizing will prolong the life of your brass, but at a cost... after a few firings the rounds get harder to chamber and some times a little sticky when ejecting
Click to expand...

Not necessarily, it depends on your load. If you load hot rounds, like max or more, then yeah, this can happen.
Average loadings, you could Neck Size dozens of times and not have any extraction issues.
In some cases, if you are loading light, or reduced loads, you won't even gain headspace. You neck size the case and measure it, and find that it's exactly spec as it was before you fired it.
 
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