.308 AP Testing

zZ_denis

zZ_denis

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Went out and did some AP testing yesterday.

The ammo was:
- 48gn of Winchester 748
- 147gn IMI AP tip
- CCI 200 primier, 2.800" OAL

Target: 0.90" industrial-grade stainless steel. Not sure exactly what type, but its VERY tough. Took me 5 minutes to drill each 0.5" deep hole on the sides for the mounting cables.

Rounds were fired from 150m, out of a 24" barrel. Approx velocity, 2800 fps at the muzzle.

Only fired 2 AP rounds at the plate to start with. Then i fired a bunch of lead-core FMJ's... Bumps you see on the other side of the plate are from 3 FMJ's hitting the exact same place.

Pics:
Front side:
13072009806-1.jpg



Rear:
13072009809-1.jpg


As you can see, both AP rounds went through the plate cleanly. Keep in mind that the plate was hanging, which probably absorbed a lot of the energy.
Regular FMJ leave a small crater. Most craters you see are from 2-3 bullets hitting the same spot.

I will try to document my testing better in the future. A buddy works for a company that installs armor on cars, and promised to give me some armor plates and ballistic glass to shoot. If anybody has some interesting targets they want to test, let me know.
 
zZ_denis said:
Went out and did some AP testing yesterday.


I will try to document my testing better in the future. A buddy works for a company that installs armor on cars, and promised to give me some armor plates and ballistic glass to shoot. If anybody has some interesting targets they want to test, let me know.
Click to expand...

Anybody else thinking politicians?????? :eek: :rockOn:
 
Interesting pictures and results - keep on posting.

You should continue to shoot both AP as well as regular bullets at your samples, so you see the improvement in penetration that the special AP bullet is giving over an ordinary copper and lead bullet of the same weight and speed. Ordinary high power rifle ammo can have pretty amazing penetration. Many "bullet proof" materials are able to stop handgun bullets but don't even begin to stop an ordinary rifle bullet.

With a thicker target (an inch or a bit more), you can "capture" an AP penetrator core - makes an interesting display/conversation piece.
 
rnbra-shooter said:
Interesting pictures and results - keep on posting.

You should continue to shoot both AP as well as regular bullets at your samples, so you see the improvement in penetration that the special AP bullet is giving over an ordinary copper and lead bullet of the same weight and speed. Ordinary high power rifle ammo can have pretty amazing penetration. Many "bullet proof" materials are able to stop handgun bullets but don't even begin to stop an ordinary rifle bullet.

With a thicker target (an inch or a bit more), you can "capture" an AP penetrator core - makes an interesting display/conversation piece.
Click to expand...

The point of this post was to show the difference between a normal and an AP bullet fired from the same rifle, at the same target. I guess you cant see it from the angle of the picture, but the "holes" from the normal bullets are 3-4mm deep at most, while the AP bullets went cleanly through the 23mm plate.
 
Did some more documented testing of 163gr AP tips loaded into .308.
Targets: 3/4" mild steel and 1" cold rolled steel plates. Distance - 40m

Shot #1 - 150gr FMJBT 2849 fps 3/4 plate
Shot #2 - 163gr AP 2737 fps 3/4 plate
Shot #7 - 123gr 7.62x39 ball - 2350 fps

Shot #3 - 163gr AP 2737 fps 1" CR plate
Shot #4 - 163gr AP 2783 fps
Shot #5 - 163gr AP 2777 fps
Shot #6 - 150gr FMJBT 2830 fps

Targets:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v392/zz_denis/ap/280520101161.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v392/zz_denis/ap/280520101164.jpg

Results:
280520101169.jpg

280520101165.jpg


More:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v392/zz_denis/ap/280520101166.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v392/zz_denis/ap/280520101168.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v392/zz_denis/ap/280520101167.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v392/zz_denis/ap/280520101172.jpg

Video
[youtube]YA7jqsib8RU[/youtube]


Conclusions:
Shot #2 penetrated the 3/4 plate easly. Exit hole is nice and round.
.308fmj left a much bigger crater than x39, as expected

Neither of the 4 AP rounds fired at the 1" CR plate penetrated completely. All 4 left a nice bump on the other side. The 2783 fps shot penetrated partially. I have a feeling that it would go completly through had it been going ~50fps faster. Im not going to try it though - thats well beyond safe pressure levels of .308.
If the plate was made of regular steel (not CR), all of the AP rounds would probably defeat it (since a 0.9 plate in the original post was easly penetrated by lighter 147gr bullets).
 
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Found more information on the two types of US Milspec AP ball:

M61 - lead surrounding a hardened steel penetrator. Standard "black tip" you'll probably see. Projectile weight - 150.5 grain, nominal.

M993 - tungsten carbide penetrator inside standard jacket. Tip unpainted, with black ring just ahead of ogive. Projectile weight - 126.6 grain, nominal.

This is directly from TM 43-0001-27, page 11-33 of Change 2.

-M
 
The bullets used are 163gr M2 AP, originally loaded in US Mil .30-06.

Core is hardened steel alloy. After passing through a 3/4" plate, they come out looking like new.
 
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during a pendem at gaetown. we fired 7.62 x 39 fmj at an dummy wearing body armour. at 100m the round went through the hard plate and left a nice dent in the dummy. we then shot 308 match at another vest and had the round go though the vest and the dummy fell over. the dummy's are mounted on a frame suspended by wire. the 7.62 x 39 was fired though the ak 47 in my avatar. its a yugo model the came back from overseas. the 308 was fired through a c3 sniper rifle. we then shot at a cinder block wall at 800 meteres with a timberwolf c-14 in 338. we slowly took the wall down. the hard plates in the vest were cermic with 2 layers of kavalar on both side to help reduce spall. lets just say we dont do this in front of the troops too often as it is hard on moral.
 
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