308 semi
- Thread starter kanada kidd
- Start date
- Location
- Fort St John B.C.
out of the ones you listed i would pick..... NONE
KAC SR-25 ENHANCED RIFLE (E.R.) WITH 20" BARREL
http://oneshottactical.com/collections/firearms/products/fm-30359?variant=569429625
I'm hoping Epoxy7 or NTM will chime in as a couple of our local CGN AR-10 guru's, but from what I've heard them speak of the DPMS Recon G2 for a 16" barrel that shows excellent accuracy (1MOA or better as NTM has stated) and easy CQB handling, some 20" Armalites (have shown execellent accuracy from Epoxy's posts) and I wouldn't forget looking at a LMT either among the three you've already mentioned.
While being far from an expert on this subject I would easily choose the DPMS Recon G2 for around $2,000 as my AR-10 rifle and the FNAR on sale right now for around $1,500 as my go to NR semi. .308 rifle.
As Tenguns has stated the FNAR, these are known as very accurate rifles (1MOA or better) all with the bonus of being NR, saying that they do not have the versatility of platform modification like an AR-10 does.
Let us all know what you're after, or is it just accuracy from a bench or prone position you're looking for? at what distances?
What distances does your range reach too? or will you be traveling to different ranges to compete in distance shooting or CQB?
What optic do you plan to use or what budget do you have? as these answers will assist in choosing the best rifle for your shooting needs...
Of course there's always a total budget to consider, but since you mentioned an HK maybe that's not such an issue?
Cheers D
While being far from an expert on this subject I would easily choose the DPMS Recon G2 for around $2,000 as my AR-10 rifle and the FNAR on sale right now for around $1,500 as my go to NR semi. .308 rifle.
As Tenguns has stated the FNAR, these are known as very accurate rifles (1MOA or better) all with the bonus of being NR, saying that they do not have the versatility of platform modification like an AR-10 does.
Let us all know what you're after, or is it just accuracy from a bench or prone position you're looking for? at what distances?
What distances does your range reach too? or will you be traveling to different ranges to compete in distance shooting or CQB?
What optic do you plan to use or what budget do you have? as these answers will assist in choosing the best rifle for your shooting needs...
Of course there's always a total budget to consider, but since you mentioned an HK maybe that's not such an issue?
Cheers D
Thanks guys!
I was looking to do a lot of shooting in the 600-800 yard range. I'm kind of new to this. Actually my only shooting over 300 yards has been at the NRA and Trijicon matches.
Optics will depend more on who I train with. We have some Leupolds with the Tremor 2's In the store at WW, but I don't think many of the guys use that system. I would think that whatever optic I shoot, it will be easy to switch to others with the data we have now. I can get a good deal from either Nightforce or Trijicon for personal use.
I'm ok with restricted, I mostly shoot at ranges anyway.
I guess everyone makes pretty good guns these days, just wondering if one really stood out.
I was looking to do a lot of shooting in the 600-800 yard range. I'm kind of new to this. Actually my only shooting over 300 yards has been at the NRA and Trijicon matches.
Optics will depend more on who I train with. We have some Leupolds with the Tremor 2's In the store at WW, but I don't think many of the guys use that system. I would think that whatever optic I shoot, it will be easy to switch to others with the data we have now. I can get a good deal from either Nightforce or Trijicon for personal use.
I'm ok with restricted, I mostly shoot at ranges anyway.
I guess everyone makes pretty good guns these days, just wondering if one really stood out.
onetwentyish
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- East Central AB (AKA Northern Texas)
If your okay with restricted, the Kac SR25 hands down is the one to beat. It will leave you in awe I hear.
If it wasn't for the status I definitely would own one.
If it wasn't for the status I definitely would own one.
- Location
- Fort St John B.C.
another question is are you a lefty..... if so very few of the guns mentioned can fit an ambi charging handle except the kac.... and the kac comes fully ambi to include safety, mag and slide release, only thig i upgraded on my sr-25acc was the raptor charging handle,plus dont forget a "good" trigger right out of the box.
upgrade triggers are available just make sure to get the 308 model with heavier spring and usually a solid hammer.....stocl kac is 4.5# but aftermarket can take you down to 2# +/-
upgrade triggers are available just make sure to get the 308 model with heavier spring and usually a solid hammer.....stocl kac is 4.5# but aftermarket can take you down to 2# +/-
Since you run a business, you can probably save a bundle with a HK MR308A3 through the distributor, and they are in stock.
There is a bunch of guns in this category, SR25, LMT MWS, HK MR308A3....etc.
All it boils down to, SR25 is a system used by the US and a handful of others like the Israelis. The HK dominates European nations along with a few places outside like Australia and a bunch of rich Asian countries. The LMT is mainly used by the UK and New Zealand.
You also need to figure out how far you are going to shoot and what ammo you will be using. If you are running a 16", 800 yards ( 730ish m ) is very different from 800m. You are pretty much stuck with shooting 17Xgr ish bullet using a load with enough MV, basically something similar to the M118LR. You need a ammo that is good even after going subsonic if you want to reach 800m shooting a carbine or a short rifle.
If you don't care about looking cool and wanting a compact system, and want to have more leeway with the MV of your load, a 20" is better, or even a 24".
There is a bunch of guns in this category, SR25, LMT MWS, HK MR308A3....etc.
All it boils down to, SR25 is a system used by the US and a handful of others like the Israelis. The HK dominates European nations along with a few places outside like Australia and a bunch of rich Asian countries. The LMT is mainly used by the UK and New Zealand.
You also need to figure out how far you are going to shoot and what ammo you will be using. If you are running a 16", 800 yards ( 730ish m ) is very different from 800m. You are pretty much stuck with shooting 17Xgr ish bullet using a load with enough MV, basically something similar to the M118LR. You need a ammo that is good even after going subsonic if you want to reach 800m shooting a carbine or a short rifle.
If you don't care about looking cool and wanting a compact system, and want to have more leeway with the MV of your load, a 20" is better, or even a 24".
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Of the ones you chose. The Armalite will likely give you the best accuracy. The other two are piston system designs. Very good rifles but ultimate accuracy potential is better from a DI rifle if all other parts are equal.
There is however one thing. My Armalite rifles all have the Walther Lothar 1:11.25 twist SS ceramic coated triple lapped barrels. They don't have the 1:10 twist commercial or target barrels that usually come with their various models. The 1:10 twist will shoot very well but you will have to go outside of the usual Federal gold 168-175 rounds that the military twisted barrels seem to love. The SASS version does come with the Walther lothar or current equivalent but it's in 1:10 twist. Mine has that barre in 1:11.25.
I have a buddy who is a die hard HK fan. He has the MR308 and swears by it. He can shoot. I've seen his groups with his Hk and they are decent. That being said his groups from his Armalite AR10T DND rifle smoked the HK. I personally don't really like the HK that much. I want to like it because it's HK. I like the looks of the newest handguard as well, although it puts the bipod much further back than I would want for an accuracy rifle. But ultimately for me it wasn't the end all be all as many think it is. Some really drink the HK cool aid. So for them the rifle is everything they ever wanted. For me, I hated the pistol grip, I found the forend sort of awkward and it balanced very poorly. My AR10 DND rifles are also front heavy and big but they really don't feel as awkward as the HK did. Also even the LMT MWS which is heavy due to the monlithic upper and quick barrel change feature didn't feel as bulky/awkward to me as the HK. Maybe with the newest coolest looking handguard some of that is mitigated. That being said I was a bit underwhelmed with the one I handled. That same buddy also has the 223 version. I liked that one better than the 308 version. If you really want HK and can get a smoking deal on one then it is a consideration. But I would look one over in person first.
The newest A version of the Armalite rifles take pmags as well so the mag concern isn't an issue anymore. The main considerations with these rifles for the best accuracy is DI (so you don't get any harmonics etc from a piston system), the barrel and the trigger.
Les Bauer also makes an accuracy AR308 rifle that should be considered. Along with Larue OBR rifles, KAC/LMT, etc etc.
Price/use are important. A guy with a $1500 DPMS Gen1 could very well out shoot or shoot with someone sporting a $6100 KAC SR25. Accuracy with combat DM type rifles is exceptional these days. That being said, an AR308 with a full match bull barrel and trigger could very well shoot better. It's sort of like comparing a tactical precision rifle to an F class rig.
There is no definitive answer to this question. Everything involves compromises. Price, performance, function, features.
I do like everything about the KAC SR25, except the price. I currently have a KAC SR25 ECR 20" that I look forward to shooting in the spring. Upon first inspection though, my LMT MWS with 20" SS barrel is about 90 percent KAC SR25 for what was at the time half the price but is now about 2/3rd the price.
If you're looking at a carbine ie 16" then the DPMS GII Recon is the current one I would go with.
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Will be interesting to see what your results are. If shooting off the shelf 308 match ammo, my best results have been from Federal Gold, 168, 175 (Federal Fusion 165 etc can be used for cheaper sight in), Hornady various rounds including 155 Steel case match, and 167 Lapua match ammo. The rest such as Remington etc have shot fairly mediocre with 1 moa or just below being a good result. If you're chasing that .5 moa 5 round group then the choices above from off the shelf ammo are where I would start. Also reloading based off Federal gold ammo is very easy in both 168 and 175 smk.
Let us know what the results are and which rifle you pick.
Thanks Epoxy7! I ordered 3 of the Sigs for the store and wanted to check them out too but with no positive feedback here, maybe they are not what I want. I like what you're saying about he Armalite, I was looking at the TAC 20. It would make sense to get something that uses standard mags too.
The g2 recon for carbine/dmr use.
The LMT mws for prone shooting or bench shooting ( with the ss 5r barrel )
The kac sr for all around use, the mws is more accurate, the g2 has better ergonomics. The kac is extremely high quality, but is falling behind with other 308 ar's becoming smaller, lighter, and better balanced.
I'd wait and see how the new dd 308 turns out myself.
The LMT mws for prone shooting or bench shooting ( with the ss 5r barrel )
The kac sr for all around use, the mws is more accurate, the g2 has better ergonomics. The kac is extremely high quality, but is falling behind with other 308 ar's becoming smaller, lighter, and better balanced.
I'd wait and see how the new dd 308 turns out myself.
One of the guys posted some stuff on the DD on another forum I post on. It appears to be based off first gen DPMS bolt. Also seems designed to compete with LMT/KAC at a lesser price point. So basically for a carbine the GII is still the way to go. I was hoping it was based off the GII.
Also the SIG 716 CANSOF had G2 on the side so I hoped but close inspection of the photos revealed it wasn't based off the DPMS/Remington design.
I can't figure why more people aren't getting on board with the g2 style design.
I have been praying someone at knight's has been paying attention to how good the g2 actually is, and made the move to smaller, lighter, better balanced 308 ar's with their trademark quality.
