338 Federal Vs 358 Winchester

John Y Cannuck

John Y Cannuck

RichPoorMan<br>Super Moderator
Moderating Team
Rating - 100%
15   0   0
Location
The Conservative part of Ontario
Pick up a copy of 'Handloader' The results of the comparison my surprise you.
Eg 200 grain Hornady roundnose

338 Federal 2709 fps
358 Winchester 2753fps

Author is John Barsness, claims the 358 is underloaded as a factory load.

Interesting read.
 
With the same weight bullets the .358 should be faster, all things considered. The .358 bullet will be shorter, so it takes up less space in the case and the surface area against the burning powder is also greater, which helps.

The .358 is very undervalued. Too bad, because it is a great little cartridge.
 
I'm quite fond of the 338 Federal. It's a very versatile cartridge. It looks like you'd be able to push a 160 grain Barnes TTSX @ 2950 fps, which makes it a solid 350 yard cartridge, and you can load up to a 250 grain bullet for 2300 fps for a close cover thumper load.

Sure, the 358 does almost as well, but IMO it has nothing on the 338F.
 
I'm still lost on the facination with the .338 Federal....tell me again how it's better than the .30-06? Ya I know it shoots a bigger bullet but just don't see the fascination..well other than it's new and new is good I guess. If you want a short action, the .300WSM would seem a more logical choice but hey, what's logical about buying guns. Just tell me cause it's new and I'll go away.
 
sheephunter said:
I'm still lost on the facination with the .338 Federal....tell me again how it's better than the .30-06? Ya I know it shoots a bigger bullet but just don't see the fascination..well other than it's new and new is good I guess. If you want a short action, the .300WSM would seem a more logical choice but hey, what's logical about buying guns. Just tell me cause it's new and I'll go away.
Click to expand...

I never said it was better than the 30-06, but it will do anything the 30-06 will, unless you like shooting bullets lighter than 150 grain in the 30-06 (most shooters do not). The 338F will match the 30-06 with similar bullet weights, and do so with more bullet diameter and a larger wound channel (all things being equal). Sure, sectional density suffers but with todays premium big game bullets, SD doesn't mean as much as it once did (read the 130 TTSX thread again). The 300 WSM is faster, therefore is must be better. :D 338F gives 30-06+ performance, 30-06 recoil, in a 308 weight rifle. Perfect, along with the 30-06, for 90% of a hunter's needs.

1899 said:
And what exactly does the .338F have on the .358?:confused:
Click to expand...

The 338F gives a bit more reach, more current rifle options, and with excellent factory ammo selection. Compare this to the 358 and it becomes very obvious why it's a better choice. :wave:
 
todbartell said:
I'm quite fond of the 338 Federal. It's a very versatile cartridge.
Click to expand...
If people want VERSATILE, they buy a 30/06 or 308. Bullets from 110 to 220gr and tonnes of factory ammo everywhere.

I think most folks would buy a 338Fed or 358Win with heavier bullets in mind.


.
 
todbartell said:
I never said it was better than the 30-06, but it will do anything the 30-06 will, unless you like shooting bullets lighter than 150 grain in the 30-06 (most shooters do not). The 338F will match the 30-06 with similar bullet weights, and do so with more bullet diameter and a larger wound channel (all things being equal). Sure, sectional density suffers but with todays premium big game bullets, SD doesn't mean as much as it once did (read the 130 TTSX thread again). The 300 WSM is faster, therefore is must be better. :D 338F gives 30-06+ performance, 30-06 recoil, in a 308 weight rifle. Perfect, along with the 30-06, for 90% of a hunter's needs.



The 338F gives a bit more reach, more current rifle options, and with excellent factory ammo selection. Compare this to the 358 and it becomes very obvious why it's a better choice. :wave:
Click to expand...



Tod, ya just shoulda said it was new...that's a great reason to buy a cartridge but truthfully, not much other reason I can see with the .338 Fed. It landed smack in the middle of a bunch of cartridges that already do the job damn fine. I suspect it will have a short life span as a factory load.
 
I am able to get 2800 fps with 185 triple shocks in my 338 federal and that is plenty of speed and hitting power for anything I want to slay. Why did I choose 338-08? just cuz. It isn't better or worse than anything, it's just different. The worst possible consequence is I sell it and buy something else different to try.
 
The 338F will match the 30-06 with similar bullet weights, and do so with more bullet diameter and a larger wound channel (all things being equal). Sure, sectional density suffers but with todays premium big game bullets, SD doesn't mean as much as it once did
Click to expand...

Sectional density really does matter much to me in this world of high performance bullets but what does matter is ballistic coefficient and shorter and fatter does not make for better BC. That's why I've always questioned larger caliber catridges that at best offer the same performance as smaller calibre cartridges. It just doesn't make sense. It's new. I was curious. I wanted to give it a try.......are all valid reasons to own one but to try and expound the performance issues is a dead horse. There are none!
 
sheephunter said:
Sectional density really does matter much to me in this world of high performance bullets but what does matter is ballistic coefficient and shorter and fatter does not make for better BC. That's why I've always questioned larger caliber catridges that at best offer the same performance as smaller calibre cartridges. It just doesn't make sense. It's new. I was curious. I wanted to give it a try.......are all valid reasons to own one but to try and expound the performance issues is a dead horse. There are none!
Click to expand...

Your comments about SC vs BC are valid, but short fat does have a more dramatic effect on the target sometimes, the same way a .308 bullet whacks and stacks critters more dramatically then a .277 bullet. Bigger frontal area is an effective killer of most game provided penetration is acceptable.
 
martinbns said:
Your comments about SC vs BC are valid, but short fat does have a more dramatic effect on the target sometimes, the same way a .308 bullet whacks and stacks critters more dramatically then a .277 bullet. Bigger frontal area is an effective killer of most game provided penetration is acceptable.
Click to expand...

I agree to a point martin but again it comes down more to bullet selection than actual frontal are when comparing bullets that aren't too far apart in diameter. As some bullets will expand far more than others, the frontal area of a smaller calibre bullet can actually eclipse that of a larger caliber bullet just as a quality bullet can overcome the accepted thoughts on SD.

I disagree that frontal area plays a significant role in killing too. I'd say there are a dozen factors that enter the equation before frontal area ever comes into play. Remember, we are talking the same weight and speed bullet here so energy should be very similar. I fail to see how a 150 grain 30 cal would kill any better than a 150 grain 7mm delivered at the same speed.

A lot of theories like SD and frontal area can be traced back to the days of non-jacketed bullets and really don't apply much today.

This elk agrees......
TJBull07.jpg
 
Last edited:
sheephunter said:
Tod, ya just shoulda said it was new...that's a great reason to buy a cartridge but truthfully, not much other reason I can see with the .338 Fed. It landed smack in the middle of a bunch of cartridges that already do the job damn fine. I suspect it will have a short life span as a factory load.
Click to expand...

smack dab amongst cartridges such as the...358 Win? The average hunter buys off the shelf ammo. If, and that is a big if, you can find some Winchester 200 gr Super-X silvertips for the 358, it offers meager ballistics, especially past 200 yards. 2500 fps with a 200 gr plain jane soft point, with a BC of .300? :runaway: that's pretty pathetic. I realize it's not a true indiactor of the cartridge's potential, but it IS the only factory load.

8 inches in POI @ 300 yards when the 358 is compared to the 338F with a 210 gr Nosler Partition. 1600 fps impact with the 358 vs 2000 fps for the 338F.

THe 338F offers true 358 performance for non handloaders. Four excellent options for the hunter to choose from. This is a missing niche in the current selection of rifles/ammo available today. Also rifles made by Ruger, Sako, Tikka, Kimber...


It's not as fast as a 325WSM or 338 Win Mag, but it's not supposed to be either. You'd think a gunwriter would be able to see these obvious merits. :confused:


:wave:
 
todbartell said:
smack dab amongst cartridges such as the...358 Win? The average hunter buys off the shelf ammo. If, and that is a big if, you can find some Winchester 200 gr Super-X silvertips for the 358, it offers meager ballistics, especially past 200 yards. 2500 fps with a 200 gr plain jane soft point, with a BC of .300? :runaway: that's pretty pathetic. I realize it's not a true indiactor of the cartridge's potential, but it IS the only factory load.

8 inches in POI @ 300 yards when the 358 is compared to the 338F with a 210 gr Nosler Partition. 1600 fps impact with the 358 vs 2000 fps for the 338F.

THe 338F offers true 358 performance for non handloaders. This is a missing niche in the current selection of rifles/ammo available today.


It's not as fast as a 325WSM or 338 Win Mag, but it's not supposed to be either. You'd think a gunwriter would be able to see these obvious merits. :confused:


:wave:
Click to expand...


No, smack dab in the middle of the .30-06, .300WM, .300 WSM, .338......need I go on?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom