45/70 loads for Black Bear and bigger

Snuffy

Snuffy

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Sup

First what is the best way to search this forum for loads? Seems to be tough to find something that works when looking for say 30.06

Anyways

Looking for some good well field tested loads for Black Bear and bigger

I want a Black Bear to fold like a gopher but still be alittle easy on the shoulder.

If possible I would like the load to be suitable for mosse also :)
 
I would suggest either a 350 Horn or 500gn hard cast bullet.
As for powders there's lots of loading manuals, but it's hard to beat 4198.

I was going to add I've had real good luck acuracy wise with 405gn Rems, never shot anything but deer with them thou!
 
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350 grain Hornady FNSP over 47 grains of RL-7, standard W/W primer, all tucked inside a W/W case. All bang flops. I have used this load exclusively for almost 10 years now. I have also loaded 420 and 550 cast, as well as the Remington 405's, but I keep coming back to the 350 grainers for all around use.

I also bought a bunch of the Kodiak bonded core 350 grainers and use the same load, for moose. These are one tough bullet.

Fire these two out of my guide gun, no worries. You can jump the load hotter by a couple of grains but I see no reason to do so, dead is dead especially black bear.

Never had one complain yet!

Ricky
 
Actually the most important thing when loading .45-70 is to chronograph the loads. Don't accept any load as 'the load' for your rifle without actually working up to it, and chrony the loads to verify what kind of velocity you're getting.

You also didn't mention what rifle you have. I would assume a Marlin M1895?

In a Marlin M1895 specifically, with those 350gr Hornadys (great bullet) you should be able to load to somewhere around 1900-2000fps MV. The 400gr bullets you should probably stay around 1700fps tops, but it really depends upon the bullet (construction). Like I would load the 405gr Remingtons to that velocity, but not the Uber-Soft 400gr Speers... they gotta be slower then that to stay together.

One thing to be aware of is that many of these bullets are designed for '.45-70 speeds'; that is about 1300fps MV in a stock, factory loading. Those Marlin Guide Guns are tough, I've loaded 400gr bullets to 1900fps, but I found out the hard way that (some) those bullets are not designed for that velocity.
I hit a nice bear a few years back, with a 400gr Speer, at only 30yds. I had that Speer loaded up to 1900fps. The bullet hit the bear in the spine and flattened it, of course, but I couldn't find anything left! It grenaded!
I had to give it a finishing shot, which was in the neck and also hit the spine.
That shot was fired pointblank, like 7' maybe. Same thing... nothing left of that bullet. The jacket was literally tunred inside out... the fragments that I could find anyway. I suspect that that bullet was only intended to be loaded to 1400fps max', it is very soft. But I dunno, I lost faith in them and haven't used 'em since.

After that experience, I keep any of my 400gr loads to 1650fps MV max'.

I've got absolutely no experience with hard cast bullets, but there are sure to be guys with good info on those. I would not hesitate to try them!
 
420 gr flat nose G/C hard cast, 42 grs of IMR 4198 = 1745 fps. Same bullet and 49 grs Rel. 7 = 1865 fps in my GG. You could probably back either off by a fair bit and still have plenty.
 
The gun is a newer 1895 but also a converted 303

It looks like a 350 FN is the ticket.

Only seen one post with power type and amounts which will do but I was hoping to try a few out.

I have alot of 4198, 3031 power


I appreciate the help. As for the speed not sure I really care if I am pushing 1900fps. Shots I am looking for are 0-100yards maybes 150 if the load and myself with open sights allows it.

Now is there a good place to get these bullets? It seems to be abit tough here in ontario to find them.
 
Snuffy said:
The gun is a newer 1895 but also a converted 303

It looks like a 350 FN is the ticket.

Only seen one post with powder type and amounts which will do but I was hoping to try a few out.

I have alot of 4198, 3031 power


I appreciate the help. As for the speed not sure I really care if I am pushing 1900fps. Shots I am looking for are 0-100yards maybes 150 if the load and myself with open sights allows it.

Now is there a good place to get these bullets? It seems to be abit tough here in ontario to find them.
Click to expand...


I hafta check my load data when I get home, but IIRC H-4198 something like 50-52grs is what I use with the 350gr Hornadys. I kinda think I'm using H-4895 with the 400-405 grainers... I'll let you know what I'm using and my Chrony info'. :)

My memory is a bit dodgy anymore... :redface:

Did you try Wholesale Sports or Cabelas? LeBarons? Ellwood Epps? etc...
 
MTM said:
51.5 Grs 3031 with the 405 Rem. is the accuracy load. With the scope on my gun will print very tiny groups at 100.
Click to expand...

Mine seems to do well with the 405gr Remington or the 400gr Speer and using either IMR 3031 or IMR 4198. I have a scope on mine as well, to compensate for eyesight that isn't quite as sharp as it once was, and to help in load testing. The Weaver pivot mounts allow quick access to the open sights, if & when required.

Marlin1895GS45-70.jpg
 
I used the scope for developing loads. I'm leaveing it off for now, it's taken a while to warm up to the open sights but I'm finding they're just fine for what I use the gun for. I think the low power scope is very handy on these and don't see it as a handicap at all. I just like the feel of the gun without it.
 
Marlin 1895 GG or stronger
53gr IMR 3031
400gr SPEER FP
Compressed load - Crimped
1850 fps

Start 10% low and work your way up
 
OK here's my loads. I'll say it again, I would recommend you get a Chrony, if you do not already have one... or borrow one?

Something else I would suggest, is to take all your brass and trim it to the same length. I trimmed new Remington brass to 2.095", as recommended in Lyman Manual #48. Then as you fire these rounds, from time to time you will have to trim them back.

Make sure to properly flare or bell the case mouths, so that you aren't folding over the case mouth when seating bullets.

I have a Lee Factory Crimp die. It's a great way to crimp the bullet after seating; an extra step but I consider it vital.

As you develop loads keep detailed notes!

All of these were tested in my 18.5" Marlin M1895GS.

350gr Hornady FN:
H4198
46 grs avg vel = 1889fps
47 grs avg vel = 1933fps
48 grs avg vel = 2020fps
49grs avg MV = 2047fps
50grs avg MV = 2091fps
I would not recommend exceeding 2000fps, it's not necessary. I think those loads at 46-47 are all you need.

IMR4064
58grs avg vel = 1907fps
59grs avg vel = 1947fps
60grs avg vel = 1992fps
Note: All these loads had very small deviations in velocity; cases pretty much full.


400gr Speer FN (Aka 'Pancakes'...)
H4895
53.5grs avg vel = 1738fps
54grs avg vel = 1748fps
54.5grs avg vel = 1747fps
55grs avg vel = 1804fps
55.5grs avg vel = 1912fps
56.5grs avg vel = 1930fps
Those loads over 1850fps are teeth rattlers... :eek:

The load I settled on is a 400gr Hawk bullet .035 jacket with 52.5grs H4895 which avg's 1695fps. I believe the 405gr Remington is a great bullet, kept to moderate velocity.

You know I haven't played with the .45-70 for 5 years, been messin' around with other rifles I've acquired, but looking back at these old notes, it makes me want to play around with 'em. I also bought one of the M1895XLR's a couple years ago and really haven't done anything with it.

I really gots to throw together some new loads and test them in both my Marlin .45-70s! :runaway:
 
Well, if your looking to laod the 45-70 hot and looking for bullet that will not disintegrate on you than have a look at the barnes bullets.
Yes they are more money than your jacketed bullets but they mushroom up beautifully from mid to high velocities and they stay intact.
Go get that bear
 
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