45 70 recoil

45-70guide

45-70guide

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How will a 45 70 kick with lever evoloutions compared to a 12gauge,300h&h mag,308win,270win in the marlin guide gun
 
Lever evolutions are not hot loads from my observation. Comparable to an average factory 300 grain.

I've not shot a guide gun, just my XLR so I don't know how effective the porting is, but I would say that they are between 308 win and 300 h&h mag.

Hot 45/70 handloads exceed 300 h&h mag. They're similar to the premium 12g 3" jacketed sabots if you've shot any of those.
 
I find the 300 H&H a sharper hit. The 45-70 is less so. You know how a shotgun is a little like a push? and a High powered rifle is a hit? The 45-70 is no wussy, you know when it ignites ... but I think the 300 win mag or 300 H&H is more felt trauma.
 
I would suggest you get rid of the factory pad. Im putting a limbsaver grind to fit on mine.
 
The jab you get from a 45/70 is not too sharp, but rather like a strong push. Easy to take when shooting from the offhand standing position. The 270, .308, .300 H & H fire a much faster bullet and the recoil is faster. Not necessarily heavier, but faster. The rest of what you feel comes from stock shape, recoil pad thickness, individual recoil sensitivity, weight of the projectile and charge weight and relative speed of the powder and the weight of the rifle itself. Plus with a guide gun, the porting will reduce recoil about 40%, but will increase muzzle blast significantly.
 
I can tell you my 450 marlin evolution 325g@2225fps makes my 300 winmag feel tame. I've since read Marlin has or will be doing away with porting Guide Guns as it has little effect. The measured recoil is about double a 30-06 and it fells like it, would think the 45-70 would not be far behind.
 
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canadaman30 said:
I can tell you my 450 marlin evolution 325g@2225fps makes my 300 winmag feel tame. I've since read Marlin has or will be doing away with porting Guide Guns as it has little effect. The measured recoil is about double a 30-06 and it fells like it, would think the 45-70 would not be far behind.
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45-70 hand loads can exceed factory 450 marlin loads. I've loaded some that I had to pull, I've had a few concussions and they were scrambling my head a bit.
 
I have fired about 150 rounds through my 1895 GS. If you hand load the gun can be brought down to about a 30/30 to shoot.
The leverevolution has a stout recoil. It would compare to a 12 ga.
I have shot a 300 wm ruger # 1 and it was worse.
I am not completely sold on the FTX bullets, I am trying to find a source close to me so that I can hand load them. I thnk if you tame them down a little it would make a good hunting load and still not kick the stuffing out of you.
 
I shoot a Guide Gun:
Handloads with 300g bullets and Trailbooss = recoil of 22 Hornet
Lever Evolution recoil = 30-06, but more of a "push", not as sharp.
Handloads with 405g and case full of 3031 = Get a Limbsaver 'casue it ain't that much fun, about the most recoil I've felt. I think it's still more of a "push" then a hit like the big magnums, but I only shoot 2 or 3 at a time off the bench.
 
My Guide Gun isn't ported. With a straight stock it does like to jump up quite a bit though.
It depends on how you load it as far as recoil is concerned. Factory loads aren't that severe.
 
I wonder if anyone has actually experimented with leverevolution bullets, to see how much, or if, they carry up better at longer ranges and how much difference, compared to the round, or flat bullets we shoot in the 45-70 in tube magazines? I am thinking of someone who has actually zeroed at 100 yards with both type bullets of the same weight, then went back to a longer range and shot them both again. I am not interested in what the advertising says.
My total experience with them has been looking at them in the store.
However, a friend of mine shoots a Sharps type 45-70 in black powder silhouette. He thought he would get one-up on the boys, and load pointed type bullets. So he got a mold that made 500 grain, pointed bullets.
Lo and behold! At 500 metres he used the same sight setting with the 500 grain pointed, as he does with the 500 grain bullet designed to be used in tube magazines!
 
I think that what Bruce is saying is right, i think that momentum of the heavy slugs trumps bullet shape (Sectional density), don't know the scientifics of it but when the bullet is long and heavy, i don't believe that the point makes as much diff.
As to recoil....the 45/70 can be a mouse or a monster it all depends on your handloading and the bullets(weight) you use. It's safe to say that any factory load, pointed or not, is not going to kick anywhere near what heavy loads, that the 45/70 is capable of.
 
I have absolutely no use for the Hornady FTX (leverlution) bullets in my Marlin 1895GS but I am very interested in trying them in my T/C Contender carbine.

Limbsavers are cr*p compared to Kick-Eez recoil pads they are a little harder to work with to get a nice finish but it is definately worth the time...

I install the Magnum model on all of my heavy recoiling rifles.
 
I like the leverevolutions. I cannot say what they do at 100yrds since I have only practiced at 50yrds with mine. I hunt deer with mine, the shot is always 50yrds and under, and at 50yrds the bullets lands right in the bull. I just bought some FTX bullets tonight to reload with.
 
H4831 said:
I wonder if anyone has actually experimented with leverevolution bullets, to see how much, or if, they carry up better at longer ranges and how much difference, compared to the round, or flat bullets we shoot in the 45-70 in tube magazines? I am thinking of someone who has actually zeroed at 100 yards with both type bullets of the same weight, then went back to a longer range and shot them both again. I am not interested in what the advertising says
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I am working with the 325's in my 45-70 right now. I shot a few "work-up" loads at the range last week and find my rifle -22" barreled Marlin 1895- seems to prefer the Flex-tips at about 2100 fps. Next visit to the range I will try the best load at 50, 100, and 200 yards to see if the advertising hype is anywhere near the truth. I really doubt it but I like to try as many new products as I can before condemning them. ;) LoL I will let you know how the 200 yard trajectory looks in a week or two.

BTW, the accuracy from the 325 Flex Tips in my rifle is pretty good - about 2" 3 shot groups at 100 yards using peep sights with my 49 year old eyes :rolleyes: which is about equal to what I can shoot using 405 grain hard-cast bullets.
 
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