45-70 w/ 450gr hard cast. Data?

agilent_one

agilent_one

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Does anybody have any data for loading 450gr hard casts in 45-70. Load will be for a marlin guide gun.

I'm kinda new to the whole "cast boolit" thing:redface:, and the manuals I have on hand have very limited information. Any informative websites I should visit?

Would prefer loads w/ IMR4895 or RL7, because I'm sure I have them on hand - but am open to others.
 
Here is some data from the old Lyman 46th Manual.

My best results have always been with IMR4198 Lyman says Max load of 41.5gns for about 1750 fps.

Also Max
RX-7 48.5gns for appros 1850fps (not same as RL-7)
47gns Max of 3031 for approx 1700

Those loads are for 420gn bullets so you might want to back of a couple more gns.
 
I use 24 - 25gr 2400 with either a 425gr spire point or 460gr flat nose with very good accuracy. My rifle does better with 20:1 tin & lead than with hard cast, and while I've never realy pushed the envelope, I'd be surprised if the 20:1 wouldn't achieve all the velocity you'd want in 45 - 70.

My rifle was far happier with 2400 than 4198, and would hardly digest 4895 - poor ignition and frequent hang fires even with near max listed loads.

Hope this helps.
 
ben hunchak said:
44 grs. of your RL-7 is a pretty good and stiff load in the Marlin.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the info Ben. Any idea as to approx velocity?

These casts are 25RHN, I just want to know how fast I can push them without severe leading. 1700 seems to be about the max, from what I've read.:runaway:
 
grouch said:
I use 24 - 25gr 2400 with either a 425gr spire point or 460gr flat nose with very good accuracy. My rifle does better with 20:1 tin & lead than with hard cast, and while I've never realy pushed the envelope, I'd be surprised if the 20:1 wouldn't achieve all the velocity you'd want in 45 - 70.

My rifle was far happier with 2400 than 4198, and would hardly digest 4895 - poor ignition and frequent hang fires even with near max listed loads.

Hope this helps.
Click to expand...

I would assume 24gns of 2400 does not fill the case to full! 4198 along with a couple other powders of that type need a full case for really good ignition. I have always just used toilet paper :D for wadding to make a slightly compressed load for those loads that don't completely fill the case.
 
senior said:
I would assume 24gns of 2400 does not fill the case to full! 4198 along with a couple other powders of that type need a full case for really good ignition. I have always just used toilet paper :D for wadding to make a slightly compressed load for those loads that don't completely fill the case.
Click to expand...
In my .45-70 light loads using IMR 4227 and a 405gr FNBB cast, for a filler I used to use parts of cotton ball but hs4570 put me on to something that works a lot better. A round foam material used for weather seal type caulking. The beauty is when you shoot, it ends up coming out like a puff of dust. What I have is called Foam Backer rod named Stopdrafts made by the outfit Tago. I think I bought it at Home Depot. I measure the depth to the powder charge with a pencil, minus the seating depth of the bullet and cut the material to fit. Better than cotton material I was using as far as uniformaty is concerned.
It comes in a few diameters and depending on the size, I sometimes have to cut a vertical strip out of it, just to make it a little easier to insert in the case.
 
For what it's worth, you're right, 24 - 25gr 2400 doesn't anywhere near fill a 45 - 70 case. I tried fillers to keep the powder against the primer and found they didn't help. I've used these loads for 20yrs, and my rifle has done very well with them. If the fillers help you, that's great, but they may not.
 
grouch said:
For what it's worth, you're right, 24 - 25gr 2400 doesn't anywhere near fill a 45 - 70 case. I tried fillers to keep the powder against the primer and found they didn't help. I've used these loads for 20yrs, and my rifle has done very well with them. If the fillers help you, that's great, but they may not.
Click to expand...
With the lighter load I've mentioned I did try 20 with filler and 20 without and for me, I did get groups that were a little tighter. Seemed to make a difference.
 
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