I just bought a .454 Casull and was planning to reload the bullets as if they were .45 Long Colt. I bought the .454 Casull brass. Doing a bit of research I find I need a different primer, also I see that I should use .451 projectiles not .452 which is what I mostly have on hand. At least that is what one of my manuals say. Looking for smart advice on how to proceed. Hate to blow up the new Freedom Arms gun first outing!
.454 Casull
- Thread starter rustynut1
- Start date
I load for a magnum Research in 454 Bullet dia in Lee book says .452. You need small rifle primer's I shoot 45 colt in mine with no problems Lead you want to go slow. If you speed it up use platted or jacketed. H110 works good on jacketed I used some Win 231 lead. A guy casted for me. It leaded up the barrel
More research says I need special dies for the .454, that I don't have yet. There is good information on Freedom Arms web site. I thought I could use my .45 Colt dies. Also F/A web site says to use Magnum Pistol primers so this is confusing. It also mentions the small rifle primers that I don't have on hand. They say it is OK to use .451 or .452 so this is good. But for full load rounds they say to use their projectiles. I have no desire to shoot full house .454 rounds, I rarely shoot my .44 Mag and the .454 is more gun than that. I should have the gun this Tuesday, looking forward to that.
I use to shoot a lot of 454 Casull...
.451 is fine for jacketed bullets, .452 for hard cast, preferably gas checked.
I always used small rifle magnum primers, although I have heard of people using small rifle primers with out issues. I've never heard of small pistol primers being used however.
45 LC dies won't work....well specifically the sizing die won't work, but the expanding, seating and crimping dies would work. You need either a 454 Casull sizing die or a 460 S&W sizing die.
.451 is fine for jacketed bullets, .452 for hard cast, preferably gas checked.
I always used small rifle magnum primers, although I have heard of people using small rifle primers with out issues. I've never heard of small pistol primers being used however.
45 LC dies won't work....well specifically the sizing die won't work, but the expanding, seating and crimping dies would work. You need either a 454 Casull sizing die or a 460 S&W sizing die.
- Location
- Somewhere on the Hudson Bay Coast
Okay, you've tweaked my interest. Why can't you resize .454 brass in .45 Colt dies? I've even resized .45 Colt in .45 ACP dies, so the .165" difference in length between the .45 Colt and the .454 shouldn't make much difference. After all, the carbide sizing ring is located at the base of the die, and since the web of the case doesn't resize anyway, the die doesn't necessarily need to make tight contact with the shell holder at the top of the ram's travel. Decapping would have to be done as an individual step with a small primer pin, but that is not an insurmountable problem.
OP
If you are loading to .45 Colt pressures in .454 brass, the choice of primer won't make any difference to the safety of your load. That said, you may or may not find that magnum primers ignite ball powder a bit better. All else being equal, your chronograph will tell you by the uniformity of your velocities.
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Your right, probably depends on the specific brand of die, I know if you try to size a 454 Casull in a Lee 45LC die the 454 brass will top out in the die before going all the way up, others brands of dies may have more room in the die.
- Location
- Somewhere on the Hudson Bay Coast
Fair enough, I thought it might be a brand specific issue. Thanks.
You only need magnum primers if loading magnum charges with powders that are harder to ignite. H110 and W296 (the same thing with two names) is one example of a powder that is harder to ignite and gets the best results from using a hotter and higher pressure Magnum primer.
So if you're loading anything from the .45Colt power range from cowboy soft loads up to full power .45Colt loads in the longer brass you'll find that you're fine with just regular large pistol primers for the "normal" handgun powders.
What you'll need to do because of the extra volume is raise the min and max amounts by about 10% unless you're using powders like Bullseye and Tightgroup and some few others that are known for performing OK with lighter charges. Watch for what feels like inconsistent recoil and sound. I've seen some cowboy action folks that use lower than minimum powders with these and they are hovering on not producing enough pressure to even burn the little that is in there correctly. They are very close to producing squib loads and stuck bullets.
But with the bigger volume cases any loads that are close to the starting loads for .45Colt might just end up being too light for the larger volume in the Casull casing. So approch loads that soft with some caution. If in doubt pull the cylinder and check the bore for a stuck bullet. Or just shoot big enough charges that you don't have this issue.
I would also suggest that cast bullets work better with light charge amounts. Jacketed bullets take more force to engrave the rifling. But plated such as Berrys would be fine since the plating is thinner so they are more like cast.
So if you're loading anything from the .45Colt power range from cowboy soft loads up to full power .45Colt loads in the longer brass you'll find that you're fine with just regular large pistol primers for the "normal" handgun powders.
What you'll need to do because of the extra volume is raise the min and max amounts by about 10% unless you're using powders like Bullseye and Tightgroup and some few others that are known for performing OK with lighter charges. Watch for what feels like inconsistent recoil and sound. I've seen some cowboy action folks that use lower than minimum powders with these and they are hovering on not producing enough pressure to even burn the little that is in there correctly. They are very close to producing squib loads and stuck bullets.
But with the bigger volume cases any loads that are close to the starting loads for .45Colt might just end up being too light for the larger volume in the Casull casing. So approch loads that soft with some caution. If in doubt pull the cylinder and check the bore for a stuck bullet. Or just shoot big enough charges that you don't have this issue.
I would also suggest that cast bullets work better with light charge amounts. Jacketed bullets take more force to engrave the rifling. But plated such as Berrys would be fine since the plating is thinner so they are more like cast.
it's a coincidence that I should come across this posting. I don't reload, but a fellow shooting club member that I was talking to yesterday does. He had the s&w .460, 5'' and was shooting his 454 reloads. It seemed like light loads and there was a bunch of unburned powder all over his bench. He'll figure it out, but i'll still tell him that the primer might be why it's not all burning.
there's an art to reloading, huh? I might get into it in the future. seems pretty cool - crafting and customizing your own bullets. Buddy at the range has been doing it for years and is always trying new types of calibers. He says he enjoys it more than the shooting
there's an art to reloading, huh? I might get into it in the future. seems pretty cool - crafting and customizing your own bullets. Buddy at the range has been doing it for years and is always trying new types of calibers. He says he enjoys it more than the shooting
As luck would have it my only 4 die set is in .45 Colt and made by Lee. I'm looking for some approved .451 or .452 projectiles for the .454 brass for a full load .454 just for sh!ts and giggles I guess. Will shoot 99% .45 Colt.
Thanks everyone. Got the gun today. It's a keeper. Never figured out how to post pictures and too dumb to learn. It is a F/A 83 Model Premier Grade with 7 1/2 inch bbl, normal grips.
I took the big .454 out for a spin this morning. I shot 3 loads of 5 rounds per of hand loaded .45 Colt. Each group was good and three of the five rounds were in the same hole more or less. I'm saying all three shared the same hole not one hole. The other two shots were less than an inch away from the main group. This is me shooting, the butt resting on the table but the bbl. free to wiggle and about 10 yards away. There was no noticeable recoil from the big heavy gun. I am far from a great shot but this is some of my best shooting with a gun of this size.
As a side note I took out a good .22LR target pistol and some various ammo. Expensive ammo for .22LR. I was able to group all the shots within an inch on two brands of ammo, 5 of six shots sharing the same hole. The others were more like 2 inches grouped. I have been looking for good ammo to do this test and now have a half dozen kinds of ammo to play with. The gun liked CCI subsonic, RWS Champion and SK High velocity the best.
I am still getting setup for reloading it for .454. I cannot get small rifle magnum primers so have to live with small rifle regular primers(400 vs. 450 CCI). The magnum is better but the small rifle will work in the summer. I'm going to shoot using 240 grain jacketed Hornady GR XTP MAG #45220 and 2400 powder when shooting .454. I'll load to the minimum to start and work up from there. These projectiles are .452 but the F/A web site says .452 is OK.
As a side note I took out a good .22LR target pistol and some various ammo. Expensive ammo for .22LR. I was able to group all the shots within an inch on two brands of ammo, 5 of six shots sharing the same hole. The others were more like 2 inches grouped. I have been looking for good ammo to do this test and now have a half dozen kinds of ammo to play with. The gun liked CCI subsonic, RWS Champion and SK High velocity the best.
I am still getting setup for reloading it for .454. I cannot get small rifle magnum primers so have to live with small rifle regular primers(400 vs. 450 CCI). The magnum is better but the small rifle will work in the summer. I'm going to shoot using 240 grain jacketed Hornady GR XTP MAG #45220 and 2400 powder when shooting .454. I'll load to the minimum to start and work up from there. These projectiles are .452 but the F/A web site says .452 is OK.
