458 or 300??

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Outdoors905

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hey guys... little help please :) I've just ordered a colt lower and want to try something different than the traditional 223/556
my first was the M&P-15, then followed that up with the new mrr in 11.6

what I'm needing help with is the reasoning of going in one direction vs the other direction. I know I can just grab another upper down the road, but it'll probably take a bit to re-round up the spendies for another...so right now it's one OR the other
I did build up a bushmaster once but that was....Christ, gotta be 25 yrs ago now so the experience has faded

so, if you don't mind:
talk me into, or out of building one over the other
what are some definite "must have" hard-parts you'd chose (mag release/safety etc etc)
barrel/upper or completed upper suggestions

just a LOT of choices out there and it makes it hard to absorb it all ;)

thanx!!!
 
300BLK is cheaper to load for and factory loads are easier to find if you don't handload, it doesn't need any special parts or magazines, is very flexible in it's ability to shoot bullets from 110gr through to 230gr, I have three rifles in 300BLK and love it.
458 is a real cannon so the grins per trigger pull is probably better, but it's more expensive to shoot no matter if you handload or buy factory, needs different magazine followers, different bolt, harder on your rifle and shoulder due to the increased recoil.

If we were in the US and could hunt with an AR I would go with the 458 but here the 300BLK makes more sense to me. The paper doesn't care how much kinetic energy a round has and both will ring a gong way harder than a 223.
 
I haven't really considered much...yet :)
I was considering the 300 because, well it seems to be the going thing these days so ammo should be plentiful
the 458, well cuz its a bit of an oddball load and I haven't seen one local or even mentioned 'til I hit the google and stumbled across it

I was considering a 762 but I've heard it uses a modded 223 bolt and breaking off the tabs??
308 I believe you're getting into a different lower (ar-10??)
I considered 243, but I read a thread or two and consensus is the barrel is a rarity (as in gold bar pricing)...I never check length, but it might fit into an ar mag still
I'm still open to options...something I can readily reload on the Dillon

and ya, i still have a shytload to learn about this lego platform :)

cr5...input catalogued sir. thanx :)

thanx guys!!!
something that won't require mods to the lower as I would like to eventually use it on multiple platforms, including 223
 
I would suggest looking at 450 Bushmaster and rem 30 ar. Both have factory ammo available in canada and use proprietary Stanag pattern mags.

The 458 and 50 beo suffer from a magazine legality issue and the RCMP have effectively limited them to two rounds until someone who has been charged is successful in their defence.
 
300 for reasons mentioned above. Do you reload? If not, no time like the present to start. Even if you have the coin to buy ammo by the crate being able to make ammo tailored to your rifle is worth the bother.
 
very noteworthy points Brian46... the mag cap bs is definitely something I didn't think about until your post :)
I am liking that 450 idea...nice easy case to reload for (if I can find Dillon dies)

redshooter.... just getting my feet wet with it now
bought a xl650 and a crap load of play along toys for it. have done a batch of 45 and now a couple of thousand 9. have the gear for 357 and 223, just waiting on a few thousand 9 cases to come in before switching over (who's hiding all the small pistol primers???? damn!!!)

thanx again for the input all!!
 
I have AR's in .223, .308 and .458, and by far the .458 is the most fun to shoot. Mags capacity is rezlly not a problem, since they use standard AR-15 mags with out any modification, I use 10 shot pistol mags and that gives me a 4 shot capacity. Reloading supplies are plentiful, since it is the same bullet as 45/70. Brass, dies are plentiful, uses .308 shell holder. .458 Socom actually use rifles bullets and not pistol bullets. Commercial ammo is available through Buffalo Bore from Az tech armory. You have a wide selection of bullets from 140gr going 3000fps to 600gr bullets
 
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Curtis264 said:
I have AR's in .223, .308 and .458, and by far the .458 is the most fun to shoot. Mags capacity is rezlly not a problem, since they use standard AR-15 mags with out any modification, I use 10 shoot pistol mags and that gives me a 4 shot capacity. Reloading supplies are plentiful, since it is the same bullet as 45/70. Brass, dies are plentiful, uses .308 shell holder. .458 Socom actually use rifles bullets and not pistol bullets. Commercial ammo is available through Buffalo Bore from Az tech armory. You have a wide selection of bullets from 140gr going 3000fps to 600gr bullets
Click to expand...

Stop it, your post just taught me a couple things I didn't know about 458, sounds like I should build a non restricted conversion for my ACR.
 
Curtis264 said:
I have AR's in .223, .308 and .458, and by far the .458 is the most fun to shoot. Mags capacity is rezlly not a problem, since they use standard AR-15 mags with out any modification, I use 10 shoot pistol mags and that gives me a 4 shot capacity. Reloading supplies are plentiful, since it is the same bullet as 45/70. Brass, dies are plentiful, uses .308 shell holder. .458 Socom actually use rifles bullets and not pistol bullets. Commercial ammo is available through Buffalo Bore from Az tech armory. You have a wide selection of bullets from 140gr going 3000fps to 600gr bullets
Click to expand...

very good information sir, thank you for sharing it :)
ya made my choice hard again tho ;)

maybe i'll just stick with the idea of building one upper in each cal and sharing the lower

cheers
 
Brian46 said:
That is all any review ever is, someone's opinion.

Raises some good points like the conflicting barrel lengths and loads that all claim 3000fps and an OAL that only allows for short low BC bullets for example
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:evil: He takes the bait! I had a good idea of how you'd open, absolutely right too.

The article is really an attack on the idea, instead of giving it a fair assessment in my opinion. The only thing new about this cartridge is the 0.257" bullet, 6/6.5/7mm TCU/Ingram have been used in various shooting sports and are pretty much the same thing, looking for a sweet spot in the case design for a specific purpose, knocking over Rams for the Ingram if I'm not mistaken. What the dude is failing to mention is that any of the above cartridges can drive a bullet of equal/better BC at the same, or higher velocities in a barrel of equal length when compared to a 223 Rem. The real difference is that all of the larger calibers are equal to or heavier than the maximum bullet mass useful in a 223/5.56 rifle.

Since the 300 Blk is pretty close in performance and brass is readily available, why go through the bother for a range only rifle unless reloading is a big part of why you shoot.
 
Curtis264 said:
I have AR's in .223, .308 and .458, and by far the .458 is the most fun to shoot. Mags capacity is rezlly not a problem, since they use standard AR-15 mags with out any modification, I use 10 shoot pistol mags and that gives me a 4 shot capacity. Reloading supplies are plentiful, since it is the same bullet as 45/70. Brass, dies are plentiful, uses .308 shell holder. .458 Socom actually use rifles bullets and not pistol bullets. Commercial ammo is available through Buffalo Bore from Az tech armory. You have a wide selection of bullets from 140gr going 3000fps to 600gr bullets
Click to expand...

Your assertion that 4 rounds of 458 being legal contradicts paper and electronic statements made by the RCMP SFSS on the matter that have been posted and quoted many times in various sections on this site. You do this at entirely your own risk. People have taken that chance on the beowulf that was mentioned in those same statements and paid the price by facing criminal charges when police were involved. Until there is a favorable resolution in court I would caution anyone contemplating on exploring this Grey area as you may end up being the lucky one who gets to face a trial
 
Brian46 said:
Your assertion that 4 rounds of 458 being legal contradicts paper and electronic statements made by the RCMP SFSS on the matter that have been posted and quoted many times in various sections on this site. You do this at entirely your own risk. People have taken that chance on the beowulf that was mentioned in those same statements and paid the price by facing criminal charges when police were involved. Until there is a favorable resolution in court I would caution anyone contemplating on exploring this Grey area as you may end up being the lucky one who gets to face a trial
Click to expand...

Has nothing to do with 2 or 4 rounds of 458, it has totally to do with the mag. A pistol mag is legally allowed to hold 10 rounds of .223, which also hold 4 rounds of 458. A standard AR-15 mag holds five rounds of .223 which also only holds 2 rounds of .458. RCMP stated when rifle was imported the rifle mags that came it with it could not hold more than 5 rounds on .223, which is 2 rounds of .458. The RCMP describe the mag as dual purpose, and can't hold more than 5 rounds of .223. They have never stated that the rifle could not ever have more than 2 rounds at a time. The law covers the mag, not the firearm it is used in
 
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