460 SW no fire

B

budmancan

CGN Regular
Rating - 100%
16   0   0
It is my first time reloading 460 S&W. I tried firing them today and it did not fire.
S&W 460 X frame
41.6 grains of H110 Powder
Winchester Large Rifle primer

Tried to fire and nothing happened. Nice size dimple in primer. Powder in case. tried to fire two but neither fired.

I used the Hornady reloading manual as a reference.

I fired from the same gun 454 Cas with no problems. 34.1 grains of H110 powder, 205 small rifle primer.

Any clues on the cause?

Im thinking its the primer but not sure if large pistol would give a good burn? Reloading guide says to use the rifle primer.

Also can I take apart the unfired cartridges safely?
 
Hornady bullet XTP 240 grain I think. No chance of moisture. Cleaned months prior to reload. I also have a case dryer.

Primers are seated down to just below the flat. they are not seated proud.

Same powder used in both the 460 and 454.
 
I use 39gr under a 240 XTP in .454. If I were to guess I'd say your loads are too light. Pull the bullets, I think you'll find some ugly looking clumps of yellow powder near the bottom.
 
I assume you were at a range - I hope they have a "UXO" bucket for duds. If you chose to pull them I guess a hammer type puller would be safer than collet type with a press.

Pull the bullets on the untouched ones for sure - at least a few - and try firing with primer only - can be done in basement into a (old) pillow etc. or in garage. You'll know right away if primer is too hard or "thick" for your hammer spring. Try some with mag pistol primers also.

This is based on you saying "nothing" happened. If you heard anything like a small crack and the bullets moved in the crimp just a little you'll probably find the clumps as mentioned.
 
There is nothing unsafe about a collet puller. There is also so much volume in a .460 case the bullet could easily stay right where it was. I'm very eager to find out. I strongly recommend the Remington 7.5 for the .454, it's a very energetic primer and helps light big charges of slow powder. Nothing will help a too light load of H110 though.
 
Last edited:
Could be hammer spring not set enough to fire large RIFLE primers.

Smiths have a set screw in grip to adjust force of hammer spring.
 
diopter said:
Could be hammer spring not set enough to fire large RIFLE primers.

Smiths have a set screw in grip to adjust force of hammer spring.
Click to expand...
They're supposed to use rifle primers. 454 takes small rifle.

First thought, Hodgdon reloading specifies large rifle magnums. After that, bad batch of primers. Something in the flash hole. Wet powder. Etc. But I strongly suspect that you need Magnum large rifle primers as it probably has a deep flash hole that needs the high burn to stay hot enough to light the powder.
 
B said:
I use 39gr under a 240 XTP in .454. If I were to guess I'd say your loads are too light. Pull the bullets, I think you'll find some ugly looking clumps of yellow powder near the bottom.
Click to expand...

Yes.

Why are you almost 4.0 grs under the published Starting Load? Starting Loads exist for a reason - don't think that if a Starting Load is "safe" that well under is "safer". H110 in particular is a bad actor much under published Max Loads.
 
Freyr_255 said:
They're supposed to use rifle primers. 454 takes small rifle.

First thought, Hodgdon reloading specifies large rifle magnums. After that, bad batch of primers. Something in the flash hole. Wet powder. Etc. But I strongly suspect that you need Magnum large rifle primers as it probably has a deep flash hole that needs the high burn to stay hot enough to light the powder.
Click to expand...

Derrr, I forgot about that! .460 does take a LR primer. Regardless, if the powder charge is too light nothing will happen. H110 simply does not work with light charges. There are warnings about it for a reason. Load near max and use the hottest primer you can find with a heavy crimp. That is the secret to good loads with H110/296.
 
B said:
Derrr, I forgot about that! .460 does take a LR primer. Regardless, if the powder charge is too light nothing will happen. H110 simply does not work with light charges. There are warnings about it for a reason. Load near max and use the hottest primer you can find with a heavy crimp. That is the secret to good loads with H110/296.
Click to expand...

Personally I use h110 in the 454 so I appreciate this information. I always forget a lot of powders are dangerous or function terribly in light loadings as it's just not something I do.
 
Not sure on the light load info. When I look in the Hornady reload guide I am still on the chart for reload. Yes on the lighter side but still in the range. I was always told to start on the lighter side and work up.
460S&W with a 240 XTP bullet 41 grains goes 1600 fps. max of 49.5 grains at a speed of 1900 fps
454 cas with a 240 XTP bullet 34.1 grains goes 1600 fps. max of 36.9 grains at a speed of 1850 fps

So dont follow the charts?
Pulling the bullets tonight.
 
budmancan said:
Not sure on the light load info. When I look in the Hornady reload guide I am still on the chart for reload. Yes on the lighter side but still in the range. I was always told to start on the lighter side and work up.
460S&W with a 240 XTP bullet 41 grains goes 1600 fps. max of 49.5 grains at a speed of 1900 fps
454 cas with a 240 XTP bullet 34.1 grains goes 1600 fps. max of 36.9 grains at a speed of 1850 fps

So dont follow the charts?
Pulling the bullets tonight.
Click to expand...

That data is lighter than what I have seen from Hodgdon and Freedom Arms (for .454). 41 grains is not far from my .454 load. You didn't do anything wrong following the manual but it clearly didn't work out for you. My only other guess is dud primers and that is very unlikely. You said they were struck hard enough to leave a nice dimple. Did you check the tension screw in your grip? If it's loose it can cause light strikes as mentioned. I'm trying to think of all possibilities not you doubt the powder is to blame.
 
A friend of mine shoots that pistol weekly and is the guru when it comes to knowing this pistol.
He was using H110 all the time in his 460 and 454 loads. His casings were always difficult to extract from the cylinder.
He switched to IMR 4227 and loads 37.2gr using a 250gr 45 long Colt projectiles and the empties come out easily and is very accurate.
He was also having issues with rifle primers as they are harder than pistol primers and weren’t working.
I know the data calls for it but pistol primers and 4227 was the answer for him and he shoots at least 50 rds a week out of it. HTH’s
 
Thank you for the info everybody.
Just pulled the bullet and it looks like a light primer strike as powder was unfired in casing and primer still in one peice.
I will check the tension screw in gun. It had no issues firing the 454 bullet just the 460. Primer strike looks the same on both but I guess not enough to set off the large rifle primer.
Any where I can find the info on what hornady uses (primers) on their bullets from the factory? The gun had no issues firing those bullets?

Thank you everybody
 
Looks like diopter nailed it. You seemed confident in a good strike so I thought powder. Large rifle primers are .027" thick whereas the thickest SR are .025". If you tighten the screw your issues should go away. Assuming the spring isn't worn.
 
budmancan said:
Thank you for the info everybody.
Just pulled the bullet and it looks like a light primer strike as powder was unfired in casing and primer still in one peice.
I will check the tension screw in gun. It had no issues firing the 454 bullet just the 460. Primer strike looks the same on both but I guess not enough to set off the large rifle primer.
Any where I can find the info on what hornady uses (primers) on their bullets from the factory? The gun had no issues firing those bullets?

Thank you everybody
Click to expand...
CCI #350 Large magnum pistol primers. These work for him. I don’t know why they recommend LR primers as the shot cups are harder which causes the light strikes.
 
mac100 said:
CCI #350 Large magnum pistol primers. These work for him. I don’t know why they recommend LR primers as the shot cups are harder which causes the light strikes.
Click to expand...

It’s because the 460Mag reaches pressures as high as rifles.

Also, to the OP’s issue, if the primer strikes look the same I bet it was a seating issue. Ensure you seat all the primers firmly all the way down.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom