7.62 NATO surplus, hot or not
- Thread starter cote_b
- Start date
Based on experience, Canadian NATO ammo is loaded "cooler" than european NATO ammo. We had brits embedded with us in 2008 and our IVI ammo would not cycle their service rifle, causing a bunch of fte/ftf stoppages. Their ammo in our C8 gave a "stronger" recoil. That was with 5.56x45.
Moving to 7.62x51, when noticed similar results. European ammo kicked more out of our C3s than our canadian ammo. While it cycled in our C6 and their equivalent, recoil impulse in our C6 was noticeably higher with their ammo.
On a recent deployement, our unit weapon tech was a gun guy and we has a talk about this subject and he confirmed canadian ammo, while still being within NATO spec, was loaded on the lighter side of the loading chart in order to premature wear&tear of our equipment.
If I had to guess, the South African ammo is probably the hottest load out of the 3 you have.
Moving to 7.62x51, when noticed similar results. European ammo kicked more out of our C3s than our canadian ammo. While it cycled in our C6 and their equivalent, recoil impulse in our C6 was noticeably higher with their ammo.
On a recent deployement, our unit weapon tech was a gun guy and we has a talk about this subject and he confirmed canadian ammo, while still being within NATO spec, was loaded on the lighter side of the loading chart in order to premature wear&tear of our equipment.
If I had to guess, the South African ammo is probably the hottest load out of the 3 you have.
FWIW none of the Hirtenberger ammo we received was NATO marked so it is not known whether it was produced to NATO spec. I doubt South African ammo is made to spec either, but it is possible.
Thanks guys! I figured there shouldn’t be much difference as it should all be within NATO spec.
DT471, very interesting regarding the first hand experience working with the Brits. Surprised our 556 was so light that it wouldn’t cycle their rifles.
DT471, very interesting regarding the first hand experience working with the Brits. Surprised our 556 was so light that it wouldn’t cycle their rifles.
- Location
- Western Manitoba
I bought two purchases of Hirtenberger. Neither has the Nato "+ in a circle" on the headstamp, so I don't think that is NATO spec military ammo.
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I have read many times on this forum that south African surplus and m305/m14 platforms are a recipe for a Kaboom to happen, but do not have any real experience to share
Hirt is hot(rumored to be machine gun ammo) , and I would also agree that the berdan is a little more hot than the boxer, shot about 2 cases of each ,through different m305's and a savage 10tr 24"
Grouped good with savage, 2" , but not with the 305's, 6+"
the 305"s I have for the most part do not like the norinco copper wash ammo, but group good with the pmc 308 bronze or the xm80 , both 147 grn .
2nd gen bcl 102 runs just fine on norinco copper wash surplus
Hirt is hot(rumored to be machine gun ammo) , and I would also agree that the berdan is a little more hot than the boxer, shot about 2 cases of each ,through different m305's and a savage 10tr 24"
Grouped good with savage, 2" , but not with the 305's, 6+"
the 305"s I have for the most part do not like the norinco copper wash ammo, but group good with the pmc 308 bronze or the xm80 , both 147 grn .
2nd gen bcl 102 runs just fine on norinco copper wash surplus
300Spartans
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Canada of course
CBC 1975 surplus is supposed to be very dangerously hot.
Recent or old stuff ?
There was a screw up at the manufacturing facility. That ammo had "REENGESTADA" printed on the boxes. This means it was put together on reclaimed brass. It was actually a pretty decent lot other than somewhere along the process of filling the powder hoppers, pistol powder was dumped in instead and got mixed into a lot.
I bought several cases of it from International out of Montreal. When International did the recall I had two cases from that lot. I sold one to a friend and of course, he had catastrophic failure. Cracked the stock on a new match, offhand rifle and ended up with bits of brass in one eye. The action didn't come apart but the barrel had to be removed to get the bolt out as the brass had flowed all around the bolt face and was even into the locking lug recesses. Good thing it was on a new commercial 98 action.
Ganderite wrote about acquiring the powder from that lot, dumping it all into one large lot and mixing it up, so it was safe to use for reloading.
Incidents like that, especially loaded by contractors for governments are rare,
I have some surplus South African 7.62x51, it is a mix of three different lots. I was able to test several different lots at the time and these three were, for all intents and purposes, identical. They're right up at the top end of the Nato velocity spec.
I also have a couple of different lots of Hirtenberger, one Berdan primed and one Boxer primed. My magnetospeed tells me they're within 50 fps of each other.
I have a mixed bag of IVI 7.62x51. It's all over the place as far as accuracy and velocity goes. I pull the bullets and mix the powder into one lot and put them back together, this keeps it all consistent and reasonably accurate.
I also have some Spanish Cetme surplus. lots of FTF because of decayed primers. Very light recoil but only 127 grain bullets.
The Radway Green surplus 7.62x51 is all at the top of the Nato spec for velocity, very similar to the South African
20 years ago. Pressures over 60,000 psi.
I think I'll bring a chrony next time we're on the range with some 7.62x51 to see where its at now
The Hirtenberger ammo we have had Stg 58 on all packages. It appears to be made for FN FAL use.
The south African tends to shoot a little more softly (and very accurately), at least compared to Hertenberger and chinese spam can 762
I have a rifle that likes to eat the SA ammo - if anyone wants to part with a battlepack let me know.
I have a rifle that likes to eat the SA ammo - if anyone wants to part with a battlepack let me know.
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