7.62 x 45
- Thread starter Mr.Rigpig
- Start date
Nope.
I have exactly ONE round and it's staying right here.
It's not a difficult cartridge to make.
Get the dies, get a trim die, start with Carcano brass from Trade-Ex. Lube the brass, run it into the trim die, saw it off. File-finish and chamfer the case-mouth and load 'em up.
You should be able to run loads about 10% heavier than the 7.62x39. Use the same slugs and same powder.
Hope this helps.
.
I have exactly ONE round and it's staying right here.
It's not a difficult cartridge to make.
Get the dies, get a trim die, start with Carcano brass from Trade-Ex. Lube the brass, run it into the trim die, saw it off. File-finish and chamfer the case-mouth and load 'em up.
You should be able to run loads about 10% heavier than the 7.62x39. Use the same slugs and same powder.
Hope this helps.
.
- Location
- WMU247 near Edmonton
Interesting and educational post, as usual
I always thought the 7.62x45 was a much better round then the x39. I also have been wondering how a necked down version to 6.25mm - .257" or so would do
But without a good source of brass I've never really looked into it.
Easily made from 6.5x52 Carcano or from 6.5x54 Mannlicher-Schoenauer: simply proceed as above.
It CAN be made from .303 Savage (if you can find any) but you have to start by turning off the Rim and then cutting a new Extractor Grove. Need a Lathe for this and the end product has the Web farther back in the case than you may like.
Likewise, you COULD start with .220 Swift brass but this also requires the use of a Lathe.
It all boils down to finding something with the correct .442" head diameter.
.30 Remington LOOKS as if it would work really well, but don't bother. It makes really nice-looking ammo but the stuff is a disaster when it comes time to fire it off. Base diameter is .422, so you only need 10 thou expansion in all directions, given that the case is centralised on firing. Waste of brass: they all split and they don't extract worth spit. I already tried it (for my Carcanos) which is why I bought a load of brass from Anthony!
Trade-Ex has both types of 6.5 brass in stock AND they have 6.5 Jap, another possibility for the 7.62x45 but again you need that Lathe.
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The x45 case is really interesting: straighter than the x39, rather a large amount of internal capacity extra as well. Where the x39 is in the "weak sister" category as compared to the .30-30, the x45 is definitely IN the same class.
(Of course, neither is in the .303 class, so it is safe to dismiss them as the aberrations of twisted minds who do not understand the concept of a RIFLE and the Superior Discipline and Marksmanship of Trained British Soldiers living on a pound of bully-beef and a pound of biscuit a day, being paid 30 shillings a month and all that: Soldiers of the Queen. Dear old Queen Vickie!)
Had a bag in my pocket one day when I went for coffee with my long-time range buddy. The reason for the bag was that it was my comparison bag: 9x19, 9x23, 7.62x25, x39, x45, x54R, .223, 4.85mm, .280/.30, 7.62 NATO, 8x57, '06 and the obvious and necessary Sacred .303. When I brought the bag out, he took a quick look and picked out the x45, asked, "What is this?"
So I told him.
I had thought about necking it to a 7mm and running it in this spare Carcano action I have lying about, but HE wanted to make it into a 6mm. He thought that, necked to a 6mm, it should turn into a really decent little 300-yard Gopher cartridge. Unfortunately, his ticker gave out before we could get the parts together and have a reamer made.
Good to know that we're not the only crazy ones out here.
There is a LOT of possibility in that casing.
.
It CAN be made from .303 Savage (if you can find any) but you have to start by turning off the Rim and then cutting a new Extractor Grove. Need a Lathe for this and the end product has the Web farther back in the case than you may like.
Likewise, you COULD start with .220 Swift brass but this also requires the use of a Lathe.
It all boils down to finding something with the correct .442" head diameter.
.30 Remington LOOKS as if it would work really well, but don't bother. It makes really nice-looking ammo but the stuff is a disaster when it comes time to fire it off. Base diameter is .422, so you only need 10 thou expansion in all directions, given that the case is centralised on firing. Waste of brass: they all split and they don't extract worth spit. I already tried it (for my Carcanos) which is why I bought a load of brass from Anthony!
Trade-Ex has both types of 6.5 brass in stock AND they have 6.5 Jap, another possibility for the 7.62x45 but again you need that Lathe.
....................................................................................................................
The x45 case is really interesting: straighter than the x39, rather a large amount of internal capacity extra as well. Where the x39 is in the "weak sister" category as compared to the .30-30, the x45 is definitely IN the same class.
(Of course, neither is in the .303 class, so it is safe to dismiss them as the aberrations of twisted minds who do not understand the concept of a RIFLE and the Superior Discipline and Marksmanship of Trained British Soldiers living on a pound of bully-beef and a pound of biscuit a day, being paid 30 shillings a month and all that: Soldiers of the Queen. Dear old Queen Vickie!)
Had a bag in my pocket one day when I went for coffee with my long-time range buddy. The reason for the bag was that it was my comparison bag: 9x19, 9x23, 7.62x25, x39, x45, x54R, .223, 4.85mm, .280/.30, 7.62 NATO, 8x57, '06 and the obvious and necessary Sacred .303. When I brought the bag out, he took a quick look and picked out the x45, asked, "What is this?"
So I told him.
I had thought about necking it to a 7mm and running it in this spare Carcano action I have lying about, but HE wanted to make it into a 6mm. He thought that, necked to a 6mm, it should turn into a really decent little 300-yard Gopher cartridge. Unfortunately, his ticker gave out before we could get the parts together and have a reamer made.
Good to know that we're not the only crazy ones out here.
There is a LOT of possibility in that casing.
.
Indeed; someone else has had the same idea. The 7x46 Murray cartridge is based on the Czech 7.62x45 case and offers similar potential to the .280/.30 cartridge.
http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=19936
Something along this line represents the true "sweet spot" for intermediate cartridges to my mind.
maple_leaf_eh
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Well, don't all clamour at once to call me a saviour. I found a supply with a non-sponsor who is selling his father Jose's estate. David Reis runs the website zefarm dot net (maybe it is dot org). He lists Czech surplus 7.62x45 on the site. I bought 10 boxes of 15 last month. EVERY box was from a different lot!
On the brighter side, my favourite reloader who has more spare time than me has volunteered to convert a large supply of .30 Remington cases to 7.62x45. I've volunteered as much Czech surplus steel cased 7.62x39 for bullets and bulk powder. I also have as much .30 Carbine surplus ammo to pull the 110gr bullets for fireforming.
Now a question for the collective wisdom. We can "get by" with a 7.62x39 die left 6mm open. Or, I have seen interweb discussion of cutting X thou' off a .303BR die, and cinching the case at the web with a 10mm pistol die. I've got other things to spend my $$$ on a set of custom dies. What do you guys suggest?
On the brighter side, my favourite reloader who has more spare time than me has volunteered to convert a large supply of .30 Remington cases to 7.62x45. I've volunteered as much Czech surplus steel cased 7.62x39 for bullets and bulk powder. I also have as much .30 Carbine surplus ammo to pull the 110gr bullets for fireforming.
Now a question for the collective wisdom. We can "get by" with a 7.62x39 die left 6mm open. Or, I have seen interweb discussion of cutting X thou' off a .303BR die, and cinching the case at the web with a 10mm pistol die. I've got other things to spend my $$$ on a set of custom dies. What do you guys suggest?
maple_leaf_eh
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Cartridges of the World give the diameters, and they are pretty close. So why is this a bad donor? The web, the head, the body?
RCBS lists the dies in their 55000 section.
Not really Custom, but definitely limited production.
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Thirty Remington cases split in the Carcano action, even though it is a very strong and solid action. Didn't get much of a gas blow-back but the empties definitely were toast.
There is 20 thou difference in base sizes. It is just a BIT too much for base-expansion to handle.
You are better off to start with MS or Carcano brass. That's where all the Carcano and MS brass in North America went, 40 years ago: it ALL disappeared into making 7.62x39 for all those SKSs (and even AKs) that Americans were bringing back from The 'Nam. We ended up with a 30-year drought of Carcano brass because the Commies had eaten it all. That Winchester-Western Carcano brass was lovely to work with, too, but they absolutely would NOT make any more, no matter how many people wrote letters.
So that left CIL as the only maker of anything possible (MS)...... and they went out of business in '68, then IVI refused to make the stuff.
That left Rheinische-Westalische Sprengtoffsfabriken, when you could find a bit of MS.
Do you know how much RWS brass COSTS?????????? WORSE than Norma! And even HARDER to find in those days.
So thank Gawd fer Partizan! We now have Carcano, MS and Jap at REASONABLE PRICES. Any of those, the MS or Carcano in particular, will make really good x45 cases.
Hope this helps.
.
Not really Custom, but definitely limited production.
.........................................................................................................................
Thirty Remington cases split in the Carcano action, even though it is a very strong and solid action. Didn't get much of a gas blow-back but the empties definitely were toast.
There is 20 thou difference in base sizes. It is just a BIT too much for base-expansion to handle.
You are better off to start with MS or Carcano brass. That's where all the Carcano and MS brass in North America went, 40 years ago: it ALL disappeared into making 7.62x39 for all those SKSs (and even AKs) that Americans were bringing back from The 'Nam. We ended up with a 30-year drought of Carcano brass because the Commies had eaten it all. That Winchester-Western Carcano brass was lovely to work with, too, but they absolutely would NOT make any more, no matter how many people wrote letters.
So that left CIL as the only maker of anything possible (MS)...... and they went out of business in '68, then IVI refused to make the stuff.
That left Rheinische-Westalische Sprengtoffsfabriken, when you could find a bit of MS.
Do you know how much RWS brass COSTS?????????? WORSE than Norma! And even HARDER to find in those days.
So thank Gawd fer Partizan! We now have Carcano, MS and Jap at REASONABLE PRICES. Any of those, the MS or Carcano in particular, will make really good x45 cases.
Hope this helps.
.
I have one of those in one of my VZ-52's and "they" say it'll come loose eventually and I'll probably lose it. It hasn't yet, but I won't be surprised if it does.
With the other one, I have made up 7.62X45 brass with both 6.5 Carcano and 6.5 Jap. Both required a reduction in the diameter of both their base and rim, but I found that a file and a drill press could remove it (although I use my mini-lathe). I made one round from 35 Rem, but that was a lathe-only situation. I even did one up from 30-30 (essentially 30 Rem with a rim, but much more common) with 1/4" of thin-wall 7/16" brass over the base. A lot of work.
I size it in a Custom Lee die I bought a few years ago through a Group Buy on GunBoards.
What you can also consider is to buy some surplus 7.62X45 ammo, and reload that. You need to deal with Berdan primers, but that's not impossible. I have a bunch of surplus, and only 3-4 in 10 fires - good for components only.
Essentially there's no easy route - you have to be determined to shoot anything in 7.62X45.
- Location
- Southern Interior
Hi tony as was stated here once ZEFARM is selling it and they arent too pricey for shipping but i found them to be really either busy or laid back. because they are very hard to get ahold of, but if your persistant than it will work, as was also stated. I have about 150 rounds and they are all different and once shot are throw away brass as they crack and split but hey at least you can fire it!!!! and also as was stated (boy i really don't have anything new to offer lol) you can get an insert that locktites in the chamber shortening it up to fire the 7.62X39 I have one of these as well but i have not inserted it as of yet but i got that from Numerich out of the states if you havent been there yet i would suggest you take a look, they ship up to 200 dollars worth of stuff to us canucks and are an incredable source for surplus parts and pieces
