722 bolt question

[Rembo]

here's a question for you experienced 'smiths.
How hard would it be to open up a 722 bolt to take a magnum case and install a 700 magnum extractor?
I have two 722's here in 244 and one could be a 350 Mag......I have 700 bottom metal and trigger for it.

 

[rodagra]

I'm not an experienced 'smith, but as far as I know the only way it can be done is to install a Sako extractor. Brownells sells a jig to set everything up and cut the proper slot in the bolt. There are several local guys that can do the job, and sometimes do it just because they can't get a new extractor from Remington for the old 600/721/722/725 rifles.

The downside of doing this is that you're no longer under Remington's "Three rings of steel" umbrella, so have the same level of protection as most other b.a. rifles.

 

[Rembo]

I'm not an experienced 'smith, but as far as I know the only way it can be done is to install a Sako extractor. Brownells sells a jig to set everything up and cut the proper slot in the bolt. There are several local guys that can do the job, and sometimes do it just because they can't get a new extractor from Remington for the old 600/721/722/725 rifles.

The downside of doing this is that you're no longer under Remington's "Three rings of steel" umbrella, so have the same level of protection as most other b.a. rifles.

I know it can be done with a 700 without doing the Sako conversion,not sure if the 722 bolt is machined the same and I don't want to pull out the extractor just to look. Incidentally, I've done a Sako conversion myself and it's not that difficult, no jigs required and it works fine. Only reason I did it was because the bolt I had was damaged on the nose and the extractor was gone. I don't get into the endless argument about the Sako conversion. It's like the controlled feed vs. push feed debate. It goes nowhere.

I have another option, a long 700 bolt with a mag bolt face. The handle has to come off anyway as it was installed too far rearward and I could shorten it like I did the one in my 22-250. I may go this way if I decide to build a 350 mag out of the 722. A bit more work maybe to shorten a bolt from the rear than modifying the face...unless I just sell both 722's and buy a new M7 CDL in 350 Mag....

 

[Beater]

i have one that has been opened up to 338 LM , and a sako extractor put on. some say its not strong enough after, some say it is. mine has been working fine with 338 LM

 

[tiriaq]

Contact Dennis, "Guntech". He opened a .222 sized face to .308 for me with a rivetted Remington extractor.

 

[Rembo]

Contact Dennis, "Guntech". He opened a .222 sized face to .308 for me with a rivetted Remington extractor.

thanks,

I assume when going from .378(222 etc) to .473(308 etc) milling the eccentric slot for the extractor would be required. I'm almost sure that when going from .473 to .532 the eccentric slot is the same, only the bore has to be opened. At least it looks this way. I expect a 722 is the same....?

tiriaq..the figures in brackets are intended for info only , I know you know the numbers

 

[tiriaq]

I'm sure that he will machine the face to rivetted 700 spec., regardless of what is there now. My bolt was a 700, with damaged nose.

 

[guntech]

I'm sure that he will machine the face to rivetted 700 spec., regardless of what is there now. My bolt was a 700, with damaged nose.

Your was the last one I did....

I have no magnum extractors, I think they are available but if not, then the new style might be.....

It is a finicky job to do.....

My objection to Sako style extractors being installed in 700's is based on seriously compromised safety. When installing Sako extractors in an altered 700 bolt, people do not install all of the Sako extractor system, they leave out the "bolt guide" which really is not a bolt guide, it is designed to keep the extractor from becoming a rearward projectile if a case blows. Most owners do not realize the dangers. If they are aware of them and still want the Sako style installed, that is their choice. If they are not aware of the potential problem, they should be made aware of it so they have an informed choice.

Here is a link discussing the 700 extractor and conversion:
http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php?t=62255

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[Rembo]

just curious about this.....the Weatherby Mark V action has a counterbored barrel and a bolt that fits into the counterbore just like a Rem 700. The Mark V extractor,which is similiar to a Sako sits partially under one bank of lugs(three). Has anyone heard of a Mark V blowing the extractor out?
Has anyone had an HS Precision action apart? How is thier extractor held in place? It looks similiar to a Sako but it sits below the surface of the bolt with the bolt extension uninterrupted. Might be the "ideal" setup?

 

[guntech]

just curious about this.....the Weatherby Mark V action has a counterbored barrel and a bolt that fits into the counterbore just like a Rem 700. The Mark V extractor,which is similiar to a Sako sits partially under one bank of lugs(three). Has anyone heard of a Mark V blowing the extractor out?
Has anyone had an HS Precision action apart? How is thier extractor held in place? It looks similiar to a Sako but it sits below the surface of the bolt with the bolt extension uninterrupted. Might be the "ideal" setup?

HS has their extractor (a claw type) positioned lower on the bolt and totally enclosed in the bolt head. When the bolt is closed the extractor is quite far under the lug race.. It is way better than a Sako style extractor but still not as good as the factory 700...... everyone tries to knock the king of the hill down..

All the action makers have thought out carefully their safety design if a case ruptures. It is when "we" mix and match that safety is compromised.

 

[Rembo]

"everyone tries to knock the king of the hill down.."

That's not what I'm doing at all. I'm one of those who thinks that the 700 extractor is fine "as is". Out of the 50 or 60 Remingtons that I've owned with this extractor design, which includes more than a few 600/660's and Sevens I've had exactly ONE failure and that was caused by a blown case in a 223 that broke the extractor. A new one was installed and I was shooting again.

I'm just pondering the different setups some other rifles are using, like the Mark V and the HS. I'd like to know just for curiosity's sake exactly how that HS extractor is retained in the bolt. Maybe it's like a Sako but the plunger is installed thru a hole in the side of the bolt before the claw is installed in the bolt face....just wondering how it's designed.

 

[guntech]

I'm just pondering the different setups some other rifles are using, like the Mark V and the HS. I'd like to know just for curiosity's sake exactly how that HS extractor is retained in the bolt. Maybe it's like a Sako but the plunger is installed thru a hole in the side of the bolt before the claw is installed in the bolt face....just wondering how it's designed.

I have not had a chance to inspect one...

 

[Leeper]

Rick,
The undercut on the 722 is different than that on the 700. The 700 is a cam shaped undercut which encompasses about 70% of the counterbore while the 722 is a complete and concentric undercut. The point being, the undercut on the 722 may be deep enough that it would not clean up when the boltface was opened to magnum dia. If this was the case, it would probably be necessary to solder a little block into the undercut approx where the ejector is located, prior to machining for the 700 style extractor. I have not done this to a 722.
The Weatherby extractor, if it does get blown out of the bolt, is confined to the receiver ring by the full diameter MkV bolt body. There are no cuts or raceways through which the rogue part can exit.
It would be possible to fashion a Savage 110 type of baffle for the &00 to confine a Sako extractor in the same manner.
By the way, it is possible to fit a modified Savage 110 bolt head to the 700 bolt body. The baffle could also be utilized in the same manner as with the 110.
I've made a bolt head much like that of the Savage but using a Sako extractor. I used EN30B for the head. The bolt body will be made from C1045. This bolt will be used in a 40x receiver when I ever get the time to finish it up. As you know, EN30B is a super alloy as far as strength and wear is concerned but you have to want to cut it! This is largely why I decided not to just make an entire bolt from this material. Regards, Bill.

 

[Rembo]

Bill,

thank,...just the info I was after...

now that's interesting...it looks like Remington actually made manufacturing the 700 bolt a bit harder than manufacturing the 721/722 bolt...not often you see that, it's usually the opposite. The 722 could be done on the lathe while the counter bore is being machined, the 700 would require another milling setup.

good point on the Wtby extractor...I forgot about the lack of lug raceways...

I've seen the Savage bolt head on a Remington discussed before. I've always thought that the Savage 110 extractor was a good one...it was good enough for Winchester to copy it for thier push feed Model 70 in '64...
I guess one would lose the "three rings of steel" with this setup as you'd have to forego the counter bore...

Sounds like quite a project you have going there with the bolt for the 40X....


I made a new bolt body for my 700 in 22-250 a couple years ago....a programming error ate the original in the fluting process.... I made it from EN30B because that was the first piece of scrap I got my hands on I'm sure the solder joint is good and hard now as EN30B hardens when air cooled if heated above about 800F.

re: EN30B...I've been machining this stuff for 20 years or more...it's very common in the down-hole drilling tool industry. A bit tougher than 4340 but not a whole lot harder to machine with good carbide. The toughness of EN30B really show's up when you have to drill and tap it with HSS tools....especially 1/16 and 1/8 NPT.....really hard on taps....lately we've taken to thread milling the 1/8 NPT on the machining center...works really slick.....now try machining some 4330 V Mod....there's some tough stuff...it's starting to replace a lot of Astralloy/EN30B....

 

[Leeper]

The change made on the model 700 extractor seems to havebeen one of those rare cases where a change was made to improve performance. The 700 extractor has significantly more grip on the rim and is an altogether more robust system. I think it's adoption was concurrent with the development of the 740 auto loader but I can't say for sure as I have not researched it.
By the way, the 200 series Sauer rifle uses a similar extractor. The only real difference is in the superb workmanship on the German rifle. Of course there IS a bit of a price difference! Regards, Bill.