A Response to prproulx

richardoldfield

richardoldfield

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"Hi I'm the Colt company. I made a very FEW high quality guns. If you got one you're very lucky, because the rest are CRAP!"

prproulx,

Back in the early 90s I bought the "Holy Grail" of Colt 1911s and a Ace 22 Conversion Unit. Yes, before you ask, the Holy Grail was a beautiful Series 70 Government Model. I have said it before but I will restate that these two were built on a Monday using Friday's parts. I played and paid for two months trying to get this jewel to shine. I traded both away and I did not look back.

I now have four Colt 1911s and I have shot a bunch more. All but one of these have been superb. My four Colts are a nickel Officer, a Lightweight Commander, Series 80 National Match, and a custom 9mm Government. All three of these are flawless. Lastly, I have another problem child; my bad kid is a custom 9mm; it groups very well but it has feeding and aesthetic issues. Hopefully, these issues will soon be fixed and the "mauvais enfant" and I have a long and happy life together.

Regards,

Richard:D


mauvais enfant:
Custom9mmColt1911A1.jpg
 
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Wow a thread just for me!:D
Seriously though, I love 1911's and especially the Colts but out of the twenty or so I've owned only a couple worked without a hitch and they were used so I figured they may have had work done on them.
Here's what Colt needs to do. Make a pre-seventies repro of this 9mm commander, fit and finish like the custom colt in the previous post, and make it 100% reliable. And it should look like this!
colt1950LW1.jpg
 
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Colts

I've had good luck with Colts over the years. That includes a couple of Series 70 Gold Cups and Government Models. I also have now had three different Colt .22 Conversion Units that worked flawlessley on any 1911A-1 frame I tried them on IF you keep the floating chamber free of the waxy build-up that .22 lr's can give 'em. I currently have a Series 70 custom top end sitting on a 1945 mfg USGI frame that runs fine.

I am not a fan of the Series 80 Colts. I've had a couple Deltas that have been okay. A Series 80 Gold Cup .45 that had some feeding issues [seemed to only like RN profile bullets] and a Combat Elite .45 that came with a loose plunger tube right from the factory [easily re-staked however].

The Colts I really prefer are the pre Series 70... gimme a nice 1950's or 1960's commercial production Government or Commander. Or a WWI USGI pistol. Or a WWI vintage Colt Government commercial or military & I'll be happy.

I am thinking if I take the plunge for a spankin' new fancy new-fangled 1911 I'd go for a Kimber.
 
NAA said:
The Colts I really prefer are the pre Series 70... gimme a nice 1950's or 1960's commercial production Government or Commander. Or a WWI USGI pistol. Or a WWI vintage Colt Government commercial or military & I'll be happy.
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Since you are our resident Colt expert, let me ask you this. I've heard, from several sources, that sometime between WWII and the introduction of the Series 70, Colt greatly improved the metallurgical qualities of their pistols. Not sure if they started using better steel, better heat treatment technology or both, but supposedly those newer Colts were considerably stronger than the ones they replaced. Do you happen to know when this change took place?

IMO, the holy grail of Colt 1911s would be one of those pre-series 70 guns with improved post-WWII metallurgy.
 
capp325 said:
Since you are our resident Colt expert, let me ask you this. I've heard, from several sources, that sometime between WWII and the introduction of the Series 70, Colt greatly improved the metallurgical qualities of their pistols. Not sure if they started using better steel, better heat treatment technology or both, but supposedly those newer Colts were considerably stronger than the ones they replaced. Do you happen to know when this change took place?

IMO, the holy grail of Colt 1911s would be one of those pre-series 70 guns with improved post-WWII metallurgy.
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No, I do not know the answer to that specific question... It would be a good one to ask over on 1911Forum.com on the Colt board there, though.
 
NAA said:
No, I do not know the answer to that specific question... It would be a good one to ask over on 1911Forum.com on the Colt board there, though.
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I posted the question over on 1911Forum.com

We'll see what the real Colt experts have to say about it.... ;)
 
capp325 said:
Since you are our resident Colt expert, let me ask you this. I've heard, from several sources, that sometime between WWII and the introduction of the Series 70, Colt greatly improved the metallurgical qualities of their pistols.
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Cap, Got this from a friend!
Colt did change the heat treatment of the pistol's slides, they went from spot heat treatment, to complete slide treatment ("hard slides") in 1946 IIRC.
All manufacturers improved their steel as it became available.
 
I recently handled a brand new Colt Gold Cup target pistol (.45) at a dealer's and I was not impressed. For the almost $1500 sticker price the trigger pull was rough and hard, the slide to frame fit was very loose as was the barrel, and some of the parts and actions felt cheap.

I'm a general fan of Colt, and own some old ones, but for that money I must say I wouldn't buy it. Many people on this site have indicted Colt as being no longer worth the money (paying more just for the name)...and based on this experience, they very well may be right.

IMO, when compared to what $1500 plus tax will buy you in the 1911 world, that gun was just not up to par (regardless of who's name you put on it) - and judging it on it's merits (not just that it's a Colt) I wouldn't have paid more than $800 plus for it at best.

In a world of increasing use of cast vs. forged parts (including frames and slides), and Metal Injection Moulding of parts, polymer vs. metal - by reputable North American 1911 makers and others, you really have to be careful to know if you're getting good value for the money.

I try to stay away from polymer, MIM and castings as much as possible - but cost is the final arbiter. IMO, you have to judge each gun on its own merits, regardless of who made it - if it's good, then it's good, period.
 
THOR74 said:
I recently handled a brand new Colt Gold Cup target pistol (.45) at a dealer's and I was not impressed. For the almost $1500 sticker price the trigger pull was rough and hard, the slide to frame fit was very loose as was the barrel, and some of the parts and actions felt cheap.

I'm a general fan of Colt, and own some old ones, but for that money I must say I wouldn't buy it. Many people on this site have indicted Colt as being no longer worth the money (paying more just for the name)...and based on this experience, they very well may be right.

IMO, when compared to what $1500 plus tax will buy you in the 1911 world, that gun was just not up to par (regardless of who's name you put on it) - and judging it on it's merits (not just that it's a Colt) I wouldn't have paid more than $800 plus for it at best.

In a world of increasing use of cast vs. forged parts (including frames and slides), and Metal Injection Moulding of parts, polymer vs. metal - by reputable North American 1911 makers and others, you really have to be careful to know if you're getting good value for the money.

I try to stay away from polymer, MIM and castings as much as possible - but cost is the final arbiter. IMO, you have to judge each gun on its own merits, regardless of who made it - if it's good, then it's good, period.
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I agree with most of your points but you have to remember that questionable quality of Colt products is hardly a new development. The quality of Colt pistols varied greatly ever since the 70s. I've seen original Series 70 guns (likely made by replacement workers during Colt's numerous labor strikes) that displayed an abysmal level of fit and finish and I've seen recently made Colts that were almost perfect. Then again, I've seen recently made Colts that were as bad as the gun you are describing, if not worse. Out of curiosity, it wasn't at Elwood Epps that you handled that Gold Cup, was it? Perhaps I've seen that very same gun.
 
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