ammo sidetrack

762Russian said:
The 7.62x54mmR is known as The Russian .30-06. It will kill anything you point it at in North America, bar none.
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I have always hated that 7.62x54r is called the Russian .30-06. The round came out a full 15 years before the .30-06 did. If anything the .30-06 should be called the American 7.62x54r.

To the OP. The carbines I find shoot pretty well and are always a blast to shoot (both literally and figuratively).
 
Eaglelord17 said:
I have always hated that 7.62x54r is called the Russian .30-06. The round came out a full 15 years before the .30-06 did. If anything the .30-06 should be called the American 7.62x54r.

To the OP. The carbines I find shoot pretty well and are always a blast to shoot (both literally and figuratively).
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well then perhaps we should call it the Russian 303 or perhaps thas not correct either perhaps the 303 is the British 30-40. It's all hard to keep track of.

Or how about we agree that we should just call it what it is. ;)

but then there was the Dutch 7.7 which was really just a metric version of the British 303
 
woodchopper said:
well then perhaps we should call it the Russian 303 or perhaps thas not correct either perhaps the 303 is the British 30-40. It's all hard to keep track of.

Or how about we agree that we should just call it what it is. ;)

but then there was the Dutch 7.7 which was really just a metric version of the British 303
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Same deal with the Japanese 7.7x58mm rimless, 7.7x56R rimmed and Type 92 Semi-rimmed (7.7×58mm SR) cartridges.

The guy who designed the original .303 British was a well known Swiss military gentleman who also helped design rifles, and the .303 first started out as a rimless cartridge.
 
sail32 said:
The Japanese 7.7 rimmed cartridge is the .303 British cartridge. It was used in the Lewis guns that the Japanese out fitted there aircraft after WW 1 when they allies of the British.

See;
http://www.ammo-one.com/7-7JapaneseCartridges.html

http://www.digplanet.com/wiki/7.7×58mm_Arisaka
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Yes it was a non approved without permission copy of the British .303 round, same deal as some of the machine guns that chambered it, they even copied the M1 Garand rifle, they are Japanese after all, the masters of taking somebodies else's technology and mass producing it!

[h=2]Japanese 7.7 mm ammunition[/h] Cutaways of the five types of ammunition produced in Japan.


Japan produced a number of machine guns that were direct copies of the British Lewis (Japanese Type 92 machine gun) and Vickers machine guns including the ammunition. These were primarily used in Navy aircraft. The 7.7mm cartridge used by the Japanese versions of the British guns is a direct copy of the .303 British (7.7x56R) rimmed cartridge and is distinctly different from the 7.7x58mm Arisaka rimless and 7.7x58mm Type 92 semi-rimmed cartridges used in other Japanese machine guns and rifles.[SUP][22][/SUP]

  • Ball: 174 grains (11.3 g). CuNi jacket with a composite aluminium/lead core. Black primer.
  • A.P.: brass jacket with a steel core. White primer.
  • Tracer: 130 grains (8.4 g). CuNi jacket with a lead core. Red primer.
  • Incendiary: 133 grains (8.6 g). Brass jacket with white phosphorus and lead core. Green primer.
  • H.E.: a Copper jacket with a PETN and lead core. Purple primer.
Note: standard Japanese ball ammunition was very similar to the British Mk 7 cartridge. The two had identical bullet weights and a "tail-heavy" design, as can be seen in the cut-away diagram.
 
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Well, if we are gonna call 'em what they are, then the Russian cartridge should be "Three Lines". It replaced the "Four Line" cartridge used in the Berdans.

Bolsheviks brought in metric in Russia, same as here.

Italy also produced a flat-out COPY of the .303, for the same reasons.
 
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