This is a CGN members compiled information thread, permission to re-publish it outside of CGN is not given.
This is of course in no way meant as legal advice and I suggest that you use this information in order to steer yourself to the areas of books and other hard information that you can invest in for your own records. You may think $400 or $800 for a book is expensive as some of these are out of print collectors items in their own right, however I view such an expense as cheap compared to legal fees they might help you avoid also such a book is an investment as it's our of print
.
The author, Canadian Gun Nutz, and contributors of this thread and posts within do not assume any legal responsibility or guarantee the accuracy of the information therin. This is meant as a guide only and all information and accuracy is up to the individual user to verify when attempting to verify their own firearm as antique. Use this thread as a guide in your search for information and verification of any antique is up to the individual owner.
Now please folks keep on topic, we're trying to compile information on antique firearms identification. Other topics belong in other threads.
Please feel free to share the wealth of knowledge that I know is out there with the only consideration is to keep it pertaining to pre-1897 firearms. To keep this thread readable as it's got the potential to get very long I am reserving this post as the 'index' and will edit it as more information is posted. I will of course give credit to the person who posted the information in this thread as it gets added to this post.
This of course is an evolving topic and will grow as users contribute. It's obviously starting a little light as the information is compiled, just give it time as it grows.
How to tell if it's a legal Canadian antique by Caliber by .41 Colt. Link attached to this sentence so Click Here.
Colt
Want a Colt Factory letter? Click here to apply for one.
1873 Single Action Army & SAA Bisley; The SAA and Bisley were run in the same sequence of serial numbers, which are as follows;
1873 SAA inspectors initials and martial proofs (the ' ' is what I'm using to seperate the mark from the rest of the sentence, these are not found with the markings);
'US' proof signifies it was a US military gun. Also found on 'altered' refurbished US military guns now known by the misnomer 'artillery'.
'OWA' -or- 'a' initals signifies it was inspected by Orville W. Ainsworth. In original condition with original grips should also have OWA cartouche on left side grip.
'RAC' initals signifies it was inspected by Rinaldo A. Carr.
'SEB' initals signifies it was inspected by Stanhope English Blunt.
'HN' initals signifies it was inspected by Henry Nettleton. In original condition with original grips should also have HN cartouche on left side grip.
'D.F.C.' initals signifies it was inspected by David F. Clark.
'K' proof signifies replacment parts. Found on mixed parts and refurbished sub-inspector proofed guns.
Variant models; Unless noted the variants ran within the SAA serial range.
Sheriffs or Storekeeper - "The Sheriffs or Storekeepers model is numbered above serial #73000. It was manufactured with various finishes and chambered in numerous calibers. This model continued after 1898 into the smokeless or modern era. Examples manufactured in the pre-war years are worth approx 20% less. Although faking this model is quite difficult, it has been successfully attempted." - Standard Catalog of Handguns, PG #123
Double Action New Army Navy, aka New Army, New Navy, 1892 DA, 1894 DA, 1896 DA;
New Line 22
New Line 30
New Line 32
New Line 38
New Line 41
MODEL 1849 POCKET REVOLVER - LONDON BARREL ADDRESS
European Proofmarks, Proofhouses, inspector proofings, serial ranges, copies and individual gunsmith design
Austrian Proofmarks
Belgian Proofmarks
Pre-1893 Belgian Liege Proof; This proofmark denotes the gun was manufactured and proofed prior to 1893. It's an E over LG over a star inside of an oval. It looks like this;
Note, this claims to be for rifles but has also been used on pistols.
Post 1893 Belgian Liege proof is the same and just has a crown at the top of the oval. Be careful with the gun and be able to verify the maker and gunsmith production date with post 1893 if attempting to verify as antique. RCMP rarely give factory letters for post 1893 Liege Proof.
Belgian Inspectors marks
Pre 1877 Belgian inspectors marks were designated by a Crown above the inspector lettering, other than known proofs that included a crown. Crown is different style with only 3 lines making body of crown instead of usual 5 (two outside lines and one middle, will source a pic soon).
Post 1877 Belgian inspectors marks were designated by a star above the inspector lettering, other than known proofs that included a star. Star is different style with top point being smaller than typical Belgian proof (seeing if I can source a pic).
British Proofmarks
The following two graphics are provided by Steppenwolf (Appendix D & E), sourced from Howard Blackmore's British Military Firearms 1650 to 1850;
Dutch
Info provided courtesy of DRSlav
here is some info about 9,4 mm dutch service revolver. this will tell you how to tell the difference between the original antique and later English Vickers made gun which is not classed antique in canada.
In 1891 a smaller and lighter revolver designed by Captain F W H Kuhn was adopted for the KNIL and J F J Bar were contracted to supply the parts, to be finished and assembled at the Small Arms Arsenal in the Netherlands. The first guns were finished by the end of 1894 and delivered in 1895. The total production numbered 3754.
In 1909 it was found that more guns were needed, but Bar no longer made arms, and the contract was placed with L Wittich for a further 2200 guns.
In 1919 it was decided to equip the Field Police with M91 revolvers and in 1920 the Colonial Ministry placed an order through the Dutch represntatives of the British arms company, Vickers. In fact it appears that the parts for these guns were not actually made by Vickers, but organised by them - using smaller firms based in and around Birmingham as suppliers. This may be the explanation for the quality of the product (Vickers had a reputation for weapons manufacture) which proved to be unacceptable, and the guns were sent to Fabrique National in Belgium for refinishing, finally reaching the Dutch East Indies in 1922.
The standard model had an overall length of 9" and a barrel length of 4.5"
These guns, numbering 5830 are known as Vickers guns and are identifiable by the crowned W stamp on the right side of the frame in front of the cylinder, and by the shape of the shallow recess (to accomodate the end of the loading gate) above the right grip (on Vickers guns it has a rounded profile).
Some guns that showed an adverse reaction to the introduction of Smokeless powder also had a reinforcing section added to the top of the recoil shield
http://www.coreden-sterling.co.uk/page10.html
French Proofmarks
French Model 1892 Serial Range - Courtesy drslav, find more info in French model 1892 8mm revolver all you need to know.
Year Serial number Director/Controller initials
S1892 F00001 P L
S1894 F38000 M L
S1894 F42000 M B
S1897 F99000 M B
S1897 G00001 J B
S1900 G47000 L B
S1903 G99000 L B
S1903 H00001 L B
S1907 H31500 V C
S1912 H45000 C C
S1915 H75000 C C
S1921 I9000 S B
S1922 L15000 S B
S1924 L45000 S B
Theorical Serial Numbers (from manufacture documents)
Year Highest Smallest
1892 F 5000 Fl
1893 F 30000 F 5001
1894 F 60534 F 30001
1895 F 81734 F 60535
1896 F 98823 F 81735
1897 G 28937 F 98824
1898 G 43043 G 28938
1899 G 56865 G 43044
1900 G 76303 G 56866
Production of model 1892 revolver till 1900(source Dubessy)
Year Quantities
1892 5000
1893 25000
1894 30534
1895 21200
1896 17089
1897 30114
1898 14106
1899 13822
1900 14438
Total 176303
German Proofmarks
Note; When the preliminary proofmark and the German viewmark 'Untersuchung' appear together it signifies a black powder testing and examination upon completion of the firearm.
Note; The other markings that can be found instead of the Stahl Mantel Geschoss "St m G" marking are "K m G" for Kupfer-mantel Geschoss (copper jacketed bullet) and "Bl G" for Blei Geschoss (lead bullet). The 2.67 GBP signifies the powder charge used in the proof, in this case it means 2.67 grams of Gewehr Blättchen Pulver (military flake powder).
Vorrat Proofmark. Firearms built prior to the change in German proof law weren't proofmarked, this marking signifies that this firearm was manufactured prior to 1891 when the proofmark law came into effect. - Provided by vagrantviking.
This proofmark is distinguished from the English view marking mostly in that the Crown is the German Imperial style and staight lined where the English View is a rounded crown. The "V" is also a different style with the Vorrat having a wider left side than right.
Swiss revolver variants.
Infor provided courtesy of DrSlav
From the shipping book of Waffenfabrik Bern
Years and serials of the military 1882 Swiss revolver variants;
1888 1411-1900
1889 1901-2100
1890 2101-2600
1891 2601-2900
1892 2901-3687
1893 3688-3887 /4001-4100
1894 3888-4000 /4101-4400
1895 4401-5500
1896 5501-6894
1897 6895-7508
Remington
1875 Single Action
Manufactured from circa 1874 to 1886, antique by date of manufacture. Two seperate productions were done with two seperate serial ranges.
1st production; Sn. 1 - 13000, can be distingushed by small pinched front sight, and no safety notch on the hammer.
2nd production; Sn. 1 - 1837, can be distinguished by tall blade front sight and safety notch on hammer.
1890 New Model Single Action Army
Manufactured from circa 1891 to 1894, antique by date of manufacture. Can be distinguished from 1875 Single Action by the 1890 Single Action Army not having the distinctive web under the ejector rod. Approx 2000 manufactured in entire production run.
Entire original production run made in 44-40. Other caliber chambering is a conversion.
Top of barrel marking; REMINGTON ARMS CO. ILION, N.Y.
.41 Double Derringer
With the Double Derringer you must pay attention to the placement and exactly how the markings are written. Some copies exist that are very convincing and the only way you can tell is the barrel marking are written differently, this can include capital letters, commas, and periods that are out of place.
First Model; Antique by date of manufacture. Made from 1865 - 1867 and serial range from 1 - 2141.
Marked on right side of ribbing between barrels. 3 issues done during run;
1st issue - Has no extractor, side rib marked: MANUFACTURED BY E. REMINGTON & SONS. ILION. N.Y
2nd issue - Has no extractor, side rib marke: E. REMINGTON & SONS. ILION, N.Y.
3rd issue - First model produced with extractor, side rib marked: E. REMINGTON & SONS. ILION, N.Y. -or- REMINGTONS ILION N.Y. U.S.A
Second Model; Antique by date of manufacture. Made from 1868 - 1887.
Marked on top of barrel ribbing with two line address;
E. REMINGTON & SONS, ILION, N.Y
ELLIOT'S PATENT DEC. 12TH 1865
-or-
E. REMINGTON & SONS, ILION, N.Y.
ELLIOT S PATENT DEC. 12TH 1865
Rolling Block Pistol
Manufactured from circa 1866 to 1868, antique by date of manufacture.
Approx 6500 were made for the Navy, serial range 1 - 6500.
Smith and Wesson
Want a Roy Jinks S&W Factory letter? Click here for the request form. Courtesy of the Smith and Wesson Collectors Association.
Model 2 Tip Up
Manufactured from circa 1861 to 1874, antique by date of manufacture.
Caliber .32rf, six round capacity.
Approx 77155 manufactured.
First 3000 manufactured had two pins for the top strap, after that production went to three pins for the top strap.
Model 3 single action
Manufactured from circa 1870 to 1915, will be antique by serial range and/or features of different sub models.
All S&W NM # 3s are antique by age - Provided by Dingus.
Schofield are antique by date of manufacture, including models 1, 2 & 3. **FRT printouts required here if someone can provide them**
US marking on bottom of grip denotes service in the US military. Appears on toe of first models, moved to heel for early second models up to about serial 6000 then back to toe on subsequent production.
1st model; Inspectors marks of "L" and "P" on various parts, grips have inspectors cartouche of "JFEC" or "SBL" on left grip.
2nd model; Inspectors marks of "P" with either "E", "C", or "W". Right grip either plain or marked "CW" and left either "JRJ" with date, "CW" with date or "DAL 1877".
Illustration of difference between 1st and 2nd model latch.
Volcanic Lever Action Pistol
Predecessor of lever action rifles, this pistol used Rocket Ball ammunition that had all of the components built into the bullet and was a caseless round. A drawback of the design is that it had no extractor to remove faulty ammunition. Loaded from the front and cycled with a lever under the trigger that also serves as trigger guard.
Manufactured from circa 1854 to 1855, antique by date of manufacture.
2 available models.
Model 1; .31 caliber Rocket Ball, 7 round capacity with 4" barrel. Approx 1208 manufactured.
Model 2; .41 caliber Rocket Ball, 10 round capacity with 8" barrel. Under 500 manufactured.
Markings; Smith & Wesson, Cast Steel Patented, Norwich, CT.
Licensed foreign contracts
Webley
MKI and MKII are antique by date of manufacture. **FRT printouts required here if someone can provide them**
MK I*; This was a modification of the Mark I. The firing pin hole tended to burn out so the frame was modified to accept a replaceable hardened recoil shield. This continued on all further models.
MK I**; This modification was done to old stocks of Mark I’s and II’s. Tey fitted a 4 inch Mark IV barrel, a Mark V cylinder plus the new type cylinder cam and lever as used on the Mark IV. This upgrade was done to accommodate the extra power of the new cordite round. The left hand side of the frame was drilled and tapped to accept the cam.
MK II* & MK II**; The * was added when the hammer was changed to that of a Mark IV after October 1899. For the Mark II** see Mark I**, the same modifications were done to both Marks.
MKIII - Is not antique by date of manufacture like the MKI & MKII and will require serial number verification. The serial range seems to be up to 5000.
The CFC, gave me a cut off number of 5000 but than only applied to the military model. -Provided by Bearhunter
Markings;
Being a British based company the Webley was marked with British Proofmarks. Please see the British proofmark section for further identification.
Webley and Sons used a winged mini ball (hollow base) Webley and Scott used a winged solid base bullet. The hollow based bullet if present would denote a pre Webley and Scott manufacture and pre 1898 status. - Provided by Mooncoon
Webley and Sons company stamp. Below is one of several company stamps for Webley and Sons. Important to note the hollow base to the winged bullet. Webley & Scott used a solid base winged bullet (and probably others) sigificants is that all guns with the winged mini ball are pre 1898 and the Webley and Sons joined became Webley and Scott prior to 1898 (I forget the year but in the mid 1890s) - Provided by Mooncoon
The following comes from the War Department's "Instructions to Armourers, 1897" .... specifically Appendix I thereof, which sets out the various approved abbreviations for marking small arms: - Provided by GrantR
Severn ........................................................ SEV.
Shropshire .................................................. SH.
Shropshire and Staffordshire ........................ S. & S.
Sligo..............................................................So.
Somerset, North .......................................... N. ST.
Somerset, West ........................................... W ST.
South Wales and Severn .............................. S.W.S.
Staffordshire................................................. STF.
Suffolk ......................................................... Sic.
Surrey .......................................................... SR.
Sussex........................................................... Sx.
Sutherland ..................................................... STL.
Tay ............................................................... TAY.
Tees .............................................................. Ts.
Thames and Medway ..................................... T. & M.
Tipperary ....................................................... TIP.
Tower Hamlets .............................................. T.H.
Tyne .............................................................. TYNE.
Tynemouth ..................................................... Tarn.
Warwickshire ................................................ WK.
Waterford ..................................................... WD.
Westmoreland and Cumberland ..................... W. & C.
Wicklow ....................................................... Ww.
Wiltshire ....................................................... WES.
Worcestershire ............................................. W E.
Worcestershire and Warwickshire ................. W. & W.
Yorkshire ..................................................... YK.
Yorkshire, East Riding ................................... E. RID.
Yorkshire, North Riding ................................ N. RID.
Yorkshire, West Riding ................................. W. RID
This is of course in no way meant as legal advice and I suggest that you use this information in order to steer yourself to the areas of books and other hard information that you can invest in for your own records. You may think $400 or $800 for a book is expensive as some of these are out of print collectors items in their own right, however I view such an expense as cheap compared to legal fees they might help you avoid also such a book is an investment as it's our of print
.The author, Canadian Gun Nutz, and contributors of this thread and posts within do not assume any legal responsibility or guarantee the accuracy of the information therin. This is meant as a guide only and all information and accuracy is up to the individual user to verify when attempting to verify their own firearm as antique. Use this thread as a guide in your search for information and verification of any antique is up to the individual owner.
Now please folks keep on topic, we're trying to compile information on antique firearms identification. Other topics belong in other threads.
Please feel free to share the wealth of knowledge that I know is out there with the only consideration is to keep it pertaining to pre-1897 firearms. To keep this thread readable as it's got the potential to get very long I am reserving this post as the 'index' and will edit it as more information is posted. I will of course give credit to the person who posted the information in this thread as it gets added to this post.
This of course is an evolving topic and will grow as users contribute. It's obviously starting a little light as the information is compiled, just give it time as it grows.
How to tell if it's a legal Canadian antique by Caliber by .41 Colt. Link attached to this sentence so Click Here.
Colt
Want a Colt Factory letter? Click here to apply for one.
1873 Single Action Army & SAA Bisley; The SAA and Bisley were run in the same sequence of serial numbers, which are as follows;
| Year | Serial Number Range | Year | Serial Number Range |
| 1873 | 1-199 | 1886 | 117000-118999 |
| 1874 | 200-14999 | 1887 | 119000-124999 |
| 1875 | 15000-21999 | 1888 | 125000-127999 |
| 1876 | 22000-32999 | 1889 | 128000-129999 |
| 1877 | 33000-40999 | 1890 | 130000-135999 |
| 1878 | 41000-48999 | 1891 | 136000-143999 |
| 1879 | 49000-52999 | 1892 | 144000-148999 |
| 1880 | 53000-61999 | 1893 | 149000-153999 |
| 1881 | 62000-72999 | 1894 | 154000-158999 |
| 1882 | 73000-84999 | 1895 | 159000-162999 |
| 1883 | 85000-101999 | 1896 | 163000-167999 |
| 1884 | 102000-113999 | 1897 | 168000-174999 |
| 1885 | 114000-116999 |
'US' proof signifies it was a US military gun. Also found on 'altered' refurbished US military guns now known by the misnomer 'artillery'.
'OWA' -or- 'a' initals signifies it was inspected by Orville W. Ainsworth. In original condition with original grips should also have OWA cartouche on left side grip.
'RAC' initals signifies it was inspected by Rinaldo A. Carr.
'SEB' initals signifies it was inspected by Stanhope English Blunt.
'HN' initals signifies it was inspected by Henry Nettleton. In original condition with original grips should also have HN cartouche on left side grip.
'D.F.C.' initals signifies it was inspected by David F. Clark.
'K' proof signifies replacment parts. Found on mixed parts and refurbished sub-inspector proofed guns.
Variant models; Unless noted the variants ran within the SAA serial range.
Sheriffs or Storekeeper - "The Sheriffs or Storekeepers model is numbered above serial #73000. It was manufactured with various finishes and chambered in numerous calibers. This model continued after 1898 into the smokeless or modern era. Examples manufactured in the pre-war years are worth approx 20% less. Although faking this model is quite difficult, it has been successfully attempted." - Standard Catalog of Handguns, PG #123
Double Action New Army Navy, aka New Army, New Navy, 1892 DA, 1894 DA, 1896 DA;
| Year | Serial Number Range | Year | Serial Number Range |
| 1892 | 1-9999 | 1895 | 15100-67999 |
| 1893 | 10000-11299 | 1896 | 68000-76999 |
| 1894 | 11300-15099 | 1897 | 77000-91199 |
New Line 22
| Year | Serial Number Range |
| 1873 | 1-4499 |
| 1874 | 4500-8999 |
| 1875 | 9000-12999 |
| 1876 | 13000-42999 |
| 1877 | 43000-55343 |
New Line 30
| Year | Serial Number Range |
| 1874 | 1-1499 |
| 1875 | 1500-9199 |
| 1876 | 9200-10946 |
New Line 32
| Year | Serial Number Range | Year | Serial Number Range |
| 1873 | 1-2099 | 1880 | 16000-16999 |
| 1874 | 2100-8799 | 1881 | 17000-17999 |
| 1875 | 8800-9999 | 1882 | 18000-18999 |
| 1876 | 10000-12999 | 1883 | 19000-19999 |
| 1877 | 13000-13999 | 1884 | 20000-22000 |
| 1878 | 14000-14999 | ||
| 1879 | 15000-15999 |
New Line 38
| Year | Serial Number Range | Year | Serial Number Range |
| 1874 | 1-499 | 1878 | 7000-8999 |
| 1875 | 500-5799 | 1879 | 9000-10999 |
| 1876 | 5800-5999 | 1880 | 11000-12516 |
| 1877 | 6000-6999 |
New Line 41
| Year | Serial Number Range | Year | Serial Number Range |
| 1874 | 1-999 | 1878 | 9000-9999 |
| 1875 | 1000-3199 | 1879 | 10000-10072 |
| 1876 | 3200-6999 | ||
| 1877 | 7000-8999 |
MODEL 1849 POCKET REVOLVER - LONDON BARREL ADDRESS
| Year | Serial Number Range | Year | Serial Number Range |
| 1853 | 1 - 999 | 1854 | 1000 - 4999 |
| 1855 | 5000 - 8999 | 1856 | 9000 - 11000 |
European Proofmarks, Proofhouses, inspector proofings, serial ranges, copies and individual gunsmith design
Austrian Proofmarks
Belgian Proofmarks
Pre-1893 Belgian Liege Proof; This proofmark denotes the gun was manufactured and proofed prior to 1893. It's an E over LG over a star inside of an oval. It looks like this;
Note, this claims to be for rifles but has also been used on pistols.
Post 1893 Belgian Liege proof is the same and just has a crown at the top of the oval. Be careful with the gun and be able to verify the maker and gunsmith production date with post 1893 if attempting to verify as antique. RCMP rarely give factory letters for post 1893 Liege Proof.
Belgian Inspectors marks
Pre 1877 Belgian inspectors marks were designated by a Crown above the inspector lettering, other than known proofs that included a crown. Crown is different style with only 3 lines making body of crown instead of usual 5 (two outside lines and one middle, will source a pic soon).
Post 1877 Belgian inspectors marks were designated by a star above the inspector lettering, other than known proofs that included a star. Star is different style with top point being smaller than typical Belgian proof (seeing if I can source a pic).
British Proofmarks
The following two graphics are provided by Steppenwolf (Appendix D & E), sourced from Howard Blackmore's British Military Firearms 1650 to 1850;
Dutch
Info provided courtesy of DRSlav
here is some info about 9,4 mm dutch service revolver. this will tell you how to tell the difference between the original antique and later English Vickers made gun which is not classed antique in canada.
In 1891 a smaller and lighter revolver designed by Captain F W H Kuhn was adopted for the KNIL and J F J Bar were contracted to supply the parts, to be finished and assembled at the Small Arms Arsenal in the Netherlands. The first guns were finished by the end of 1894 and delivered in 1895. The total production numbered 3754.
In 1909 it was found that more guns were needed, but Bar no longer made arms, and the contract was placed with L Wittich for a further 2200 guns.
In 1919 it was decided to equip the Field Police with M91 revolvers and in 1920 the Colonial Ministry placed an order through the Dutch represntatives of the British arms company, Vickers. In fact it appears that the parts for these guns were not actually made by Vickers, but organised by them - using smaller firms based in and around Birmingham as suppliers. This may be the explanation for the quality of the product (Vickers had a reputation for weapons manufacture) which proved to be unacceptable, and the guns were sent to Fabrique National in Belgium for refinishing, finally reaching the Dutch East Indies in 1922.
The standard model had an overall length of 9" and a barrel length of 4.5"
These guns, numbering 5830 are known as Vickers guns and are identifiable by the crowned W stamp on the right side of the frame in front of the cylinder, and by the shape of the shallow recess (to accomodate the end of the loading gate) above the right grip (on Vickers guns it has a rounded profile).
Some guns that showed an adverse reaction to the introduction of Smokeless powder also had a reinforcing section added to the top of the recoil shield
http://www.coreden-sterling.co.uk/page10.html
French Proofmarks
French Model 1892 Serial Range - Courtesy drslav, find more info in French model 1892 8mm revolver all you need to know.
Year Serial number Director/Controller initials
S1892 F00001 P L
S1894 F38000 M L
S1894 F42000 M B
S1897 F99000 M B
S1897 G00001 J B
S1900 G47000 L B
S1903 G99000 L B
S1903 H00001 L B
S1907 H31500 V C
S1912 H45000 C C
S1915 H75000 C C
S1921 I9000 S B
S1922 L15000 S B
S1924 L45000 S B
Theorical Serial Numbers (from manufacture documents)
Year Highest Smallest
1892 F 5000 Fl
1893 F 30000 F 5001
1894 F 60534 F 30001
1895 F 81734 F 60535
1896 F 98823 F 81735
1897 G 28937 F 98824
1898 G 43043 G 28938
1899 G 56865 G 43044
1900 G 76303 G 56866
Production of model 1892 revolver till 1900(source Dubessy)
Year Quantities
1892 5000
1893 25000
1894 30534
1895 21200
1896 17089
1897 30114
1898 14106
1899 13822
1900 14438
Total 176303
German Proofmarks
Note; When the preliminary proofmark and the German viewmark 'Untersuchung' appear together it signifies a black powder testing and examination upon completion of the firearm.
Note; The other markings that can be found instead of the Stahl Mantel Geschoss "St m G" marking are "K m G" for Kupfer-mantel Geschoss (copper jacketed bullet) and "Bl G" for Blei Geschoss (lead bullet). The 2.67 GBP signifies the powder charge used in the proof, in this case it means 2.67 grams of Gewehr Blättchen Pulver (military flake powder).
Vorrat Proofmark. Firearms built prior to the change in German proof law weren't proofmarked, this marking signifies that this firearm was manufactured prior to 1891 when the proofmark law came into effect. - Provided by vagrantviking.
This proofmark is distinguished from the English view marking mostly in that the Crown is the German Imperial style and staight lined where the English View is a rounded crown. The "V" is also a different style with the Vorrat having a wider left side than right.
Swiss revolver variants.
Infor provided courtesy of DrSlav
From the shipping book of Waffenfabrik Bern
Years and serials of the military 1882 Swiss revolver variants;
1888 1411-1900
1889 1901-2100
1890 2101-2600
1891 2601-2900
1892 2901-3687
1893 3688-3887 /4001-4100
1894 3888-4000 /4101-4400
1895 4401-5500
1896 5501-6894
1897 6895-7508
Remington
1875 Single Action
Manufactured from circa 1874 to 1886, antique by date of manufacture. Two seperate productions were done with two seperate serial ranges.
1st production; Sn. 1 - 13000, can be distingushed by small pinched front sight, and no safety notch on the hammer.
2nd production; Sn. 1 - 1837, can be distinguished by tall blade front sight and safety notch on hammer.
1890 New Model Single Action Army
Manufactured from circa 1891 to 1894, antique by date of manufacture. Can be distinguished from 1875 Single Action by the 1890 Single Action Army not having the distinctive web under the ejector rod. Approx 2000 manufactured in entire production run.
Entire original production run made in 44-40. Other caliber chambering is a conversion.
Top of barrel marking; REMINGTON ARMS CO. ILION, N.Y.
.41 Double Derringer
With the Double Derringer you must pay attention to the placement and exactly how the markings are written. Some copies exist that are very convincing and the only way you can tell is the barrel marking are written differently, this can include capital letters, commas, and periods that are out of place.
First Model; Antique by date of manufacture. Made from 1865 - 1867 and serial range from 1 - 2141.
Marked on right side of ribbing between barrels. 3 issues done during run;
1st issue - Has no extractor, side rib marked: MANUFACTURED BY E. REMINGTON & SONS. ILION. N.Y
2nd issue - Has no extractor, side rib marke: E. REMINGTON & SONS. ILION, N.Y.
3rd issue - First model produced with extractor, side rib marked: E. REMINGTON & SONS. ILION, N.Y. -or- REMINGTONS ILION N.Y. U.S.A
Second Model; Antique by date of manufacture. Made from 1868 - 1887.
Marked on top of barrel ribbing with two line address;
E. REMINGTON & SONS, ILION, N.Y
ELLIOT'S PATENT DEC. 12TH 1865
-or-
E. REMINGTON & SONS, ILION, N.Y.
ELLIOT S PATENT DEC. 12TH 1865
Rolling Block Pistol
Manufactured from circa 1866 to 1868, antique by date of manufacture.
Approx 6500 were made for the Navy, serial range 1 - 6500.
Smith and Wesson
Want a Roy Jinks S&W Factory letter? Click here for the request form. Courtesy of the Smith and Wesson Collectors Association.
Model 2 Tip Up
Manufactured from circa 1861 to 1874, antique by date of manufacture.
Caliber .32rf, six round capacity.
Approx 77155 manufactured.
First 3000 manufactured had two pins for the top strap, after that production went to three pins for the top strap.
Model 3 single action
Manufactured from circa 1870 to 1915, will be antique by serial range and/or features of different sub models.
All S&W NM # 3s are antique by age - Provided by Dingus.
Schofield are antique by date of manufacture, including models 1, 2 & 3. **FRT printouts required here if someone can provide them**
US marking on bottom of grip denotes service in the US military. Appears on toe of first models, moved to heel for early second models up to about serial 6000 then back to toe on subsequent production.
1st model; Inspectors marks of "L" and "P" on various parts, grips have inspectors cartouche of "JFEC" or "SBL" on left grip.
2nd model; Inspectors marks of "P" with either "E", "C", or "W". Right grip either plain or marked "CW" and left either "JRJ" with date, "CW" with date or "DAL 1877".
Illustration of difference between 1st and 2nd model latch.
Volcanic Lever Action Pistol
Predecessor of lever action rifles, this pistol used Rocket Ball ammunition that had all of the components built into the bullet and was a caseless round. A drawback of the design is that it had no extractor to remove faulty ammunition. Loaded from the front and cycled with a lever under the trigger that also serves as trigger guard.
Manufactured from circa 1854 to 1855, antique by date of manufacture.
2 available models.
Model 1; .31 caliber Rocket Ball, 7 round capacity with 4" barrel. Approx 1208 manufactured.
Model 2; .41 caliber Rocket Ball, 10 round capacity with 8" barrel. Under 500 manufactured.
Markings; Smith & Wesson, Cast Steel Patented, Norwich, CT.
Licensed foreign contracts
Webley
MKI and MKII are antique by date of manufacture. **FRT printouts required here if someone can provide them**
MK I*; This was a modification of the Mark I. The firing pin hole tended to burn out so the frame was modified to accept a replaceable hardened recoil shield. This continued on all further models.
MK I**; This modification was done to old stocks of Mark I’s and II’s. Tey fitted a 4 inch Mark IV barrel, a Mark V cylinder plus the new type cylinder cam and lever as used on the Mark IV. This upgrade was done to accommodate the extra power of the new cordite round. The left hand side of the frame was drilled and tapped to accept the cam.
MK II* & MK II**; The * was added when the hammer was changed to that of a Mark IV after October 1899. For the Mark II** see Mark I**, the same modifications were done to both Marks.
MKIII - Is not antique by date of manufacture like the MKI & MKII and will require serial number verification. The serial range seems to be up to 5000.
The CFC, gave me a cut off number of 5000 but than only applied to the military model. -Provided by Bearhunter
Markings;
Being a British based company the Webley was marked with British Proofmarks. Please see the British proofmark section for further identification.
Webley and Sons used a winged mini ball (hollow base) Webley and Scott used a winged solid base bullet. The hollow based bullet if present would denote a pre Webley and Scott manufacture and pre 1898 status. - Provided by Mooncoon
Webley and Sons company stamp. Below is one of several company stamps for Webley and Sons. Important to note the hollow base to the winged bullet. Webley & Scott used a solid base winged bullet (and probably others) sigificants is that all guns with the winged mini ball are pre 1898 and the Webley and Sons joined became Webley and Scott prior to 1898 (I forget the year but in the mid 1890s) - Provided by Mooncoon
The following comes from the War Department's "Instructions to Armourers, 1897" .... specifically Appendix I thereof, which sets out the various approved abbreviations for marking small arms: - Provided by GrantR
Severn ........................................................ SEV.
Shropshire .................................................. SH.
Shropshire and Staffordshire ........................ S. & S.
Sligo..............................................................So.
Somerset, North .......................................... N. ST.
Somerset, West ........................................... W ST.
South Wales and Severn .............................. S.W.S.
Staffordshire................................................. STF.
Suffolk ......................................................... Sic.
Surrey .......................................................... SR.
Sussex........................................................... Sx.
Sutherland ..................................................... STL.
Tay ............................................................... TAY.
Tees .............................................................. Ts.
Thames and Medway ..................................... T. & M.
Tipperary ....................................................... TIP.
Tower Hamlets .............................................. T.H.
Tyne .............................................................. TYNE.
Tynemouth ..................................................... Tarn.
Warwickshire ................................................ WK.
Waterford ..................................................... WD.
Westmoreland and Cumberland ..................... W. & C.
Wicklow ....................................................... Ww.
Wiltshire ....................................................... WES.
Worcestershire ............................................. W E.
Worcestershire and Warwickshire ................. W. & W.
Yorkshire ..................................................... YK.
Yorkshire, East Riding ................................... E. RID.
Yorkshire, North Riding ................................ N. RID.
Yorkshire, West Riding ................................. W. RID
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